No jab, no play campaign launched to ban unvaccinated kids from childcare centres and preschools

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CHILDCARE centres should have the right to ban unvaccinated kids from childcare centres and preschools under a proposed "no jab, no play" policy.


The Sunday Telegraph and The Daily Telegraph are today launching a campaign to stop the rise in the number of children succumbing to preventable diseases because parents are failing to have them fully immunised.

Although only 1.5 per cent of parents are "vaccine refusers" or conscientious objectors, many parents are forgetful, leaving areas of NSW with vaccination rates below 85 per cent – despite the inarguable scientific proof that the vaccination program has saved thousands of lives and eradicated diseases that crippled children just a generation ago, including polio.

Despite effective vaccines, Australia has been unable to eradicate diseases such as whooping cough because some parents do not immunise, leaving small babies and children with cancer and other immune-compromising conditions vulnerable.

Nine local areas were recently identified by the National Health Performance Authority as being "at risk" of outbreaks of preventable and potentially deadly diseases such as measles and chicken pox, with vaccination rates as low as, or below, 85 per cent. A high rate of immunisation is defined as 95 per cent.

Written By: Jane Hansen
continue to source article at news.com.au

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  1. It is rather strange that parents went nuts at the idea of a non-infectious HIV+ child at a school, but are happy to allow children carrying other diseases, that are highly infectious.

    The parents who don’t vaccinate are counting on other parents to vaccinate. Their kids are safe, both from possible side effects and from the disease if everyone else vaccinates. It is time to stop them getting away with that selfish, parasitic free ride.

    This pressure is good. It is not as Stalinist as mandatory vaccination. It allows for non-vaccinate schools where idiots can kill off their kids without hurting others.

    • In reply to #1 by Roedy:

      idiots can kill off their kids without hurting others.

      That’s not what happens. Take pertussis. The children that die are the babies that are to young to be immunised. In that case idiots that don’t vaccinate kill off everybody’s kids.

      Michael

    • In reply to #2 by tyga:

      I wasn’t immunized, and I turned out just fine.

      You turned out lucky. Anti-vaxers seem to want to return the world to endemic polio, smallpox, diptheria, meningitis, tetanus etc. And they do not understand that it is not a choice which affects only their own child. An unvaccinated British child turned out to be the cause of the New York 2009 mumps outbreak (3,500 cases; one in fifteen will suffer some degree of lifelong complications).

      The current UK measles outbreak in South Wales is another example with (probably) one death so far. There were three deaths in the Dublin measles outbreak.

      Not vaccinating your child is socially irresponsible, if not outright immoral. You are thereby putting at risk people who are too young to be vaccinated (babies), people who cannot be vaccinated (yet) for some other reason such as medical condition like undergoing chemotherapy (these people are exceptionally vulnerable), older children nearing the time when a booster jab is due; even older children for whom the vaccine may simply have worn off, and the small but random number of people for whom a particular vaccine simply does not work as well as hoped.

      Frankly, every developed country should exclude unvacccinated kids from schools, unless there are good medical (not woo) grounds for granting an exemption. We’d all be healthier as a result and healthcare costs would be lower.

    • So what, means very little other than you’re a parasite benefiting from the vaccination efforts of others? Half the reason to get vaccinated is for a disease that by the time you get the jab won’t kill you just other people like younger siblings, relatives or members of the close community. A community that now includes everyone in the world due to air travel.

      Good for you, I hope you selfish behaviour only kills the ones closes to you.

      In reply to #2 by tyga:

      I wasn’t immunized, and I turned out just fine.

  2. Tyga…..good for you, but that’s not the point. Lower vaccination rates mean children are at risk. Some parents today are unaware of the level of childhood mortality dues to infectious diseases in centuries past. Take a stroll through a 19th century graveyard and you’ll see what I mean. Medical science has put those days behind us, thankfully.

    • In reply to #3 by zeerust2000:

      Tyga…..good for you, but that’s not the point. Lower vaccination rates mean children are at risk. Some parents today are unaware of the level of childhood mortality dues to infectious diseases in centuries past. Take a stroll through a 19th century graveyard and you’ll see what I mean. Medical…

      Natural Selection?

      • *In reply to #4 Tyga. Natural Selection?
        I am old enough to have experienced the measles outbreaks before MMR. As with other families, my sister and I caught measles, and yes I survived, albeit with scarred corneas. My sister didn’t, and she was not the only one in the area. I suppose you call that natural selection.
        For me, natural selection involves the ability of a species to adapt and survive. That is what our species have done in developing vaccinations. Be thankful that you are protected by people around you being vaccinated. And please stay away from anyone who may be immunocompromised.

      • In reply to #4 by tyga:

        In reply to #3 by zeerust2000:

        Tyga…..good for you, but that’s not the point. Lower vaccination rates mean children are at risk. Some parents today are unaware of the level of childhood mortality dues to infectious diseases in centuries past. Take a stroll through a 19th century graveyard and…

        Natural Selection?

        Indeed, natural selection furnished us with big enough brains to adapt to predicable future events. The idea is to use it to avoid death. Same with seat belts, pre-filght checking aircraft etc. Are you suggesting we should only used our immune systems to deal with health emergencies? Why bother with doctors, hospitals, watching your diet just keep stuffing those burgers in natural selection will take care of it all.

    • In reply to #3 by zeerust2000:

      Tyga…..good for you, but that’s not the point. Lower vaccination rates mean children are at risk. Some parents today are unaware of the level of childhood mortality dues to infectious diseases in centuries past. Take a stroll through a 19th century graveyard and you’ll see what I mean. Medical…

      Excellent point. herd immunity is key and it is no good trying to squeeze into the 2-3% unvaccinated because when everyone has the same fool idea you get a situation like Swansea.

      Vaccination should be compulsory. It is not a matter for parental choice because their judgements are not made on medical knowledge or acces to the latest research papers it is almost entirely predicated on the utter shite they read in irresponsible scare mongering newspapers with a reading age of 9.

    • In reply to #5 by zeerust2000:

      Tyga……I’m not sure what you mean by “natural selection?”.

      Well that was MY point. I was not vaccinated and I survived quite fine.

      I find it kind of curious how on a website hosted by the worlds leading evolutionary biologist, there appears to be a failure to appreciate natural evolution.

      BTW, I’m not suggesting that we don’t utilize science and modern medicine, I was only wanting to illustrate my point, FWIW.

      • In reply to #6 by tyga:

        Good point tyga…except you missed the fact that because those around you were most probably all immunised, you were not exposed to the debilitating and possibly fatal diseases under discussion.

        Natural selection occurs within the context of the surrounding, continually shifting, environment.

        In reply to #5 by zeerust2000:

        Tyga……I’m not sure what you mean by “natural selection?”.

        Well that was MY point. I was not vaccinated and I survived quite fine.

        I find it kind of curious how on a website hosted by the worlds leading evolutionary biologist, there appears to be a failure to app…

  3. It seems we’re using literally any policy other than making vaccination compulsory. Singling out children for their parents’ mistakes because you don’t have the political guts to legally force their hand will have suboptimal psychological results.

    • In reply to #9 by Jos Gibbons:

      It seems we’re using literally any policy other than making vaccination compulsory. Singling out children for their parents’ mistakes because you don’t have the political guts to legally force their hand will have suboptimal psychological results.

      I disagree. I think it makes exactly the right point. Besides having your child turned away will be hugely hurtful to a parent. It may then even get through to libertarian parents, even if it doesn’t get through to libertarians.

  4. tyga….2….I take it you’re a lot younger than me. I remember the fear of polio in school when I was a lad. Nearly every class had a kid who’d been severely handicapped by polio, and we were all terrified. I remember the cosmic relief I felt as a seven year old when that needle went into my arm. You survived partly through luck, but mostly because most of the other kids were vaccinated…parasitic on their parents responsible decisions.

    Evolution…you don’t have a bloody clue what you’re talking about. If more people didn’t vaccinate, you’d quickly see “evolution” go into rapid reverse. People who make assertions like you did, are invariably asserting their moral superiority over the rest of us,

  5. The story that father told was so very sad. In the light of this story and the measles outbreak in Wales, I say to Merryl Dorrie and all the anti-vax nutcases out there in Australia, and in particular to the author of that appalling book “Melanie’s Marvelous Measles” (yeah…measles is good for you)………..well, words fail. Polite words anyway. Although I can think of quite a few very impolite ones.

  6. Excluding kids from play areas is good gesture politics but bad science. Germs do not have the wit to identify “no go” areas, in fact they are probably mostly Individualist/Liberal/Anarchists.
    It is also simplistic to brand vaccine refusniks as anti-social cretins – though many quite probably are. The media serves up scare stories, governments support (and/or instigate) them and both these institutions have a track record of bad faith and lying. Add in that Pharmaceutical companies have marketing policies based on profit rather than the health of the human race and the picture becomes increasingly blurred. Add some incompetence and bad science and you get a situation where a lifelong vaccine supporter such as myself, takes time out to reflect on all these vested interest groups stridently screaming their stern orthodoxy. Critical thinking suggests the pro-vaccine argument is correct but critical thinking also calls for an appreciation of why there is an increasing questioning of its efficacy. My surmise for what it is worth is that there are instances of adverse even fatal effects but this is a tiny percentage and acceptable in societal terms but unacceptable to the individuals involved.

  7. Don’t ban children, just vaccinate them. We are never going to eradicate diseases by employing “market forces” on irrational agents. What is needed is an all-out, total war on these pathogens.

  8. The only issue I have with this is whether children who cannot receive vaccines for medical reasons will be excluded from play. One of the strong arguments for herd immunization is to protect those in our society who have legitimate medical reasons for not vaccinating, and it seems unfair to lump these kids in with the vaccine refusers. (Of course, it’s also unfair to kids of vaccine refusers, because it’s their parents’ choice, not theirs.)

    • In reply to #22 by karen.sieradski:

      The only issue I have with this is whether children who cannot receive vaccines for medical reasons will be excluded from play. One of the strong arguments for herd immunization is to protect those in our society who have legitimate medical reasons for not vaccinating, and it seems unfair to lump th…

      I live in Australia, it would be very unlikely that children in this situation would not receive an exemption. I assume it would run like this, ‘if you do not have a medical certificate….’

      • Since the rules are set up by thinking people for the very people that karen is discussing I find you comment hard to believe. I hope you’re wrong.

        In reply to #29 by Reckless Monkey:

        In reply to #22 by karen.sieradski:

  9. NSW Health Minister Jillian Skinner said the government had no plans to toughen laws. “Additional measures could be considered in future to maximise rates of vaccination in children, however the NSW government has no current plans to legislate compulsory immunisation,” she said.

    Why, what are you waiting for?

    • In reply to #24 by Peter Grant:

      Why, what are you w…

      Easy 1.5% per cent of parents are conscientious objectors meaning your political party will probably lose around .75% of the electorate. That could cause someone to lose their seat.

      Instead you appoint a special committee that knows what is expected and you get the opposition to agree with the findings that way it can be a whole of parliament decision and not directly effect either side.

      • In reply to #25 by ozkrenske:

        Easy 1.5% per cent of parents are conscientious objectors meaning your political party will probably lose around .75% of the electorate. That could cause someone to lose their seat.

        Not sure I follow how those percentages work (is this a form of sarcasm? please explain), but assuming they do, wouldn’t it still be worth sacrificing a political career to push through important legislation like this? Gun-control is a good Australian example.

  10. Can anyone give a single good reason why vaccination should not be compulsory? I think it might be here; my son recently got some jabs, and no one asked me or his mother anything, it was just done.

    Edit: A little googling revealed that at least some vaccines are compulsory here in norway

  11. In reply to #34 by alaskansee:

    Since the rules are set up by thinking people for the very people that karen is discussing I find you comment hard to believe. I hope you’re wrong.

    In reply to #29 by Reckless Monkey:

    I think you failed to spot his double negative.

  12. One of the issues perhaps is the lack of choice in regards to the vaccine offered — parents can not chose to deliver the vaccinations individually, but rather, only in 3′s (e.g. DTAP). This is for the benefit of the drug companies producing vaccines, rather then the health of the individual child receiving the vaccine. I think providing more choice over the manner in which the vaccinations can be received would be very helpful. It is difficult as a parent to see your child suffer for a week after getting shots (though of course it would be far worse to see them suffer for a lifetime!) I would be interested in thoughts on this.

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