Help With Being More Outward Towards Atheism

37


Discussion by: yoyoguy4

I just recently found this site as I've been reading more on Dawkins and I thought this would be a nice place to start becoming more involved with the community. But I still have one burning question I'd like to openly ask the fellow viewers: are you, and how are you, open with atheism in your day to day life?

Let me explain.

I grew up a Christian like many of you, also like most I grew up in a very religous family. I discarded god from my early high school years and I was perfectly fine explaining my views to friends and other peers, yet I tried not to be too outgoing as to possibly start an arguement with them. My Intro to Physics teacher and my Biology teacher really helped me understand why I am the Athiest I am today. And that's how I became so heavily involved in science like I am now, in my final year of high school. And when I say, "discarded god", I didn't mean to throw him around like some sort of fad. To me I can't see god being riddled with mystery yet we can understand things that are infinitely complex such as quantum mechanics. But I'm not here to start any debate on that by any means.

Through my highschool career I have played the part of a christian to my family; They're just so involved with the belief of god I know it would bring up some unspoken barrier between us. I'm more or less afraid of the initial reaction from my parents and immediate family to have brought up my disbelief in Christianity. So my question is, how does one go about bringing this up to ones family? I'd like to think they'd be level-headed enough to have an intelligent-cool-conversation but it seems as though it may not be the case given that they are against me donating blood at a "younger age" as they believe its all about profit and sitting in warehouses and such. I have a very ignorant Step-Father and I can't see this going down smooothly with him at all. Back to the O.P. for those of you that have read this far (thank you!) how did/would you handle such a situation? 

37 COMMENTS

  1. First things first, there is nothing wrong with sitting back and playing the part. I wouldn’t say go as far as to lie about your faith or lack-thereof, but there is no need to rock the boat, especially with very devout family members whose religious faith may well be stronger than their desire to have a good relationship with their offspring.

    That said, when family members are that devout, some conflicts can be unavoidable in that your family members instigate the issue. The best way to deal with this is to be prepared, know the arguments, and know their religion better than they do. On a personal level, try to gain their respect in other ways so that they can’t mistake your lack of faith as an act of rebellion, be a good model citizen, do your chores and some more on top and make an effort to pay your way and get a job if you don’t already. All in all, make sure you are the ‘better man’ in any faith-based confrontation, that is the only way they will begin to respect your lack of faith, by respecting you.

  2. Where I live, Victoria, BC Canada, I think you are presumed atheist or nominal Christian unless you state otherwise. Creationists are rare, pretty well just the JWs. In Alabama, they might kill you for admitting you are atheist. So just how careful you have to be depends on where you live, much the way how careful you have to be about admitting you are gay or have leftist politics.

  3. You could try this site, you may find others in a similar situation to talk to: http://recoveringfromreligion.org/

    I am afraid I can not be a lot of help other than that as I have been a life long atheist, despite having a christian mother. I was lucky in that my family accepted my views and did not try to change them. All I can really say to you is to consider how much animosity there is likley to be from your family and do you want to risk losing them. Would it be possible to be more open about your atheism to your friends but not mention it at home.

    Some thiests will talk things through coolly but often the only way to find out is to try, so you would have to be prepared for the worst and, judging by what you say about your step-father, that is likely. Is there a member of your family you are particularly close to, perhaps a one-on-one chat with that person may be a start.

    Best of luck, I hope you find a solution.

  4. My advice to coming out to family is:

    1. make sure they meet your friends first before you tell them. You want to dispel wild imaginations.
    2. come out to siblings before parents.
    3. reassure them you are exactly the same person they have known all along. Nothing has changed. You are simply revealing more about yourself.
    4. You are adamant in your views. Your parents are simply backward and wrong and ignorant. There is no way you will embrace error just to please them. They have been lied to all their lives about atheists.

    Parents love their kids. It will be a battle between love and hanging on to their ignorance. If all goes well they will drop the ignorance, but don’t hold your breath. If they are JWs, they and the family will disown you. There is extreme social pressure on them to do this.

  5. You have to consider the worst case scenario first. So depending on where you live what would you do if you were either kicked out of home or life became unbearable living there. This is working on the assumption that life is not unbearable now living as a atheist.

    If you cannot afford University for example I wouldn’t push too hard as doing so may impact on your ability to get an education. When the time comes you could go about it a couple of ways.

    1) Explain you have concerns and list them, Have a browse around the site you’ll find plenty of ammo. -This may have the impact of acclimatising them to the idea you have doubts before you slam them with ‘I’m an Atheist!’. The other benefit here is you are open to changing your mind if they can give you good reasons (they won’t be able to).
    2) Just stop attending church and give reasons based on high moral principles. ‘I find I cannot reconcile this or that aspect of church with a loving God’. – again letting them down gently and put the onus on them to provide good reasons for you believing.

    You can spend the intervening time doing some research and getting your facts straight be ready for anything they throw at you.

  6. Perhaps a subtle response might be effective with your family. Whenever anything patently ridiculous comes up from the religious camp, you could just say thoughtfully, “it makes you think/wonder doesn’t it?” Sowing the seed of disbelief could be all that it takes to alerting them to your increasing doubts.

  7. If you think it’s a big deal for your family I suppose you should be cautious, especially if you are dependent on them at the moment. But other than that, it’s probably not such a big deal as you fear. People are usually too concerned with their own issues to be upset about something like that. For me it was never a problem anyway though I guess maybe it depends where you live etc. I’m open about it if the matter comes up and have been since I was a teenager but I don’t go about trumpeting my atheism or wearing ‘A’ badges or anything like that. If you don’t make a big deal of it I find other people don’t either. My family are Catholics but as you may know many Catholics don’t take Catholicism too seriously when necessary/convenient so it was fine! I hope I’m right in thinking it won’t be as difficult as you fear – foreseeing is usually worse than seeing as someone (George Eliot?) said. Best wishes.

  8. Welcome to the site, I hope you find it useful and/or stimulating. I am considerably older than you and at a much different station in my life. I don’t hide my skepticism nor do I shy away from questioning. Pretty much everyone who knows me gets it. But, time and place, circumstances, respect, and yes, even family and friend’s sensibilities play into the mix.

    Any advice I could offer would revolve around me, circa 1986! And, I think the world has changed so much and you are your own person with your own circumstance, so my advice would be outdated and archaic. I will say this: be yourself. You owe it to yourself to accept yourself. Always learn and listen and think and remember, life is work. I teach kids your age and offer ALL of them the same advice. I don’t know if it is useless or worth something. It probably varies.

    Anyhow, welcome, I hope you enjoy it here.

  9. Wow, thank you to all who have replied thus far! I already feel like some senior member or something. So many different points of view, I’m probably going to end up blending it all together. I do have to agree, different times and places will yield different results that may or may not be contrary to ones personal experiences. More of it is family upbringing but that’s brought upon a social norm in certain places (at least in my views).
    This amount of support, even being only 8 or so comments, there is a lot of detail and thoughtfulness in each one and I’m very appreciative of the support. To answer some questions (to give a slightly better understanding), I’m very socially mature for my age (and slightly pretentious and condescending sounding as I type this…). I have a job, one of which I was manager/lead shift as well as a key-holder to the actual store. Pretty unheard of for a teenager. I’ve also avoided many “common” teenage mistakes in the social world. Not sure if that helps much but I wanted to address a few questions.
    Hopefully I can go about life being more open about my religious views, I’m going to try to go about it more subtly. I’d hate to see myself down the road as one of those inevitable in-your-face “radical” atheists that I’m sure many of you are familiar with; which gives us as a while a bad look. Yet in the same respect the same could be said about most radicalists in religion.
    P.S. I had this great quote but I can’t remember it word per word and I don’t want to ruin its integrity

    • In reply to #10 by yoyoguy4:

      Wow, thank you to all who have replied thus far!…
      I’d hate to see myself down the road as one of those inevitable in-your-face “radical” atheists..

      PS: ‘imaginary, meaningful, anonymous verse’

      I’ve never encountered a radical atheist, but anyway…

      You hold down a responsible job and your friends know about your beliefs. You’re frightened to tell your parents and won’t get tattooed.

      PS:They fuck you up, your mum and dad.
      They may not mean to, but they do.
      They fill you with the faults they had
      And add some extra, just for you.

      But they were fucked up in their turn
      By fools in old-style hats and coats,
      Who half the time were soppy-stern
      And half at one another’s throats.

      Man hands on misery to man.
      It deepens like a coastal shelf.
      Get out as early as you can,
      And don’t have any kids yourself.

  10. how did/would you handle such a situation?
    I’m probably going to end up blending it all together.

    In that case blend my advice into the mix as well.
    I think you underestimate yourself and your family. Be forthright and school them at every opportunity. I’m certain you will find that they’re all very appreciative to learn that their cherished beliefs are merely superstitious delusions. I think you owe them that much.

    • I’m not sure I would try “schooling them” as you suggest. I don’t want them to feel as though I’m pressuring them out of their religious beliefs. I’d rather have them know and keep it at that. I don’t feel a need to dissuade someone from their beliefs. However, if they wish to intellectually inquire and discuss I would have a more aggressive approach. I hope I’m not misunderstanding you. They aren’t the most reasonable or level-headed people out there so I know they would not appreciate something like that.
      In reply to #11 by Len Walsh:

      how did/would you handle such a situation?
      I’m probably going to end up blending it all together.

      In that case blend my advice into the mix as well.
      I think you underestimate yourself and your family. Be forthright and school them at every opportunity. I’m certain you will find that they’re all ver…

      • In reply to #12 by yoyoguy4:

        I’m not sure I would try “schooling them” as you suggest. I don’t want them to feel as though I’m pressuring them out of their religious beliefs. I’d rather have them know and keep it at that. I don’t feel a need to dissuade someone from their beliefs.
        …They aren’t the most reasonable or level-headed people out there so I know they would not appreciate something like that….

        At your age it is common to think you’re brighter than those around you, and to underestimate the stability of others. But if you want to be more open about your atheism you’ll need to find the courage to announce it.

  11. Hi, you now what your family is like…. and you also know how you feel personly about about “belief”. You don’t need to come here for help, you have all the answers already.

    You will believe what you believe, no matter what anyone says… and you will do your best not to upset family at the same time. You do not need to alienate yourself from family by having futile conversations that you know in advance will not go down well, so why have them at all, it can only lead to “problems”.

  12. I’m more or less afraid of the initial reaction from my parents and immediate family to have brought up my disbelief in Christianity. So my question is, how does one go about bringing this up to ones family?

    First you must overcome your fear. Others suggest you don’t need to confront your family yet. I agree with them, but that doesn’t answer your primary question. You have written asking us for our advice about coming out as an atheist. All you need is courage. Your family’s beliefs are their own affair. You don’t have to convert or become aggressive with them in any way. Be truthful for a change and stop pretending is my considered advice.

    If you lack the courage to out yourself verbally, obtain some posters to decorate your room with. Decorate your school bag with atheist decals. Cover your car or pushbike with atheist slogans. If local laws permit you to do so, consider body tattoos declaring your atheism. You really don’t have to mention it to your step-dad at all. He’ll notice eventually.

    • In reply to #15 by Len Walsh:

      I’m more or less afraid of the initial reaction from my parents and immediate family to have brought up my disbelief in Christianity. So my question is, how does one go about bringing this up to ones family?

      First you must overcome your fear. Others suggest you don’t need to confront your family ye…

      Tattoos?? The parents would definitely smell a rat by that stage. :-)

    • In reply to #15 by Len Walsh:

      I’m more or less afraid of the initial reaction from my parents and immediate family to have brought up my disbelief in Christianity. So my question is, how does one go about bringing this up to ones family?

      First you must overcome your fear. Others suggest you don’t need to confront your family ye…

      I get it! I must be a bit slow on the uptake. That was hilarious!

  13. I just played the role until I was old enough to leave home. It would have broken my mothers heart to tell her. It is easy to be a nonbeliever and keep it to yourself. Why is your belief anyone’s business but your own?

    • In reply to #18 by Nash33:

      I just played the role until I was old enough to leave home. It would have broken my mothers heart to tell her. It is easy to be a nonbeliever and keep it to yourself. Why is your belief anyone’s business but your own?

      Respectfully Nash, he’s taken the trouble to write asking us how to break this to his family. His friends know and he’s a few years older than the 14 year old who asked a similar question to Richard on a newer thread. Roedy and Katy Cordeth are busy arguing as to whether or not she should get tattooed, and her parents know of her atheism already. This bloke is older, studying science and feeling his own sense of autonomy at last. He doesn’t mention his sexuality, being irrelevant, but what if he’s also gay? Should he keep that from them too, until a better time, in case he changes his mind?

      It seems to me he wants to be honest with his folks and some recommend waiting. I don’t.

      • In reply to #19 by Len Walsh:

        In reply to #18 by Nash33:

        I just played the role until I was old enough to leave home. It would have broken my mothers heart to tell her. It is easy to be a nonbeliever and keep it to yourself. Why is your belief anyone’s business but your own?

        Respectfully Nash, he’s taken the trouble to write a…

        I think your insights are required on that other thread as well.

        • In reply to #21 by Nitya:

          In reply to #19 by Len Walsh:

          I think your insights are required on that other thread as well.

          Haha, you’re too kind Nitya, but thanks a lot.

          Interesting to me that this thread is an original where the OP seems sincere and prepared to participate in the ensuing discussion. That’s unusual these days, for starters. The other original thread is discussing a similar theme, except that Richard and the young girl being discussed… ahhh.. No, I think I’ll avoid the speculation. Unless of course that Katy Cordeth pinches any more of my original ideas from this thread ;-P

          Here we’ve got a fella who’d be happy if one of us broke this news to his step-dad for him. And his inspirational postscript quote #10 reminded me powerfully of Philip Larkin’s This be the Verse.

          • In reply to #22 by Len Walsh:

            In reply to #21 by Nitya:

            In reply to #19 by Len Walsh:

            I think your insights are required on that other thread as well.

            Haha, you’re too kind Nitya, but thanks a lot.

            Interesting to me that this thread is an original where the OP seems sincere and prepared to participate in the ensuing discussi…

            I was very surprised to see the other thread straight after following this one. I’m not sure that they saw the comic possibilities. ( really hope that yoyoguy4 has a sense of humour ). I could see the poster covered walls and a bike covered in atheist decals in my mind’s eye. When it came to the tattoo I had to laugh out loud.

            It seems to be the theme of the day.

      • In reply to #19 by Len Walsh:

        In reply to #18 by Nash33:

        I just played the role until I was old enough to leave home. It would have broken my mothers heart to tell her. It is easy to be a nonbeliever and keep it to yourself. Why is your belief anyone’s business but your own?

        Respectfully Nash, he’s taken the trouble to write a…

        You are right. I grew up in a different world. I graduated from high school in 1950. At that time few people wanted to be labeled ‘Athiest’.
        I just thought of myself as a non believer. And when I left home I just quit going to church and have enjoyed Sundays much more than before. I only recently started thinking of my self as an athiest and that was because I realized my beliefs fit the definition.

  14. Welcome, Yo!

    I suspect that one of the keys to America’s highly unusual level of overt religiosity is that it serves a particular social purpose. Half of Americans fib about how often they go to church, much more than say the religious of most European countries. My suspicion is that it is an appearance thing. Declaring your Godliness is a clear simple statement, a badge, perhaps, of your goodness in a large, young, mixed and rapidly changing society.

    In my experience, most parents first wish that their children are happy and healthy and second that they are good. For me my atheism was always about making better moral decisions. It seemed to me that religions often led to catastrophically bad moral judgments by failing to see the breadth and extent of harms in play. Its moral calculus is limited by dogma and pre-judgment of categories of humans. To be proper moral beings we must daily do the math and question any habitual thinking we may have, looking all the while for evidence of new harms.

    For me a visible withdrawal-from-religion process that might gain your parents’ trust would lead with expressing concerns for your own moral life. Can you do better than this or that sect or religion? I suspect that the morality of religion issue will be one of your concerns, if so, put it up front when discussing matters with your parents.

    If you can show them you are good person (they would not unreasonably capitalise that), indeed better than most by actively struggling to do better than most, then they will have a consolation prize perhaps better than the one they mistakenly wished for. They will have as a son a Good Person and not merely an obedient son sporting a badge.

  15. Ok whose up for some psuedo bable,
    i am. My non belief does not define me. I just don’t feel like i need to talk about it. I come here and thats good enough.

    I do interject at times, my mother once said would it be alright for her to skip saturday night mass because she went to a saturday morning funeral mass. She didn’t know and thought the best thing she could do is to ask the priest. And i said how would the priest know. She responded in some kind of hazy way. So i said whatever the priests answer, my question would be ‘who told him’. She never went any further with it. So i frame all these interjections in a rational way. My mother knew that an answer along the lines of ‘God told the priest’ was not reasonable. So thats how i handle it.

  16. Yoyoguy4,

    I’m sorry if I sounded flippant in comments #21 and #17. You sound like a serious thinking young man ( wise beyond his years, methinks). I’ll use the fact that I’m Australian as my excuse because we are a particularly irreverent group of people. Any overt displays of religiosity or patriotism are viewed with suspicion unless you’re a new arrival to our shores. By the time the second generation comes along, they generally fit into our irreverent personality type.

    It would appear that living in some US states is similar to living in Spain during the inquisition ( minus the torture of course). I feel for you. It must be difficult.

    I was feeling pangs of guilt over my flippant responses, so I hope I’ve put them to rest. Good luck with your family and I hope you add your comments again.

  17. @Nitya my lack of commenting was merely homework, please don’t take offense to that. I understand the difference in locations between us, I think it was my misunderstanding so please don’t feel any guilt :)
    I have a good sense of humor, it just takes a while to show. I always feel more serious when I talk religion and politics than something like, Yoyoing, for example. (Modern Yoyoing is quite different than what I’m sure many of you are used to, I encourage you to look it up if the chance arrives)
    So I started today’s dinner off on a fine note, disagreeing with my parents views on astrology & some school shut down thingy. So they respected my views on that so I may try taking it a step forward with religion.
    again thank you for everyone’s help and support :)

    • In reply to #28 by yoyoguy4:

      @Nitya my lack of commenting was merely homework, please don’t take offense to that. I understand the difference in locations between us, I think it was my misunderstanding so please don’t feel any guilt :)
      I have a good sense of humor, it just takes a while to show. I always feel more serious when…

      Well, you’ve given me something to research. I can’t imagine any new forms of yoyoing but I’m about to find out.

      ‘Astrology’! Things are worse than I thought! Oh dear, you have your work cut out!

    • In reply to #28 by yoyoguy4:

      they respected my views on that so I may try taking it a step forward with religion. again thank you for everyone’s help and support …

      You’re most welcome and I’m delighted you decided to act on my advice, instead of waiting and fuming silently. I knew your parents would be much more reasonable than you had feared. That’s why I encouraged you to become honest with them.

      Having challenged their views on the school shut down thingy, without provoking a family war, you surely must feel more empowered or more brave at least. Better your parents hear about your beliefs from you, rather than risk one of your friends letting it slip. Soon you may well discard that yoyo, as fear recedes and your confidence develops.

      Congratulations so far on becoming more ‘Outward’ and keep us up to date with developments.

  18. Easy yoyoguy4 the Socratic dialogues!! You are far too gentile to these offensive reprobates than you need to be! Don’t you get offended when someone looks you straight in the eyes and actually lies to you? You are being treated as if you are an idiot by them. Next time one of these liars or imbeciles raises the (alleged) god lie, merely keep asking “what is god”? When the liars and imbeciles provide the pusillanimous diatribe they trot out, just ask them honestly, “what does that really mean”? They will just dumb on you again with the same insulting puerile rubbish and then you ask exactly the same question. They will actually tie themselves up in a knot of drivel because each attempt they make then turns themselves to utter frustration that they are unable to make it clear. This is because it is not clear, it is a lie!! Just ensure you are the last one in the conversation asking the question, don’t let them rest after they have given you another fabricated ‘version of the same rubbish; they will give up! But more importantly they will have shown themselves to be pushing an impossibly tangled fabrication that does not stack up; they will show all involved they themselves are lying!
    With Love and Peace
    Glenn Floyd
    Australia

  19. Philosophical Fact ‘The god Lie’.

    The question of “do you believe in (alleged) god”? -is as stupid as asking “do you believe in tooth fairies”? There are no ‘variations of versions’ of (an alleged) god, there is only one version and that is a supernatural intelligence creator. Anything else is saying nothing whatsoever.

    Beliefs about anything (without physical/material evidence) are utterly meaningless and belief merely means “I think it could be true” (and therefore implicit in such an inane statement) “maybe not true, even in my own view”. This is only saying maybe there is maybe there isn’t an (alleged) god, this is saying NOTHING whatsoever. Only stupid people ask this stupid question that has no meaning, no relevance; no substance whatsoever. Don’t be stupid, stupid is just, well -STUPID! If you want to brand yourself stupid, ask this stupid question. This precisely is why ‘belief’ is utterly condemned as ‘immaterial’ and rejected as ‘non-evidence’ in all law courts anywhere. This is precisely why the religious use this deliberate corruption of language; it’s no accident! They are worse than pathological liars; they are ‘commercial’ liars; for a financial return; revenue growth is the religion business.

    In addition, the statement of “I believe in (an alleged) god” is just as stupid because ’I believe’ merely means again “I think it could be true”; (again, therefore), “maybe not true in my view”. You are just saying nothing whatsoever. This mindless statement applies to everything you know nothing about. In logic, you cannot state you believe anything to be actually true and also admit maybe it’s not; the self-admission maybe it’s not; immediately eliminates your alleged belief as invalid.

    If you are struggling with this plain logic (you don’t get it) you are both stupid and dull. There is only one meaningful question to ask anyone, and that is: “if you believe in an (alleged) god; how do you define this (alleged) god”? That is to say, “what is an (alleged) god”? This reasonable question removes the “I think it could be true; therefore “maybe not true in my view”. You become not stupid, asking a real question like this. It makes you not an idiot; idiots ask the question and make the statement the other way. Pure idiots! Plato and Aristotle from circa 428-322 B.C. proved this.

    It is a fact that WITHOUT EXCEPTION, ALL jews’, christians’, islamists’ global leaders publicly state the (alleged) god CANNOT be defined by anyone. Ipso facto if you state you CANNOT define your ‘alleged’ god (as they all do); and then go on to state you believe in your ‘alleged’ god, -you must understand this is not at all possible to actually do.

    Therefore there are only three possible outcomes from this hideously stupid (or false) statement, three ONLY.
    1. You are an idiot
    2. You are a liar
    3. You are saying ‘absolutely nothing’.

    An example of saying absolutely nothing is: “I truly believe I am a HorseVolcano”, or “I believe in a “GiraffePiano”. This is IDENTICAL to saying I believe in god.

    You have actually said words in language, and you have actually spoken and said a sentence; but you have actually SAID ‘absolutely nothing’! You haven’t actually said something at all; this statement is gibberish; it is religion. The flawed structure of human language regrettably allows this preposterous ruse in communication to be purposefully exploited. Belief is merely ‘allegation’ and implicit as non-fact.

    If you state you are not 1 or 2, I guess you better understand that if you say you are not an idiot and you are not lying; you are just an utter idiot anyway BECAUSE you are saying NOTHING! Saying nothing actually makes you an idiot also. Only idiots say nothing. Non-idiots actually say something.

    Christopher Hitchens and Richard Dawkins fully understand this and owing to their strong respectful global public debating positions are utterly (were/are) unable to state it. Next time you watch one of their exquisite intellectual debates, just watch them play with the tiny undeveloped and lying minds of their opponents as they let them publicly intellectually destroy themselves. 98% of religious believers are liars. The rest idiots.

    I do not want any religion stopped; I want it to be continued freely; -whatever gets you through the night! I would lose my entire life source of entertainment, I love looking at idiots, empty heads and liars choking publicly on their own stupidity in lying about the ‘alleged’ god; it’s great fun. The trouble is though, males alone deliberately concocted religion, males lead religion (like all human institutions because it facilitates power they lust for). They do it in corporations, sports too; always! Religion is corporate business, nothing more.
    And sadly many women follow like sheep and are very happy being institutionally misogynised by it by being ‘BARRED’ from their own religious leadership; some regrettably have this neurotic psycho-sexual domination need to be held down. So very sad! The nun is the most egregious form of this wanton lust for a state of intellectual and gender oppression; it is a form of sadomasochism. (Catechism-Masochism)! It’s a neurotic gender-specific sexual perversion, a craving for sexual repression. It’s the bottom of the ‘thought’ food-chain because even though emotionally/intellectually bankrupt priests also have this sexual repression craving (‘professed-celibacy’); they have structured the institution so that comparatively few females are allowed leadership.

    The Clinton’s, Obama’s etc. are all atheists and merely blatantly lying for votes, they don’t give a tinker’s cuss about the ‘alleged’ god, and those inside religion are merely JPL (JEZUZ P/L) paid sales reps and cannot be listened to for truth; they get paid to push this vilest medieval lie! It grows the revenues!! JPL is a GLE (Good Little earner) on a corporation scale. There is a conflict of interest in taking any statements whatsoever on any matter about any ‘alleged’ god from any mullah, priest, rabbi; because they get $$$$’s for pushing the lie and the party line!

    The problem? Solely MEN! The solution? Solely WOMEN! Decouple your ‘Monkey-Gene’! http://www.glennfloyd.org/tertiary.pdf

  20. The Criminal Cruel (alleged) Creator!

    Did notice with intrigue, that you state your (alleged) god actually created the Nazis; who gassed 6 million jews and then just sat around and watched with boring bystander apathy and utter indifference during their entire gassing. Some creator that, creating genocidal butchers with knowledge aforethought they would perpetrate mass killings!

    Also note your same (alleged) god yawns away during the billions of ‘natural’ female miscarriages that occur (according to your own concocted creation theory in his created bodies) that are his own ‘natural-abortions’ he causes and allows. Very kind! These are living foetuses he kills. In your phony paradigm he has aborted billions of babies naturally; withour penalty; now wonder his (alleged) son got scourged at the pillar!

    Also see the millions of congenital birth defects each year he manufactures! This bastard (alleged) god of yours seems a ‘Nasty piece of work’! If any human today were cloning beastly killer Frankensteins like these or deliberately doing all these things or even not stopping them, it is a criminal offence! You would demand incarceration or capital punishment! You are part of the heinous crime under your own paradigm if you state you actually believe in the (alleged) god; you yourself should be charged with aiding and abetting a known deliberate homicidal pathological maniac like Charles Manson is. Your (alleged) god does the same stuff!

    Also note his appallingly low I.Q. too. Your lie says your (alleged) god created jesus in full knowledge he was going to be crucified! So good to see you adore such a pathologically sick butcher, possessing the evil spectrum of pathological narcissism and psychopathy “the quintessence of evil” creating the butcher and the victim in full awareness of both crimes. If that’s not true, the only option is he’s just a stupid dumb shit; and you adore stupid shits? 98% of religious are liars 2% are idiots.

    Good luck with your heinous butchering (alleged) god; wouldn’t want to be in any (alleged) heaven with such a butchering monster.
    With Love and Peace
    Glenn

  21. I would get my nose utterly stuck into the science half of your struggle, gobble up everything you can find – documentaries, radio, blogs, Ted, whatever – because it is such a gripping and multi-coloured narrative. (To the extent that every time a scientist refers to the Hubble photos as a source of wonder I have a face-palm moment. There’s so much more, in microbiology, neurology, new materials, it seems a bit feeble to always come up with the same example.)

    Then temper your outwards enthusiasm – it would be counterproductive starting off every breakfast with a homily on trilobites or nanotechnology – but become a follower of knowledge nonetheless. It provides much more satisfactory answers than any religion does what I found was that religion kinda died from the conversations I had with my parents.

    An example. When family members came unscathed out of a head-on collision, I addressed the supposedly profound “Why did they survive?” question by talking about seatbelts, non-inflammable diesel, crumple zones, airbags, ambulances arriving within 15 minutes thanks to satellite technology. Human effort, human discovery, ingenuity, engineering. The religious side only had to offer than somehow it was “because” Christ died to redeem our sins and God has chosen these four people for a different purpose because they are baptised into a global community of faith.

    The comparison was, frankly, embarrassing.

  22. I simply told my relatives that I am atheist.

    I also moved to a mostly atheist country – Canada – which makes it all a non issue. If you really want freedom from religion, then you got to leave the bible punchers behind and go where most people are more sensible. Trying to cure a bible puncher is a total waste of time – just leave them be and move away.

    • I actually considered going out to Canada for college…
      Too much for me in the states to leave..I’d much rather be in a more localized atheist area, or at least more open-minded people. Everyone has their head up their you-know-what (not sure what kind of moderation or profanity filters are on here) and is stuck in their own ways, worst part is is that their not republican either!
      (Subtle joke anyone?)
      I seriously wonder how people can be so ignorant sometimes, you know your being stupid but why are you ok with that…maybe they don’t actually realize it. Sooner or later it will hit them.
      In reply to #35 by flyingfsck:

      I simply told my relatives that I am atheist.

      I also moved to a mostly atheist country – Canada – which makes it all a non issue. If you really want freedom from religion, then you got to leave the bible punchers behind and go where most people are more sensible. Trying to cure a bible puncher is…

  23. No one has to make public statements about his or her own atheism. My best counsel is to avoid confrontation. There are ways to look “in” while maintaining authenticity. When people pray before a meal, I don’t mind exploring my inner feelings about how thankful I am for the meal. I just don’t address my emotions to a big guy in the sky.

    It is easier for the one who bridged the gap toward reason to reach out than the opposite.

Leave a Reply