Despite claim, Christians face practically no persecution in America

22

In “"Taking the ‘'Christ'’ out of Christmas could lead to worse",” Robert Kachadourian claimed that Christianity has a necessary role in government because he thinks that atheism caused the Holocaust. The only evidence he gives is his belief that Adolf Hitler was an atheist.

That is the kind of error that one can make when one places one’s faith in assumptions or hearsay instead of doing research.

Anyone who reads a scholarly biography of Adolf Hitler — such as the one written by John Toland (1976, 1,100 pages in two volumes) — will learn that Hitler was no atheist. Toland’s sources included the national archives of the United States, Britain, France and Germany, plus interviews with the surviving members of Hitler’s inner circle and family, including his younger sister Paula.

Toland reports that the family was Roman Catholic, and that during childhood, Adolf would use the maid’s apron as clerical vestments while he delivered impassioned sermons. As a politician, his relationship with the church was complex. Early-on, it was mostly an alliance. Later, it became contentious as Hitler tried to assume the church’s power and began thinking of himself as something of a new messiah. His soldiers’ uniforms included a belt buckle inscribed “Gott Mit Uns” (God is with us), but he also sought supernatural power through occult practices. While he doesn’t seem to have been a conventional Roman Catholic, neither was he any kind of atheist. In any case, the responsibility for Adolf Hitler’s acts rests with Adolf Hitler.

Mr. Kachadourian also argues that government should favor Christianity and host Christian displays, like manger scenes, because “the vast majority of the populace (sic) in this nation are Christians.” That is exactly why the First Amendment was added to our Constitution.

Written By: Lee Helms
continue to source article at dailytribune.com

22 COMMENTS

    • In reply to #1 by Net:

      one can make when one places one’s faith in assumptions

      yes, i think he means one’s faith

      Hey, you missed another missing apostrophe!

      “…the responsibility for Adolf Hitler’’s acts…”

      (/pedant mode)

      Steve

  1. Those who still perceive animosity toward Christians might want to consider the possibility that zealous Christians may have built up a store of resentment among non-Christians through overbearing use of Christianity’s privileged status in society — cavalierly treating city council meetings and public school functions as opportunities to proselytize captive audiences, and disdaining the idea that non-Christians should have equal speaking access at these functions.

    Despite what Mr. Kachadourian might think, Christians still enjoy all of the same rights they’ve always had under the First Amendment. All they’re losing these days is the privilege of infringing on non-Christians’ rights without protest. Some 20 percent of Americans no longer identify with any religion, and we will no longer be marginalized.

    Thank you Lee Helms. That was well put. Let’s refer back to this piece when comments appear on this site that can’t understand why the Freedom From Religion Foundation goes after religious displays on public property here in the States and takes action against other types of religious bullying.

  2. What a shock. You mean being told they can’t put up Ten Commandment plaques in public schools or nativity scenes on courthouse lawns or legislate the use of “Merry Christmas” over “Happy Holidays” DOESN’T compare to being driven from your home, ripped away from your family and friends at gunpoint, and gassed to death? Who knew?

    • In reply to #4 by Christiana Magdalene Moodley:

      Mr Kachedourian should remain silent. He is making an utter ass of himself.

      I prefer it when they all tell us their thoughts out loud, preferably on recordable visual media, or in print!

  3. “and there is nothing “civil” about the way ugly Christians unthinkingly act as though everyone around them is also Christian — or at least should be.”

    Totally agree with that statement!

  4. The problems Christians face when they claim persecution in major western countries is that of a difference of opinion over meaning of persecution. Whereas we would think that persecution means sustained hate which may lead to death, Christians in the west think it means not be allowed to do or ironically persecute whoever does not agree with them.

  5. Hitler was not merely a theist in the catholic tradition he was a supernaturalist and occultist who believed all sorts of north mythology and conducted war by astrology. This is not just an error it is a constant lie peddled by xtians. Another is ‘science doesn’t answer everything’, neatly trying to side step the obvious response which is, religion answers nothing.

  6. There is a fundamental difference between persecution and the hipocrisy to think that Christianity is the “supreme truth”, that no one can question it and have a different belief. The argument that Hitler was an atheist is frequently used as something like an ultimate way of defense but, in my opinion it is nothing else than a step backwards because it’s validity cannot be verified. The Hitler argument is only a desperate try to atack atheism.

    Let’s presume that he was really an atheist…ok so what? It doesn’t matter what your belief is or what you are using as a pretext(no punishment after death, natural selection, religion, god’s warrior,etc) for doing something bad, in the end your are the only one responsible. The only difference between Adolf Hitler and suicidal bombers is the power he had at his disposal. The way we act is only due to our way of thinking …a bad person will do bad things whether he is a theist, deist, agnostic or atheist.

    We need to wake up and see nature as she really is and realize that based on the evidence the world is not white or black ,but grey. The denial of it would do us more harm.

    • In reply to #8 by Jackal:
      >

      The argument that Hitler was an atheist is frequently used as something like an ultimate way of defense but, in my opinion it is nothing else than a step backwards because it’s validity cannot be verified.

      Not only can it not be verified, it has been thoroughly refuted. Although Hitler was a Catholic his propagandists promoted him as the “New Luther” as the cartoonists pointed out at the time http://fxeuzet.free.fr/blog/1941/low/16-10.png
      He tried to unite Catholics and Protestant churches behind NAZI -ism with special deals, but this is often hidden by religious groups attempts to re-write history!

      http://www.freedommag.org/english/spegerm/page18.htm

      Historically, churches and religions have, more than once, played the role of society’s only check against political oppression. Accordingly, governments have often harbored hostility towards them—particularly since they postulate a higher authority than the state.

      But Hitler circumvented that problem in 1933. In return for maintaining state support for the churches, Hitler secured an agreement that the churches would not oppose the National Socialists’ rise to power.

      ** Practically overnight, both churches developed active participation in advancing the goals of the Nazis. The Lutheran press began to talk of the Jews as the “natural enemies” of Christianity. The Catholic Church even agreed to an oath of fealty to be taken by all bishops, agreeing “Before God and on the Holy Gospels I swear and promise—as becomes a bishop—loyalty to the German Reich and to the state … and to cause the clergy of my diocese to honor it.”**

      In accepting Hitler’s deal, the churches sold any role they held as Germany’s moral lightning rod.

      At war’s end, the allied forces crafted a new constitution for Germany which guarantees religious freedom and separation of church and state. Yet, contrary to this, the financial arrangement remained in place.

      Churches are still collecting tax money under the deal with Hitler, and the Vatican is still a state arising from the deal with Mussolini.

      There are artefacts which clearly demonstrate the Xtian support for Hitler.

      http://nobeliefs.com/mementoes.htm – Nazi Artifacts
      (Mementoes, Badges, Paintings, etc.)

      The Hitler argument is only a desperate try to atack atheism. – Let’s presume that he was really an atheist…ok so what?

      Why??? It is an invented lie to denigrate atheists and hide the guilt of the churches.

      It is a classic example of Xtian wish-thinking-cherry-picking which lays claim to all which can be presented as “good”, while dissociating itself from responsibilities for the evils of its history.

  7. A footnote to earlier comments about “atheist” Hitler. I’m just now reading Antony Beevor’s “The Second World War”, and part of Hitler’s rationale for the invasion of Russia in 1941 was to re-Christianise the Godless Bolsheviks. Or at least, that is one of the propaganda lines he used to motivate his armies with the idea that they were doing God’s work.

  8. And let’s not forget that Stalin trained as a priest for 5 years. He might not have believed the stuff, but he certainly understood the social power of coercion the Church held over believers. And he used this knowledge to further his own hold on power.

  9. The argument about whether Hitler was a Catholic or not is completely beside the point. It comes from mistakenly assuming that religious questions are decided by sane standards. What made Hitler a Roman Catholic was the magic ritual of baptism. This is the initiation rite which decides the issue, as is illustrated by the story of Edgardo Mortara (recounted in The God Delusion).

    In 1858 Edgardo Mortara, a six-year-old child of Jewish parents living in Bologna, was legally seized by the papal police acting under orders from the Inquisition.

    This happened because the Inquisition heard that this Jewish child had been turned into a Catholic by a Catholic servant of the family when she secretly spinkled water over him and repeated the magic baptismal formula.

    So, I don’t know how any Roman Catholic could honestly deny that Hitler was a Catholic. Perhaps the current Pope has some tricky argument up his sleeve.

    It’s ridiculous to claim that being an evil, megalomaniacal dictator disqualifies Adolf from being a Catholic Christian.

  10. Ah, the vile last ditch, pathetic Argumentum ad Hitlerum.

    There are lots and lots of lovely photos of Hitler in the smiling presence Catholic Priests, and bags of religious iconography in Nazi memorability.

    But, come on, part and parcel of being a Christian is suffering; we mustn’t spoil their fun!

    They enjoy moaning and making everyone else miserable.

    Name one joke in any holy book; see, got yer!

  11. Christians are the most pampered group in America. I read an article that said Phil Robertson was being crucified for quoting the bible and if he were a Muslim the media wouldn’t have said anything because his comments would have been protected by freedom of speech and freedom of religion. This made me laugh because I’ve seen Muslims vilified for over a decade in the media. When one person makes ignorant comments and hides behind the bible you can’t say anything because all of a sudden you’re attacking christianity. It’s a joke.

  12. There is an awful lot of evidence proving that Hitler was not an atheist; but alas, those of a religious persuasion have an unhealthy tendency to consider evidence as surplus to requirements if it doesn’t fit in with their wishful thinking.

    “Transitional fossils? What transitional fossils?”

  13. The Hitler argument is only a desperate try to atack atheism. – Let’s presume that he was really an atheist…ok so what?

    Why??? It is an invented lie to denigrate atheists and hide the guilt of the churches.

    I wanted to emphasize the fact that even if Hitler was an atheist(which he clearly wasn’t) you cannot blame atheism for his atrocities. Apart from fundamentalist religion and indoctrination, a belief system cannot be judged based on one’s actions. I must add that the idea itself is absurd because atheism and belief are clearly not campatible.

  14. In relation to Hilter’s supposed atheism and Stalin’s etc. I think Hitchens put it best when he said that such arguments are essentially saying our atrocities are better than yours, and that you might want to say better for yourself than that.

  15. The number of mass murders, bordering to genocide, committed by the Christian churches is quite large. Pagans, Jews, Huguenots, ‘witches’, heretics and many other groups have all been slaughtered in the name of Christ. Either Robert Kachadourian is a denier of this part of Christian history, or he is an idiot. Or both.

    One could guess Hitler was a good Christian, continuing a long tradition.

  16. They’re the opposite of persecuted. They are the most pampered group in America. They’re so used to getting what they want that if one little thing doesn’t go their way then it becomes a full out attack on Christianity. Fox “News” doesn’t help in that perception either.

Leave a Reply