1. Comment #71495 by Quine on September 18, 2007 at 11:38 pm

"Let's not pretend we don't know it." -- You go, girl.

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2. Comment #71498 by EastCoastAtheist on September 19, 2007 at 12:00 am

Try not to vomit.

I stopped about half way ('I don't know if the world is flat')...I thought I was going to vomit.

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3. Comment #71499 by Timmeh! on September 19, 2007 at 12:05 am

"this is what cuts it on American television"

Let's not be too unfair on our American cousins in this respect; we have plenty of Daytime TV where idiots talk rubbish about things they don't understand in the UK too.

I like the "I'm gonna stop this line of questioning by saying 'I've never thought about it.'" defence. Wouldn't "I'm sorry, I bring nothing to the table, maybe I should just leave." have been more honest?

And was it just me or was the chairwoman trying to make the point that elephants and apes show evidence of morality, but is so inarticulate that it got completely garbled in a string of meaningless or irrelevant words, thus allowing the conversation to revert to fairy tales and at what age god puts morality into children?

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4. Comment #71500 by Crapsquire on September 19, 2007 at 12:06 am

Wow! This planet is in trouble.

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5. Comment #71505 by windweaver on September 19, 2007 at 12:23 am

That was just HORRENDOUS!

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6. Comment #71506 by troodon on September 19, 2007 at 12:25 am

"Is the world flat? I've never thought about it."

Absolutely unbelievable. Yet she's certain that evolution is wrong because the bible says so. Where the f**k did she go to school?

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7. Comment #71507 by hayesky on September 19, 2007 at 12:26 am

The World Is Flat!!!!! The Bible says it!!!

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8. Comment #71509 by Koreman on September 19, 2007 at 12:29 am

Very good. It shows how inconsistent and ignorant people can be and feel perfectly fine about it, even think of it as a big pro.

Religion is a faith game wherein players are constantly looking for ways in and out, only to preserve their faith. This is no surprise. Preservation of faith is the single most important thing in any religion. Without it any religion would die. The major difference between religion and science is that most religious people maintain faith whatever they observe and/or conclude where most scientists maintain skepticism. I go for skepticism.

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9. Comment #71511 by Quine on September 19, 2007 at 12:41 am

The Bible says the earth has four corners. (see Isaiah 11:12 and others) I sometimes ask scriptural literalists to point them out to me on my globe.

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10. Comment #71513 by windweaver on September 19, 2007 at 12:49 am

Quine, you're quite right. The bible is a flat earth document. Check this out:
http://www.lhup.edu/~DSIMANEK/febible.htm

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11. Comment #71520 by sabre_truth on September 19, 2007 at 12:58 am

Whoppi was the only one who had any sense whatsoever, and she was being all too diplomatic with it....sigh

This is the kind of drivel which is now put on our stay at home parents who can't or won't pay for cable? double sigh...

Gives me all that much more impetus as a scientist-educator which is my charge in this life, but lets me know what I am up against. A very high wall of fucking insane ignorance....

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12. Comment #71521 by sabre_truth on September 19, 2007 at 1:02 am

watched the last 2 minutes

Is this the standard for mothers who have any sense?

I hope not...

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13. Comment #71525 by RobertlewisIR on September 19, 2007 at 1:17 am

There's a very good reason why I don't watch that show. At least Whoopi managed to talk a little bit of sense, though, even if it was almost lost among all the flat earth bickering.

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14. Comment #71531 by Peter_on_Sax on September 19, 2007 at 1:22 am

Don't worry - I think these four are too stupid to breed.

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15. Comment #71532 by Aussie on September 19, 2007 at 1:28 am

Is this a representative cross-section of American Womanhood?

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16. Comment #71543 by alovrin on September 19, 2007 at 2:23 am

I didnt vomit, but I felt sick

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17. Comment #71544 by Philip1978 on September 19, 2007 at 2:26 am

This is brilliant, I have not laughed so much in a while!

I loved that bit about dinosaurs, that lady next to Whoopie saying look they are there, get over it and that wonderful non- answer "But the Bible says..."!
Priceless and I didnt vomit!!

Philip

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18. Comment #71555 by Steve19 on September 19, 2007 at 2:56 am

That was so difficult for me to watch... I had to pause it constantly and reassure myself there is still sanity in the world by reading everyone else's responses.

The thing is, they all occupy different positions on the spectrum (from Whoopi to the middle one) and only two of them I wouldn't be embarrassed to be in the same room as. I can completely understand if it was even less for other people.

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19. Comment #71558 by action bastard on September 19, 2007 at 3:07 am

Wow.......Did they really debate the validity of a flat earth? The fat black woman should become the official spokesperson for christianity. There would be mass atheist conversions.

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20. Comment #71563 by Mike O'Risal on September 19, 2007 at 3:35 am

Not a program I normally watch, but wow... they all seemed to include some supernatural element, and none of them seemed to have a very good handle on evolutionary theory. Witness Whoopi Goldberg including the shape of the planet as part of her image of evolution. Huh?

Cheri apparently hasn't spent much time at a library, though she'll apparently go if her son asks about whether the earth is flat. Perhaps she might have tried getting an education before taking it upon herself to reproduce. Why is it that people need a license to drive in the US but not one to have offspring?

My country seems to be getting stupider by the day. We first elected Dubya 8 years ago, then again four years ago. This is ample evidence of the decline of America. I believe we're due for a new Bronze Age here any day now.

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21. Comment #71567 by icarusfall on September 19, 2007 at 3:58 am

The thing is, when trying to convince the more conservative religious-types of the validity of evolution, I think that Whoopi Goldberg's approach is going to yield better results than Richard Dawkins'. I appreciate that Dawkins is probably better qualified by Goldberg, but did you see the way she really tried to engage the debate. I think Dawkins would have completely lost his rag by that point.

Incidentally, I yield to no-one in my admiration of Richard Dawkins, I'm just saying I was impressed with Whoopi's approach.

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22. Comment #71569 by RickM on September 19, 2007 at 3:59 am

Shoot me; just shoot me.

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23. Comment #71570 by RickM on September 19, 2007 at 4:00 am

I thought the village idiots were on Fox News; I was wrong.

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24. Comment #71587 by pewkatchoo on September 19, 2007 at 4:50 am

Wow, them is some fucking thick women. Makes you wonder if perhaps there might be a case for eugenics.

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25. Comment #71594 by Yeti on September 19, 2007 at 5:04 am

Favourite quote:

"Do we get energy from the Sun?"

I'd love to ask the lady who raised that particular question what she thinks is powering all life on earth.

If the answer is "faith" then I'd like to ask why God isn't turning up the supply now there are more people on earth and many of them are starving.

Easy to see why reasoned argument doesn't win people like this over though, none of them displayed any form of thirst for knowledge.

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26. Comment #71604 by Cartomancer on September 19, 2007 at 5:27 am

I'm frightened....

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27. Comment #71610 by Will in Aus on September 19, 2007 at 5:37 am

Words cannot express how I am feeling at this point in time...... The ignorance is utterly mind boggling....

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28. Comment #71614 by Lana on September 19, 2007 at 10:56 am

Now, that was embarrassing as an American woman. They're not typical, honest! At least I hope not. I think Joy (the one next to Whoopi) also made a few points, albeit in a too polite way.

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29. Comment #71615 by Pieter on September 19, 2007 at 11:01 am

If you guys want to see something really scary you should have seen the women they interviewed for the new season of 'beauty and the geek.' they make the girls on the view seem like the leading intellectuals of our age.

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30. Comment #71617 by bluebird on September 19, 2007 at 11:03 am

UPDATE:
Today she explained, "I was nervous talking about my faith on TV, and had brain-freeze; I know the Earth is round!!".
However,she made similiar outrageous comments recently on the View; she only got flak for this particular one.

Off Topic, tonight PBS will air "Seeing in the Dark"... http://www.pbs.org/seeinginthedark/



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31. Comment #71620 by PeterK on September 19, 2007 at 11:16 am

Did anyone really expect any more intelligent discussion coming from this group?

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32. Comment #71623 by denoir on September 19, 2007 at 11:21 am

Did you catch the Genesis remark? She said that it said that God and his son created the earth..

Now I haven't read Genesis recently - if ever, but I'm pretty sure that there is no mention of a son being involved as the son is a New Testament invention. So she was not only clueless about scientific basics but also about her own religion. And I think the whole flat earth thing highlighted her main position: a complete lack of interest. That woman is not a fundamentalist - she doesn't have a clue about the fundamentals of her own religion. The 'I don't believe in evolution' routine was just her qualifying herself as someone that takes her faith seriously as in her view it makes her a better person. In fact she doesn't care at all either way.

I strongly suspect that most people fall into that category. If you picked a person at random from an irreligious European country, you'd get the evolution over faith answer - but they would be just as uninterested. The only difference would be that they grew up in a society where the religious component was week. And the answer would be just as pointless as hers. People in general are ignorant and quite happy with it.

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33. Comment #71625 by Bremas on September 19, 2007 at 11:23 am

Demographics and personal experience tell me that black women are the biggest bible thumpers in the US. Glad to see Whoopie pushing the issue.

I made it half way and had to stop.

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34. Comment #71626 by debaser71 on September 19, 2007 at 11:23 am

IMO that folk are talking about this at all is a good thing. And remember that conversation favors those with reality on their side. I say keep the conversation going, even low end (intellectually) stuff.

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35. Comment #71628 by A on September 19, 2007 at 11:26 am

Fucking idiots.

Fucking silly idiots creeping around subjects they know nothing about, while conspicuously showing deference to JudeoChristianity lest the audience think them out-of-line with the intellectual/cutural status-quo, rambling pointless ignorance.

Fucking idiots.

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36. Comment #71629 by pewkatchoo on September 19, 2007 at 11:29 am

Why are some of you trying to excuse Whoopi Goldberk? Those are 5 stupid broads you have got there, not just 3 or 4. You would be vastly improving the human gene pool by taking all 5 of them out.

Is the earth flat? FFS this from the nation that put men on the moon, that have so many satellites up their orbiting this not so flat planet that you cannot avoid the pictures if you tried. Natural selection really fucked up with that lot.

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37. Comment #71632 by Michael P. on September 19, 2007 at 11:35 am

Barbara Walters: "Look what we have now, with internets... "

I always knew there was more than one. Dubya was right.

Isn't Walters supposed to be the reasonable, centering voice on that show? I do get the feeling that Whoopie was holding back on her inner Rosie - I guess that comes from maturity.

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38. Comment #71633 by Bremas on September 19, 2007 at 11:37 am

I'm not trying to excuse Whoopie. Rather, seeing that she is an american black women.... i'm surprised that she is not a bible thumper as well.

otherwise the whole thing made me sick.

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39. Comment #71634 by Yorker on September 19, 2007 at 11:38 am

I saw this show once or twice when I lived in the USA but didn't realise Barbara Walters was such an idiot. Actually, there was one of the foursome who was quite physically attractive (although not mentally) who's evidently been replaced, (I never learned her name).

As a younger and slightly more virile man, I remember thinking at the time she wasn't a complete waste - I could've probably fucked some sense into her. :)

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40. Comment #71636 by Scott McMeekin on September 19, 2007 at 11:40 am

@ Mike O'Risal
To be fair, Mike, you didn't vote in Dubya - the supreme court did.

@Lana
Unfortunately, the reason why so many people here are so upset, is precisely because she is *utterly* typical of a good portion of the population of the US. It's simply astounding.

@All
I would respectfully venture that it is a little unfair to shoot at this target. It's just too easy, and apart from anything else she's just some poor woman shoved on a daytime TV program armed with a clearly substandard education and only the response "Goddidit" to wield. I feel sorry for her (and her kids, I might add) for being so woefully bereft of even a basic understanding of the world she lives in.

Having said that, this person is entirely and legally entitled to vote, and run for public office. Indeed, I have no doubt, based on reams of evidence from opinion polls and studies that she would be lauded for her beliefs by the majority of the electorate.

This person could be employed in a medical insurance company who decides whether or not to pay for your medical treatment - how many of those use their faith in these decisions? This kind of person may be making decisions that impact on *your* life, and those of your children.

Why is it that in a secular society, with a secular constitution that one of the conditions of office is not that all decisions MUST be based on secular reasoning? I'm not saying exclude people with invisible friends who think the earth is flat and 6000 years old, but I would think it should be a given that the laws would be framed in such a way (with appropriate oversight) that these people could not inject society with their tainted influence.

Incredible.

Scott.

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41. Comment #71640 by sillysighbean on September 19, 2007 at 11:51 am

According to Whoopie, the universe is one vast cosmic booger. After watching this video, I decided to take a vow of silence because I fear that if I start to talk, I may sound as stupid as this panel...What is the "Internets"?...lol

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42. Comment #71641 by Quine on September 19, 2007 at 11:54 am

This person could be employed in a medical insurance company who decides whether or not to pay for your medical treatment ...

I have wondered if some people with medical histories indicative of a "life of sin" get turned down for payment because it is obvious that their current malady was sent from (insert deity of choice here) to make them change their ways.

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43. Comment #71645 by a tree with roots on September 19, 2007 at 11:55 am

All their arguments have "...I believe..." in them. I can't stand when people do that. You believe --so what?? People believe alot of things. It's a pitiful thing to hinge an argument on.
I guess that's what you get when the "virtue" of faith is still lauded by so many.

Of course, even if they'd left that out, it still would've been an empty discussion. I stopped watching halfway through...

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44. Comment #71658 by nothing on September 19, 2007 at 12:26 pm

I think I need to watch some Colbert to regain some sense of hope after watching this. Sweet Jehovah!

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45. Comment #71660 by jimbob on September 19, 2007 at 12:32 pm

While I can't help liking Whoopi, she came over here as more like the Whoopi in Whoopee Cushion --- and she was the smart one in the group!

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46. Comment #71687 by godma on September 19, 2007 at 1:02 pm

Does anyone else here think maybe this kind of thing serves a meta-purpose of revealing how intrinsically ridiculous the faith-based perspective is? Part of me feels that the more it's talked about non-dogmatically and with a variety of viewpoints, the more the central message comes out that faith-based belief is absurd.

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47. Comment #71691 by onlysky on September 19, 2007 at 1:23 pm

That was utterly pathetic. The saddest part is that a lot of the people watching that show will probably see it as a serious conversation about religion and science, when in reality, they all showed an apparent lack of understanding of basic scientific concepts and they certainly didn't have anything intelligent to say about religion.

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48. Comment #71692 by IceFreak2000 on September 19, 2007 at 1:24 pm

@sillysighbean #42

Whoopi is obviously a Jatravartid (I always thought her name wasn't particularly Terran):

The Jatravartid People of Viltvodle Six firmly believe that the entire universe was sneezed out of the nose of a being called The Great Green Arkleseizure. They live in perpetual fear of the time they call The Coming Of The Great White Handkerchief.

[http://hhgproject.org/entries/greatgreenarkleseizure.html]

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49. Comment #71693 by sane1 on September 19, 2007 at 1:24 pm

OMG!!!

THE BLOND BOZO IS BARKING MAD!!!

THERE IS NO GOD. I "BELIEVE" THESE LADIES ARE FLAT OUT LOONEY.

IS THE WORLD FLAT? - "NEVER THOUGHT ABOUT IT." OK THAT CHICK IS USELESS. SAVE ME/US FROM THIS INSANITY!!!


Sorry for the shouting...

Other Comments by sane1

50. Comment #71694 by flobear on September 19, 2007 at 1:25 pm

We can't expect everyone to be versed in evolution theory, so I won't fault them for their poor explanations - even though it hurt my ears to hear it.

Somehow lay-people believe they are qualified to discuss the legitimacy of scientific theories. This is the real problem here and it's prolific where evolution is concerned.

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