




















For the glory of God
It is, says a plaque, "The Cross at Ground Zero" -- steel beams in the shape of a cross discovered amid the wreckage. Workers wept on discovering it. A miracle, they said. A Catholic priest blessed it. It is "a sign of comfort for all," the plaque says.2. Comment #88417 by Daksian on November 16, 2007 at 2:20 pm
I find myself privileged to live in Ottawa and get the Citizen every day, where I can enjoy articles like this one from Dan Gardner. He is an excellent counterpoint to the blind rhetoric of David Warren.3. Comment #88419 by debaser71 on November 16, 2007 at 2:22 pm
"Faith exists on a spectrum. At one end are atheists like Dawkins who say they'll take a look at whatever evidence anyone cares to offer but they will not believe that which is not proven."4. Comment #88420 by SilentMike on November 16, 2007 at 2:28 pm
Well what do you know? A non-hostile report. That's nice.5. Comment #88422 by The_Stone on November 16, 2007 at 2:36 pm
6. Comment #88423 by Duff on November 16, 2007 at 2:42 pm
The Dalai Lama (it should be Llama) says that the believers that do these sort of things are "not sincere". They are the most sincere believers there are. They are true believers. The worst kind. Spare us from the true believers in all their permutations and stripes! Would it be too much to ask for a pox on all true believers?7. Comment #88424 by gr_man on November 16, 2007 at 2:43 pm
Comment #884178. Comment #88425 by Socrates on November 16, 2007 at 2:45 pm
I wrote this brief letter to the Ottawa Citizen in response:9. Comment #88435 by SRWB on November 16, 2007 at 3:42 pm
Daksian,10. Comment #88436 by savagemickey on November 16, 2007 at 3:48 pm
You only have to look at the crowds of people who are ooohing and aaaahing at Ken Ham's coconut eating T-Rex to know that the christianity that Dawkins is critiquing is very widespread.11. Comment #88438 by kaiserkriss on November 16, 2007 at 4:18 pm
12. Comment #88440 by athegan on November 16, 2007 at 4:38 pm
The Dalai Lama recently said that all religions teach compassion and belief only becomes a problem when believers are "not really serious, not sincere."
13. Comment #88451 by hughlomas on November 16, 2007 at 5:57 pm
and Émile Zola declaring the perfection of civilization will be at hand when "the last stone from the last church falls on the last priest!"
"Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest." -Denis Diderot
14. Comment #88453 by phasmagigas on November 16, 2007 at 6:06 pm
15. Comment #88454 by phasmagigas on November 16, 2007 at 6:13 pm
16. Comment #88462 by Ashley1319 on November 16, 2007 at 7:57 pm
I don't know about Canada's religious climate, but America tends to be divided along geographical lines. The north is where the moderates are, the south is where the bible thumpers are. Really, this is not at all exaggerating. The south tends to breed ignorance and superstition, and is the base camp of evangelical movements. In my small town alone, there are about a dozen protestant churches, and one tiny catholic church. I even saw a street preacher near Walmart the other day, his little child holding up a sign condemning people to hell. I was quite furious.17. Comment #88468 by Veronique on November 16, 2007 at 10:26 pm
Starting from a very low base in the USA at the turn of the nineteenth century, there are now more than 500 million Pentecostals worldwide*1. Reports also suggest growth of religious confession in the Muslim and Hindu worlds. According to John Haldane, 'the religious outnumber the agnostics and atheists by four to one'.*2
*1 McGrath The Twilight of Atheism, 2004, p.195
*2 Haldane An Intelligent Person's Guide to Religion, 2005, p.23
18. Comment #88471 by TheCelestialTeapot on November 16, 2007 at 11:39 pm
Wow! What an excellent article!19. Comment #88486 by JFHalsey on November 17, 2007 at 3:33 am
An excellent article, and very true. Only three years ago I was one of those religious nutcases who believed the world was less than 10,000 years old and that every word in the bible came from ol'Yahweh's mouth. It's an oppressive, stifling worldview in which no dissent or logical reasoning or shadow of a doubt is allowed. And though my beliefs would not have led me to murder or to strap bombs to my chest, christianity taken 100% literally is still mortally dangerous. I shudder to think what might have happened to my children had they contracted a serious illness when I was still taking the New Testament's word on Faith Healing seriously.20. Comment #88492 by RSP123 on November 17, 2007 at 4:39 am
21. Comment #88495 by Logicel on November 17, 2007 at 5:27 am
22. Comment #88497 by Ian on November 17, 2007 at 5:40 am
The Dali Llama suffers from something that afflicts most of us, most of the time: the assumption that we are mediocre or representative of our type.23. Comment #88499 by wagnerpe on November 17, 2007 at 6:07 am
This is an excellent article. Right up there with "Those fanatical atheists" in my book.24. Comment #88505 by shemp333 on November 17, 2007 at 6:49 am
25. Comment #88523 by D'Arcy on November 17, 2007 at 10:20 am
The new atheists' view of religion is far too crude, critics say. They ignore the fine and subtle thoughts of great theologians and dwell instead on literal readings of holy books, divine intervention, miracles, fundamentalism, televangelists, terrorists and other fringe elements
26. Comment #88534 by poppythinks on November 17, 2007 at 1:31 pm
27. Comment #88557 by troodon on November 17, 2007 at 7:07 pm
Daksian,28. Comment #88572 by OneNationUnderThor on November 17, 2007 at 10:42 pm
29. Comment #88596 by JamesDB on November 18, 2007 at 2:13 am
30. Comment #88607 by keith on November 18, 2007 at 3:09 am
31. Comment #88640 by Cerberus on November 18, 2007 at 7:47 am
I believe that Trondon is righ, Quebec is the least religious province in Canada, followed very closely by BC according to several polls. The census stats are not exactly accurate. In Quebec, most people, even though they are atheist, will say they are catholics, but many of them mean "culturally catholic". I know it's the same thing for many people in Ontario as well.32. Comment #88645 by OneNationUnderThor on November 18, 2007 at 8:59 am
33. Comment #88657 by Cerberus on November 18, 2007 at 12:03 pm
In Quebec, it is probably more to do with maintaining their cultural identity than any sort of god
34. Comment #88677 by Eric Blair on November 18, 2007 at 1:31 pm
Surveys on religious faith always seem to be unreliable. To me, "snap-shot" polls are less useful than those showing trends over 5 or more years. I would also be more interested in studies that relate these numbers to every-day life activities and specific issues (birth control, premarital sex, gay marriage, abortion, etc.)35. Comment #88678 by clunkclickeverytrip on November 18, 2007 at 1:32 pm
I'm also an Ottawa dweller and a fan of Gardner's efforts in the Citizen. I'd like to propose an Ottawa Chapter of RD.net members - OK, never mind a Chapter, how about a beer? I'd like to contemplate the phrase "think globally, act locally" with some like-minded people.36. Comment #88725 by DavidJMH on November 18, 2007 at 5:06 pm
Ladies and Gentlemen,37. Comment #88751 by TylerJames on November 18, 2007 at 10:36 pm
38. Comment #88753 by kraut on November 18, 2007 at 11:05 pm
(for those of you who don't believe Canada is America's 51st State, over 85% of the Canadian economy is directly dependent upon the US)39. Comment #88757 by Diacanu on November 18, 2007 at 11:48 pm
40. Comment #88758 by kraut on November 18, 2007 at 11:59 pm
"We did it all for the glooooory of Gaaawwwwd!!"41. Comment #88762 by kraut on November 19, 2007 at 12:23 am
http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO110A.html42. Comment #88765 by Veronique on November 19, 2007 at 12:30 am
43. Comment #88766 by MutantXPhilip1978 on November 19, 2007 at 12:37 am
44. Comment #88767 by kraut on November 19, 2007 at 12:47 am
"Or do I fight to try to stop this maniacal theological bullshit from coming to its imagined (and desired) fruition?"45. Comment #88769 by Quetzalcoatl on November 19, 2007 at 12:51 am
46. Comment #88771 by Goldy on November 19, 2007 at 12:57 am
Bloody Hell, Philip - if that's what tea does to you I'm keeping well clear! As it is, I found chamomile gave me heart palpitations and shortness of breath. Alcoholic bevvies only from now on!47. Comment #88781 by Diacanu on November 19, 2007 at 1:49 am
48. Comment #88783 by Quetzalcoatl on November 19, 2007 at 1:55 am
49. Comment #88786 by Diacanu on November 19, 2007 at 2:03 am
50. Comment #88789 by Diacanu on November 19, 2007 at 2:06 am
This article is reposted from a website that accepts comments.
Why not share your comment on the article there as well? CLICK HERE
1. Comment #88416 by PaulJ on November 16, 2007 at 2:17 pm
(My recollection of the cross is that it was covered with inscriptions.)
Other Comments by PaulJ