










Atheists for Jesus
The argument, like a good recipe, needs to be built up gradually, with the ingredients mustered in advance. First, the apparently oxymoronic title. In a society where the majority of theists are at least nominally Christian, the two words are treated as near synonyms. Bertrand Russell's famous advocacy of atheism was called Why I am not a Christian rather than, as it probably should have been, Why I am not a theist. All Christians are theists, it seems to go without saying.3. Comment #11517 by heymrrain on December 5, 2006 at 7:46 am
David,4. Comment #11614 by Sancus on December 6, 2006 at 12:30 am
Holy crap. I didn't know this article was going to be about the singularity!5. Comment #11982 by drbobsh on December 9, 2006 at 12:15 am
I wonder if human "super niceness" would have existed in prehistoric times (i.e., those times in which natural selection did actually apply to humans). Human "super niceness" would more likely be an artifact of our more advanced society. One then wonders if HSN is an emergent property of advanced intelligent societies, and/or a necessary condition for long term survival of a life form.6. Comment #28793 by michaelmichael on March 30, 2007 at 11:05 pm
Having reached an atheistic outlook, I began to wonder where logic would take me when re-examing the story of Jesus. If there is no God then Jesus must clearly have lied when he claimed to be the son of God. If the laws of physics are immutable then clearly Jesus, either alone or more likely in concert with others, was being deceitful when he claimed to have performed miraculous cures, resurrections and other miracles like walking on water.7. Comment #28807 by Shane McKee on March 31, 2007 at 3:12 am
8. Comment #28818 by DavidMcC on March 31, 2007 at 4:22 am
9. Comment #28830 by Enda80 on March 31, 2007 at 6:10 am
"If the laws of physics are immutable then clearly Jesus, either alone or more likely in concert with others, was being deceitful when he claimed to have performed miraculous cures, resurrections and other miracles like walking on water."10. Comment #28831 by Enda80 on March 31, 2007 at 6:17 am
Note that the Biblical Jesus did teach that unbelief in him would lead to damnation and that there was a Gehenna/Hell. The Biblical Jesus also taught the concept of evil, with the idea of the Devil and the end of days. These were not parables or symbolic, as rendering them symbolic leaves them meaningless, and besides, what do liberals use these stories to teach? Most people today encourage planning one's life, not waiting for the fortuitous deus ex machina (literal or figurative). The fact that liberals do not often use these passages only shows how little they recommend themselves for figurative interpretation.11. Comment #28832 by Enda80 on March 31, 2007 at 6:20 am
I also seriously doubt that the Biblical Jesus ever says that he thinks the stories from the Hebrew Bible are just myths or parables.12. Comment #30523 by Homo economicus on April 8, 2007 at 10:48 am
13. Comment #30529 by simplemind on April 8, 2007 at 12:19 pm
14. Comment #32120 by GreatCanadianAtheist on April 15, 2007 at 8:30 pm
Well I don't really think Jesus ever actually existed in any form, but I'm not sure, and I do agree that a lot of the things he was supposed to have said in the NT are pretty good moral lessons.15. Comment #32339 by TXS.R.D. on April 16, 2007 at 10:52 pm
16. Comment #35141 by FreeFromDelusion on April 26, 2007 at 10:29 am
17. Comment #35488 by TXS.R.D. on April 27, 2007 at 11:05 am
18. Comment #35491 by TXS.R.D. on April 27, 2007 at 11:17 am
19. Comment #37780 by Barak on May 5, 2007 at 4:53 pm
The doctrines attributed to Jesus are not ethical in the slightest - they merely encourage gross hypocrisy.20. Comment #38074 by TXS.R.D. on May 6, 2007 at 10:58 pm
21. Comment #40378 by michaelmichael on May 14, 2007 at 7:42 am
TXS.R.D. stated; "dismissing jesus as god has nothing to do with endorsing him as teacher". Fair comment, and yet I do choose to dismiss Jesus as a teacher.22. Comment #42757 by miguelcortes on May 19, 2007 at 11:25 am
Jesus was a cult leader. His group showed all the characteristics of a dangerous cult. His philosophy of passiveness and acceptance, might be good for helping very arrogant people in the short term, but in the long term you are creating an army of passive slaves. I don't think it's good to go to the extreme of super niceness, it's simply not in our best interest.23. Comment #48972 by Jabie on June 9, 2007 at 7:12 pm
'What was interesting and remarkable about Jesus was not the obvious fact that he believed in the God of his Jewish religion, but that he rebelled against many aspects of Yahweh's vengeful nastiness. At least in the teachings that are attributed to him, he publicly advocated niceness and was one of the first to do so. To those steeped in the Sharia-like cruelties of Leviticus and Deuteronomy...'24. Comment #64065 by flying goose on August 17, 2007 at 1:29 pm
25. Comment #64084 by ? on August 17, 2007 at 3:09 pm
26. Comment #71486 by psikeyhackr on September 18, 2007 at 9:53 pm
27. Comment #71490 by Roy_H on September 18, 2007 at 10:34 pm
Jesus was a jerk......28. Comment #71492 by eric.malitz on September 18, 2007 at 11:02 pm
"Borrowing a poetic myth from the worlds of mathematics and cosmology, he described humanity as a 'singularity' in evolution. He meant exactly what I have been talking about in this essay, although he expressed it differently. The advent of human super niceness is something unprecedented in four billion years of evolutionary history. It seems likely that, after the Homo sapiens singularity, evolution may never be the same again."29. Comment #71502 by Richard Morgan on September 19, 2007 at 12:15 am
Shane McKee:Could we achieve exponential amplification of the numbers of super nice people?We?
30. Comment #86011 by Yussy on November 7, 2007 at 8:19 pm
I don't think we necessarily need more 'nice' people in the world. But we could certainly do with more 'good' people.31. Comment #86012 by BAEOZ on November 7, 2007 at 8:25 pm
32. Comment #121056 by lilzilla on February 2, 2008 at 10:55 pm
The reason it's hard or difficult to spread niceness is that it's very easy to erroneously believe one is "nice", ignoring one's un-nice behaviour most of the time. As pointed out by some helpful curmudgeons in this very discussion, Jesus himself behaved cruelly and pettily at times. As Dr. Dawkins points out himself, people who believe themselves to be highly moral or good, but reason themselves into actions that hurt others. Plenty-- /plenty/ of Christians feel that following Jesus' teachings about being good to each other are just as important as belief in his divinity. Some of them fail and are horrible much of the time, but some of them succeed. If Dr. Dawkins is serious about spreading niceness, he would presumably consent to behaving nicely himself, which he has not shown an aptitude for in the past, nor here.
1. Comment #11376 by Andrew Charles on December 4, 2006 at 10:59 am
I agree with Prof Dawkins' sentiments...However, in the interests of science (and in this this case, historical truth) it must be said that we cannot talk anymore about Jesus as an historical figure if we are intellectually honest with ourselves. Professor Dawkins, I have a book entitled "Did Jesus Ever Live?" by L. Gordon Rylands printed in the 1930's. I have never heard of him nor have I been able to find a copy of this book anywhere. Perhaps you could find a copy in England, where the book originated, otherwise I would gladly send you mine!