1. Comment #134455 by nogodsever on February 27, 2008 at 8:10 pm

Why is 'atheist' so damn hard for some people to spell?

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2. Comment #134461 by Tetsujin on February 27, 2008 at 8:20 pm

Putting yourself in their shoes, how would you sidestep those ridiculous questions without raising concerns or losing votes? Keeping in mind that this is a popularity contest.

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3. Comment #134465 by LorienRyan on February 27, 2008 at 8:38 pm

Aren't fundie christians a politicians dream? Just parrot some pat bible lines and mention something about Jesus and prayer and you're there!

The economy, public health system, national security, etc., well, God and the bible are much more important, aren't they?

*extreme sarcasm*

Other Comments by LorienRyan

4. Comment #134470 by Gustaf Sjoblom on February 27, 2008 at 8:49 pm

On the verse question I believe the best response would have been:

Job 13:5 - "O that ye would altogether hold your peace! and it should be your wisdom."

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5. Comment #134471 by croatcat on February 27, 2008 at 8:50 pm

Keeping in mind that this is a popularity contest.

Which makes it difficult to vote for any of them. Feel like I am in an "American Idol" nightmare.

At what point did the U.S. political system become secondary to image?

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6. Comment #134474 by Andrew Stich on February 27, 2008 at 9:10 pm

Why do Christians hate America?

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7. Comment #134476 by Double Bass Atheist on February 27, 2008 at 9:12 pm

At what point did the U.S. political system become secondary to image?

The US political system IS image.

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8. Comment #134479 by Mitchell Gilks on February 27, 2008 at 9:17 pm

Irrelevent, and non sequitur debate questions makes baby Jesus cry.

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9. Comment #134489 by JuxtaMonkey on February 27, 2008 at 9:55 pm

ok double bass atheist,

I'm going to hold you responsible for my sleepiness tomorrow! Great article suggestion on Evolution mistake =) I just had to put in my 2 cents hehe

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10. Comment #134493 by MaxD on February 27, 2008 at 10:05 pm

Testujin,
You said,

Putting yourself in their shoes, how would you sidestep those ridiculous questions without raising concerns or losing votes? Keeping in mind that this is a popularity contest.

I think the easiest way to sidestep these kinds of assine quesitons is with the following statement or style of statement.

"I think that the American people are tired of politicians pandering to them in this obvious way. Our country values religious freedom and expression, just as much as if values freedom from any government establishment thereof. As your (plug elected office in here) I will strive to act in ways that help all Americans regardless of who or what they worship. What I categorically won't do Mr. Russert is answer this frivolous question. I will not do this not because I am afraid of what the American public would think of me. I am refusing to answer your question because it isn't in any way germaine to the business of governance."

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11. Comment #134498 by bucketchemist on February 27, 2008 at 10:31 pm

Perhaps a better question for Tim Russert to ask would have been;
"Are you or have you ever been a member of a non-religious organisation?"

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12. Comment #134501 by Thor'Ungal on February 27, 2008 at 10:35 pm

nogodsever posted:

Why is 'atheist' so damn hard for some people to spell?

I Think it because it doesn't conform to the typical spelling conventions.

I remember way back to my primary school days the convention 'i' before 'e' except after 'c' except in some words like weight, height and "atheist", I defend this because even being one I still find the spell checker picking me up once in a while.

Suffice it to say It's still inbred in some of us to spell phonetically then go d'oh when we realise we posted that with "athiest" in the content.

Easy way to remember: we worship the god Athe, it's just that she is so great that she precludes existence and couldn't be bothered leaving a religious test, all praise to Athe.

BTW, this is a defense in general from a notoriously bad speller but what does it relate to. I missed where it's mispelt in the article or in the video and you are the first poster.

=P

Thor'Ungal

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13. Comment #134502 by irate_atheist on February 27, 2008 at 10:37 pm

I wish they'd run for the hills...

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14. Comment #134503 by Thor'Ungal on February 27, 2008 at 10:38 pm

test -> text, sign spellcheckers are just no substitute to reading your work carefully

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15. Comment #134506 by Nighttripper on February 27, 2008 at 11:07 pm

Wow did that guy really say "Lord, make me an instrument of your piece?"

Disturbing... :P

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16. Comment #134507 by matlot on February 27, 2008 at 11:08 pm

I mean no offense to our American friends on this website. However, the US deeply terrifies me. I have thought of the country in the same terms as Iran or Saudi for some time. At one point I found myself hoping China's ascension to world dominance would quicken. Times are indeed very hard when you're hoping for that!

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17. Comment #134511 by JamesDB on February 27, 2008 at 11:20 pm

I really don't like how none of them take a second to think about how they are in a political debate. Religion has nothing to do with politics therefor the question "what is your favourite bible verse?" is completely meaningless.

And then they have to quickly think of whatever bible verse they figure will catch them more votes. Pathetic.

At least Hillary Clinton went with the most basic of principles in only do to others what you would want done to you yada yada.

I guess i prefer her to win but I see some people disagreeing with me on that. A woman american president could really shake things up down there.(im a canuck)

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18. Comment #134513 by Richard Morgan on February 27, 2008 at 11:30 pm

Politicians playing politicians' games.
So, what's new?
I LOVE AMERICA.
There - I've come out.
If the US "deeply terrifies" you to the point where you may prefer Chinese world dominance, I suggest you find your self a new psychoanalyst.
Or stop working with glue so much.

Other Comments by Richard Morgan

19. Comment #134516 by bucketchemist on February 27, 2008 at 11:34 pm

One of the small blessings that the existence of Royalty brings to the UK is that, as head of the Church of England, the Queen acts as a repository for that kind of nonsense without having any real constitutional power.

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20. Comment #134533 by Marcus Hill on February 28, 2008 at 12:35 am

In any civilised nation, someone asking candidates in a political debate what their favourite Bible verse was would be laughed at. Americans aren't only restricted in their choice of political stance of candidates (Far Right or Further Right), they have the politicians' religion thrust into the spotlight - and there's even less to differentiate between candidates on that front.

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21. Comment #134536 by YssiBoo on February 28, 2008 at 12:50 am

At one point I found myself hoping China's ascension to world dominance would quicken.

However much you fear the religious connotations in american politics, I really don't think china is the more civil country. I think you will find that there are far more violations of basic human rights in china than in the US. For the time being the americans have a sound constitution that serves to protect them from the worst lunacy.

With that said I will give my support to the Dan Dennett presidential campaign. :)

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22. Comment #134537 by scottishgeologist on February 28, 2008 at 12:59 am

Fav Bible verse:

Just has to be :

1 Chronicles 4:9-10:

And Jabez called on the God of Israel saying, "Oh that You would bless me indeed, and enlarge my territory, that Your hand would be with me, and that You would keep me from evil, that I may not cause pain!" So God granted him what he requested

The so called "Prayer of Jabez". Also a book by Bruce Wilkinson.

Prosperity gospel in a nutshell - and a huge publishing phenomenon as well

As the author himself said:

"I challenge you to make the Jabez prayer for blessing part of the daily fabric of your life. To do that, I encourage you to follow unwaveringly the plan outlined here for the next thirty days. By the end of that time, you'll be noticing significant changes in your life, and the prayer will be on its way to becoming a treasured, lifelong habit."

Even a lot of Christians find difficulty with this stuff.

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23. Comment #134538 by Thor'Ungal on February 28, 2008 at 12:59 am

With that said I will give my support to the Dan Dennett presidential campaign. :)

I won't, I like him too much to have him assassinated. =P

Other Comments by Thor'Ungal

24. Comment #134539 by PJG on February 28, 2008 at 1:02 am

A reaction to this from a British citizen.....


*SHUDDER*

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25. Comment #134540 by Steve Zara on February 28, 2008 at 1:02 am

At one point I found myself hoping China's ascension to world dominance would quicken.

Be careful what you wish for ....

I am a strong supporter of the idea of a United States of Europe. Perhaps it isn't ideal, but it would have the power to occasionally tap the USA on the shoulder in a friendly way and say "we would rather you didn't do that, old chap".

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26. Comment #134541 by PJG on February 28, 2008 at 1:04 am

Steve

100% agreement. I want the same thing for the same reason - and probably ONLY that reason!!! :o)

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27. Comment #134546 by brue68 on February 28, 2008 at 1:15 am

Europe, you say? Anyone looking for an almost-graduated computer science major?

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28. Comment #134550 by Thor'Ungal on February 28, 2008 at 1:21 am

Steve,

I was going to disagree based on the sharp uptake of Islam in Europe but I think aside from the odd insane bout of political correctness and religious pandering with only 4% (and mostly moderate) representation this probably doesn't pose much of a threat.

A USE to counter the USA would be cool.

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29. Comment #134551 by bash the bish on February 28, 2008 at 1:27 am

Why is 'atheist' so damn hard for some people to spell?

Its funny you should say that nogodserver. I have a mild dislexia and I realy do have a problem with spelling "atheist" its just one of those words that will not go from brain to fingers to pc screen.

edit because I couldnt spell realy !!!

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30. Comment #134554 by godless_badass on February 28, 2008 at 1:46 am

Steve,

I do principially agree, however, we europeans have a problem - too many cooks spoil the soup AND for some reason, we distance ourselves from the only major military and recourcefull ally on our continent - Russia. Third of europe wishes we were americans, third wishes we were russians and third wishes we would mind our own business :)
China is not an answer to anybody's wishes, if he has any common sense left. China is a semi-communist, semi-konfucianist dictatorship with it's own agenda. It's not a civic or moral or free society by european or american means. Me, there's nothing coming out of modern times China that I would want. Nothing at all...

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31. Comment #134559 by Steve Zara on February 28, 2008 at 1:53 am

Comment #134554 by godless_badass

I do principially agree, however, we europeans have a problem - too many cooks spoil the soup AND for some reason, we distance ourselves from the only major military and recourcefull ally on our continent - Russia. Third of europe wishes we were americans, third wishes we were russians and third wishes we would mind our own business :)

Yes, indeed. I share the view that stronger connections with Russia would be helpful, especially now, as tensions are rising.

For some reason I just feel European, and have a particular fondness for France, perhaps because I was taken there often as a child. I feel "at home" there, and in other European countries I have visited.

I just feel it is a huge waste of resources if Europe is not to be a major power in the world.

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32. Comment #134565 by epeeist on February 28, 2008 at 2:06 am

Comment #134559 by Steve Zara

For some reason I just feel European, and have a particular fondness for France, perhaps because I was taken there often as a child. I feel "at home" there, and in other European countries I have visited.

Sorry to bring it back to fencing.

I have travelled reasonably extensively because of the sport and had to interact with people of many different nationalities (somewhat more than the average tourist I suspect). This has been a joy (you may have no friends on the piste, but you can have an awful lot once you take your mask off).

While one may loathe governments and the egotism of politicians I have rarely come across people with whom it has not been possible to have a friendly relationship.

So yes, tighter binding in the EU but better to get rid of this little England xenophobia in the UK.

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33. Comment #134577 by Gustaf Sjoblom on February 28, 2008 at 2:35 am

I don't think a tighter binding within the EU is very likely, at least no in the foreseeable future. We are a bit to different on many accounts.

But the good news is, it doesn't really matter that much, and in a way it is better for you this way. Find the country that best suits your personal taste and move there. (If you are a republican or libertarian stay waaaay clear of Scandinavia)

P.S Staying on-topic is for squares. :P

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34. Comment #134580 by AllanW on February 28, 2008 at 2:35 am

I can't disagree with the proposition that a strong and united Europe would be a very useful entity. Strong links to America but a forceful, friendly foil to their idiocy in foreign relations. A possibility to bring Russia and the ex-Soviet republics into the fold would be well worth pursuing.

However the ideal is not only far from being realised but I would argue that the current political structures and participants are so woefully corrupt and unfit-for-purpose that it positively harms the chances of ever achieving this ideal.

I've travelled and worked in much of western Europe including Scandinavia and agree that the similarities and outlooks of the vast majority of the population would provide a solid and useful concensus for the ideal when set against the differences that most of the media concentrate upon.

But the utterly distant and remote political superstructure of the EU as it is currently formed would, in my opinion, be wholly incapable of representing this concensus and is therefore frustrating not enabling of progress.

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35. Comment #134590 by Dune010 on February 28, 2008 at 2:58 am

stronger connections with Russia

Ha. Good luck with that.

Politicians playing politicians' games.
So, what's new?
I LOVE AMERICA.
There - I've come out.

Why?
As far as countries go, I don't "love" anywhere. Plenty of places are okay, with the USA probably at the lower end of that list, owing to its religiosity. Britain is nice, but there is plenty wrong with it. You wouldn't find me loving a woman of similar quality: unhealthy, poorly educated, institutionally Christian... I don't know, littered?

I love my university, but that's only because it's a very pretty oasis of academia. I really don't understand patriotism.

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36. Comment #134601 by emmet on February 28, 2008 at 3:18 am

If you are a republican or libertarian stay waaaay clear of Scandinavia

Judging by your name, you're Swedish, but I don't see why one would want to avoid Scandinavia, really. I'd consider myself a republican (in the representative democracy, one-person-one-vote, all persons equal, no monarchy sense) and a libertarian (in the do what you like as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else sense), and while I found ID cards and all the odd little rules in Sweden somewhat bizarre at first, it all seems to work pretty well. Systembolaget, I could really do without, but I only think you'd want to avoid Sweden if you were pathologically paranoid and believed that the government was out to get you (in the tinfoil hats and black helicopters sense).

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37. Comment #134608 by epeeist on February 28, 2008 at 3:29 am

Comment #134577 by Gustaf Sjoblom
I don't think a tighter binding within the EU is very likely, at least no in the foreseeable future. We are a bit to different on many accounts.Politically possibly, not too different people-wise.

(If you are a republican or libertarian stay waaaay clear of Scandinavia)

The only problem I found with Sweden is (a quote from the guy I sailed around the Swedish Archipelago and across to Finland with) that if they could find a street that was one-way in both directions, then that is where they would put the state liquor stores.

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38. Comment #134611 by clodhopper on February 28, 2008 at 3:35 am

In light of your failure to nominate competent candidates for President of the USA and thus to govern yourselves, we hereby give notice of the revocation of your independence, effective immediately.

Her Sovereign Majesty Queen Elizabeth II will resume monarchical duties over all states, commonwealths, and territories (except Kansas , which she does not fancy).

Your new prime minister, Gordon Brown, will appoint a governor for America without the need for further elections.

Congress and the Senate will be disbanded.

A questionnaire may be circulated next year to determine whether any of you noticed.

To aid in the transition to a British Crown Dependency, the following rules are introduced with immediate effect:

You should look up "revocation" in the Oxford English Dictionary.

1. Then look up aluminium, and check the pronunciation guide. You will be amazed at just how wrongly you have been pronouncing it.

2. The letter 'U' will be reinstated in words such as 'favour'and 'neighbour.' Likewise, you will learn to spell 'doughnut' without
skipping half the letters, and the suffix -ize will be replaced by the suffix -ise.

Generally, you will be expected to raise your vocabulary to acceptable levels. (look up 'vocabulary').

3. Using the same twenty-seven words interspersed with filler noises such as "like" and "you know" and "awsome" is an unacceptable and inefficient form of communication.

There is no such thing as US English. We will let Microsoft know on your behalf. The Microsoft spell- checker will be adjusted to take account of the reinstated letter 'u' and the elimination of -ize.

You will relearn your original national anthem, God Save The Queen.

4. July 4th will no longer be celebrated as a holiday.

5. You will learn to resolve personal issues without using guns, lawyers, or therapists. The fact that you need so many lawyers and
therapists shows that you're not adult enough to be independent.

Guns should only be handled by adults. If you're not adult enough to sort things out without suing someone or speaking to a therapist then you're not grown up enough to handle a gun.

6. Therefore, you will no longer be allowed to own or carry anything more dangerous than a vegetable peeler. A permit will be
required if you wish to carry a vegetable peeler in public.

7. All American cars are hereby banned. They are crap and this is for your own good. When we show you German cars, you will understand what we mean.

8. All intersections will be replaced with roundabouts, and you will start driving on the left with immediate effect. At the same
time, you will go metric with immediate effect and without the benefit of conversion tables.

Both roundabouts and metrication will help you understand the British sense of humour.

9. The Former USA will adopt UK prices on petrol (which you have been calling gasoline)-roughly $6/US gallon. Get used to it.

10. You will learn to make real chips. Those things you call French fries are not real chips, and those things you insist on calling potato chips are properly called crisps. Real chips are thick cut, fried in animal fat, and dressed not with catsup but with vinegar.

11. The cold tasteless stuff you insist on calling beer is not actually beer at all. Henceforth, only proper British Bitter will be
referred to as beer, and European brews of known and accepted provenance will be referred to as Lager.

South African beer is also acceptable as they are pound for pound the greatest sporting Nation on earth and it can only be due to
the beer. They are also part of British Commonwealth - see what it did for them.

12. Hollywood will be required occasionally to cast English actors as good guys. Hollywood will also be required to cast English actors to play English characters.

Watching Andie McDowell attempt English dialogue in Four Weddings and a Funeral was an experience akin to having one's ears removed with a cheese grater.

13. You will cease playing American football. There is only one kind of proper football; you call it soccer. Those of you brave enough will, in time, be allowed to play rugby (which has some
similarities to American football, but does not involve stopping for a rest every twenty seconds or wearing full kevlar body armour like a
bunch of nancies). Don't try Rugby - the South Africans and Kiwis will thrash you, like they regularly thrash us.

14. Further, you will stop playing baseball. It is not reasonable to host an event called the World Series for a game which is not played outside of America. Since only 2.1% of you are aware that there is a world beyond your borders, your error is understandable. You will learn cricket, and we will let you face the South Africans first to take the sting out of their deliveries.

15. You must tell us who killed JFK. It's been driving us mad.

16. An internal revenue agent (i.e. tax collector) from Her Majesty's Government will be with you shortly to ensure the acquisition
of all monies due (backdated to 1776).

17. Daily Tea Time begins promptly at 4 pm with proper cups, never mugs, with high quality biscuits (cookies) and cakes; strawberries
in season.

God save the Queen.

Only He can.

PS Do not stand in Line, for goodness sake, queue properly.

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39. Comment #134614 by YssiBoo on February 28, 2008 at 3:38 am

The only problem I found with Sweden is (a quote from the guy I sailed around the Swedish Archipelago and across to Finland with) that if they could find a street that was one-way in both directions, then that is where they would put the state liquor stores.

Haha. It was that way with the norwegian wine (and licqour) monopoly stores for a long time as well. We have eased up on that somewhat.

But if accessibility of booze is the only problem you can find with a country I would say it doesn't have any problems worth mentioning.

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40. Comment #134626 by YssiBoo on February 28, 2008 at 3:54 am

Clodhopper: You should perhaps reevaluate the driving on the left part. Britain is an island of lefthand driving in the middle of the ocean that is the civilised world.

The adoption of the metric system in britain has been anything but painless. Here you were also an island in the ocean that is the civilised world for a long time.

Cricket is not a sport. It is the best attempt yet to hide the lack of action in any human activity behind a veil of unintelligible rules.

British cars should be exposed to the same ban as the american cars. (Except those british cars really made by germans.)

To add one vocabulary issue to your list (in the words of Eddie Izzard): Herbs is not pronounced 'erbs. Cause it has got a f*cking 'h' in it.

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41. Comment #134629 by Dune010 on February 28, 2008 at 3:58 am

To add one vocabulary issue to your list (in the words of Eddie Izzard): Herbs is not pronounced 'erbs. Cause it has got a f*cking 'h' in it.

Does that mean that leisure has to be pronounced lie-zur-eye-ay?

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42. Comment #134632 by quill on February 28, 2008 at 4:01 am

I'm not a fan of Hillary Clinton, but anyone can see that her quote in this video, "I think you can sense how we are attempting to try to inject faith into policy," was taken way out of context. Are we actually supposed to believe that she was saying this was a good thing?

What an amateurish video. I'm amazed that this kind of article gets listed here, while the groundbreaking Pew study on American religious attitudes which came out several days ago was not, even though br0k3nglass created a thread for it on the politics forum and I know several people emailed it in to articles@RichardDawkins.net to be listed.

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43. Comment #134637 by Geoff on February 28, 2008 at 4:06 am

clodhopper, you owe me a mouthful of coffee and a new keyboard.

Other Comments by Geoff

44. Comment #134646 by epeeist on February 28, 2008 at 4:16 am

Comment #134614 by YssiBoo

But if accessibility of booze is the only problem you can find with a country I would say it doesn't have any problems worth mentioning.

Things to enjoy sailing between Sweden and Finland

1. Crayfish season. Eating a tray full of crayfish accompanied by vodka. The only downside being the amount of swell that seemed to occur during the process
2. Sailing into the harbour on a small island, booking the public sauna, chopping the wood for the stove. Taking the sauna punctuated by running out and diving into the sea without the necessity of dressing first
3. Lumparland on Aland (Oompah Lumpar..)
4. Stockholm, one of the most beautiful cities I have ever been in
5. The vast number of islands in the archipelago

The only downsides - navigating the vast number of islands and the ferries that travel between Sweden and Finland - frighteningly huge if you are in a 10m yacht.

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45. Comment #134655 by godless_badass on February 28, 2008 at 4:34 am

clodhopper - whenever Germans manage to build anything like a Jeep Wrangler, I'm game. Untill then, don't touch my TJ !
ah, and make it one DELL Latitude D600 and an optical mouse added to Geoff's keyboard and coffee :)))

Other Comments by godless_badass

46. Comment #134658 by Steve Zara on February 28, 2008 at 4:38 am

Comment #134646 by epeeist

5. The vast number of islands in the archipelago

And, something unbelievably cute: Eider ducks swimming in the sea.. whole families including chicks bobbing on large waves.

Other Comments by Steve Zara

47. Comment #134666 by Richard Morgan on February 28, 2008 at 4:50 am

Yssiboo

Herbs is not pronounced 'erbs. Cause it has got a f*cking 'h' in it.

Well, honestly!!!

Other Comments by Richard Morgan

48. Comment #134676 by YssiBoo on February 28, 2008 at 5:02 am

Dune010: HAHA! I had forgotten about that one.
Richard Morgan: Point taken. :p I'm Norwegian so I will stop lecturing english now. :)

For a bit of Mr Izzard, here is his thesis on the AE-BE divide: Clicky

Other Comments by YssiBoo

49. Comment #134677 by rod-the-farmer on February 28, 2008 at 5:06 am

My favourite verse from the bible would be "The End"

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50. Comment #134682 by Tyler Durden on February 28, 2008 at 5:14 am

Comment #134611 by clodhopper

John Cleese? http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/blrevocation_cleese.htm

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