Monday, August 18, 2008 | Reason : In the News | print version

Catholic leaders block contraceptive advice for 30,000 Scots girls

by News Scotsman

Thanks to Linda Ward Selbie for the link.

http://news.scotsman.com/latestnews?articleid=4398680

Catholic leaders block contraceptive advice for 30,000 Scots girls
By Fiona Gray

A VACCINE against cervical cancer will be given to schoolgirls without them receiving any safe sex advice as a result of a controversial deal struck between the Catholic Church and health officials, Scotland on Sunday can reveal.

From next month, 12 and 13-year-old girls at all schools in the country will start receiving the jab in a bid to cut deaths from cervical cancer caused by the human papilloma virus (HPV), which can be passed on during sex.

The Catholic Church originally raised objections to the jab on the grounds it could encourage promiscuity, but has made a U-turn after reaching an agreement with health and education bosses.

The deal means girls getting the HPV jab will not receive any accompanying advice on the need to use condoms to protect themselves from other sexually transmitted diseases.

Health campaigners and parents' groups last night reacted angrily to the deal, warning that the sexual health of thousands of young Scottish women was being put at risk to avoid a moral backlash from the Catholic Church.

Many sexual health experts believe it is essential to give out safe sex advice alongside the jab to make it clear they will remain at risk from other STIs including HIV, chlamydia and gonorrhea. More than half of the 5,000 female chlamydia patients in Scotland last year were under the age of 20.

The vaccine has been shown in trials to be highly effective in stopping cervical cancer caused by HPV if given to girls before they start sexual activity. Such cancers account for about 70% of cases of cervical cancer, which claims about 100 lives in Scotland every year.

When the decision to give the jab was announced by ministers in August 2006, a spokesman for Cardinal Keith O'Brien warned it could be seen by pre-teenage girls as a "green light" for sexual activity.

The programme is due to start next month and schools are set to send out consent forms for the scheme from the beginning of September.

The Catholic Church has now decided it will back the programme, with the jabs being available in its own schools. Spokesman Ronnie Convery revealed: "We have been in fruitful discussion with the health and education authorities, and we are satisfied that the programme to be rolled out across the country now is a responsible and ethically appropriate one."

Director of the Scottish Catholic Education Service (SCES) Michael McGrath added: "We wanted to make sure any support materials were appropriate in the Catholic schools, and we didn't want HPV and cervical cancer to be linked with artificial contraception. The factual information about the vaccine and cervical cancer are still there, but it doesn't promote particular kinds of sexual behaviour. We had discussions about it, we looked at various forms of words and came to an agreement. It took some months."

Scotland on Sunday has examined the leaflets going out to schoolgirls who receive the jab and there is no mention of using condoms to protect against other STIs.

A spokeswoman for the Family Planning Association (FPA) said it was a missed opportunity. Chief executive of the FPA Julie Bentley said: "The HPV vaccination will only protect young women from two strains of HPV leading to cervical cancer. It is critically important that young people understand the need to use condoms to protect them from other STIs."

Scotland Patients' Association chairwoman Margaret Watt said: "This message should be highlighted and underlined — please remember this injection doesn't protect you from sexually transmitted diseases or becoming pregnant."

Justine Roberts, co-founder of Mumsnet, said parents would be annoyed by the omission. She said: "The moral position is being imposed upon them. It seems a bit archaic to let the Catholic Church decide on this."

A Scottish Government spokesperson said: "The HPV vaccine is about saving lives and protecting future generations of young girls from cervical cancer.

"Scottish Government officials consulted with many stakeholders and undertook research with parents and girls to ensure the right level of information was included in the leaflet. The Scottish Government is absolutely committed to promoting safer sex, and we are taking forward our sexual health strategy 'Respect and Responsibility'."

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1. Comment #232548 by Stormkahn on August 18, 2008 at 10:48 am

So if I get this right then the morals of Scots Catholics trump the health and safty of the female population?

fuckwits.

Other Comments by Stormkahn

2. Comment #232550 by EvidenceOnly on August 18, 2008 at 10:49 am

The catholic church will do anything to avoid sex education and advocating condoms.

Its stance against condoms and the claim by some of its church leaders that condoms are intentionally infected with bacteria to kill Africans causes about 1.6 million HIV deaths in Africa EACH YEAR.

They preach the sanctity of life but it is really about the sanctity of their "holy" book.

Another example of "do as I say, not as I do".

In perspective, 1.6 million deaths each year is 1.6 "9/11" every day.

Other Comments by EvidenceOnly

3. Comment #232554 by J Mac on August 18, 2008 at 10:53 am

"The Catholic Church originally raised objections to the jab on the grounds it could encourage promiscuity"

Yeah, and my tetanus shot is making me more likely to shove a rusty nail through my eye. How fucking ridiculous.

Although on the bright side this can be considered a partial victory, at least the vaccine is being provided.

Other Comments by J Mac

4. Comment #232559 by jimbob on August 18, 2008 at 10:55 am

Apart from the obvious nonsense, a key point here is whether these catholic schools are taxpayer funded? If they are, UK taxpayers should be up in arms!

Other Comments by jimbob

5. Comment #232560 by kkelly on August 18, 2008 at 10:56 am

Just a reminder, men can get Gardasil too if they ask their health care provider. It's not approved for men but it's prescribed as "off label". Gardasil also protects against the two strains that cause 90% of genital warts.

Other Comments by kkelly

6. Comment #232561 by Baron Scarpia on August 18, 2008 at 10:56 am

This is truly bizarre. 'Oh no!' the Vatican presumably cried out. 'A vaccine against cancer! It's outrageous!'

I can't quite get my head around this novel concept. Does this mean that if a vaccine was found for HIV and rolled out nationally, bishops would be up in arms?

Other Comments by Baron Scarpia

7. Comment #232562 by Steve Zara on August 18, 2008 at 10:58 am

Comment #232560 by kkelly

Is there a way to protect against irritating infections of websites?

Other Comments by Steve Zara

8. Comment #232563 by kkelly on August 18, 2008 at 10:59 am

7, retirement.

Other Comments by kkelly

9. Comment #232568 by Veronique on August 18, 2008 at 11:01 am

Yes Stormkahn, you get it right. I cannot understand why the Health authorities appease the damned Catholic Church with whatever feeble excuse they have used to blubber the timorous apologetics by even allowing some religious group to enter into public health initiative debates.
What the hell has public health got to do with an outdated, morally moribund organisation that lives in a magic bubble that propounds lollies from god provided that everyone follows the dictates of their church?
Get all of them out of the public sphere and remove them from any public sphere of influence. They have shown themselves incapable of tolerance, honesty, integrity and the well being of society in general. They are a blight on the moral landscape and should be treated with no credibility whatsoever.
And I am being kind. Wait 'til Logicel makes a comment!!
Cheers
V

Other Comments by Veronique

10. Comment #232570 by Steve Zara on August 18, 2008 at 11:02 am

Comment #232563 by kkelly

Actually, I think it is enough people reacting to that infection and marking it as troll.

You have a clever tactic. Intersperse enough trolling nonsense with occasional lucidity to make people confused about your intentions.

I have no hesitation in marking your posts as trolling from now on.

Other Comments by Steve Zara

11. Comment #232572 by kkelly on August 18, 2008 at 11:04 am

10, what about that comment did you object to?

Other Comments by kkelly

12. Comment #232574 by Nogodscanuck on August 18, 2008 at 11:06 am

People who are celibate (yea right) being the experts on sex. Is this an ox-moron?

Other Comments by Nogodscanuck

13. Comment #232576 by funkyderek on August 18, 2008 at 11:09 am

So, thanks to the interference of the Catholic church, these girls will receive the vaccine and will be told what it's for (or at least somehow find out) but won't be told that there are other risks associated with sexual activity or how to best avoid those risks.
I know the Catholic church desperately wants to increase its numbers but surely allowing teenage girls to think they can have unprotected sex without consequences is beyond the pale, even for them?

Other Comments by funkyderek

14. Comment #232582 by Eventhorizon on August 18, 2008 at 11:19 am

I can already see the catholic church wriggling their way out of this in few years time after the fallout.
If they want fuck up their lives in anticipation of a next life then fine but why do they try to compensate themselves by trying to fuck up everyone elses.
JOSH, please make the next post more optimistic - this is too depressing!

Other Comments by Eventhorizon

15. Comment #232584 by liberalartist on August 18, 2008 at 11:21 am

I remember reading something similar happening in Canada. We are talking about young girls here, starting at age 9. Of course for Catholic leaders, I guess 9 is about the "right" age for sex! They disgust me.

Other Comments by liberalartist

16. Comment #232593 by blakjack on August 18, 2008 at 11:28 am

The so-called "health officials" are totally spineless to give in to this minority (Catholic) point of view.

So a challenge. Why can't non-religious organisations hand out sex advice leaflets to girls outside doctors' surgeries? It might spark the long-overdue battle between secularists and the religious and bring religion into mainstream politics where it deserves to be.

Jack

Other Comments by blakjack

17. Comment #232603 by Ivan The Not So Bad on August 18, 2008 at 11:37 am

These are state funded schools and if any school will not act according to what the state believes to be in the best interests of the children's health, stop the funding.

Sadly, considering the devastation caused by the spread of HIV on the back of Catholic teaching in Africa, this is, in the words of David Bowie, "a God awful small affair".

Other Comments by Ivan The Not So Bad

18. Comment #232609 by JemyM on August 18, 2008 at 11:46 am

Genocidal stupidity.

Other Comments by JemyM

19. Comment #232614 by Dax on August 18, 2008 at 11:53 am

Let me get this straight: "if we don't talk about it, it doesn't exist"?

Catholic problem: we are afraid that girls will think this vaccine will protect them from all kinds of VDs and thus have unprotected sex.
Real solution: we couple the vaccine with an extensive sex-ed program, teaching kids about safe sex (including that abstinence is the safest).
Catholic solution: x-nay on the safe s-nay-ex.

Other Comments by Dax

20. Comment #232618 by Diacanu on August 18, 2008 at 11:55 am

The catholic church can't collapse fast enough.

If there's still a fucking Pope and a Vatican when I'm 80, I'm going to be very bitter, and you're all going to hear about it on my final HBO special.

Other Comments by Diacanu

21. Comment #232622 by root2squared on August 18, 2008 at 11:59 am

Do these people not have any moral sense of right and wrong? To wilfully keep others in ignorance of facts that may help them is cruel.

Sometimes I wonder if this is not just a case of "I'm not getting laid, so you're not either". I guess preventing others from having sex would be helpful in spreading your genes. I don't seriously think this is true, as prof. Dawkins has warned against a tendency to start applying evolutionary theory recklessly. Just a thought.

Other Comments by root2squared

22. Comment #232627 by Eventhorizon on August 18, 2008 at 12:06 pm

Ok Im no longer pissed off - the final part of 'The Genius of Darwin' has just started

Other Comments by Eventhorizon

23. Comment #232641 by Logicel on August 18, 2008 at 12:27 pm

Welcome back, V at #9! You made me laugh and eased my ire a bit so all I can muster is that these pious parasitic males have a sex change forced on them, the cancer vaccine denied them, then get raped by an infected male, and when they are dying in agony from cervical cancer, I stand by their bedside laughing my head off.

Did I disappoint?

Other Comments by Logicel

24. Comment #232658 by padster1976 on August 18, 2008 at 12:52 pm

'result of a controversial deal struck between the Catholic Church and health officials'

I'm sorry, but WHY THE FUCK SHOULD THERE HAVE BEEN 'A DEAL'?

Other Comments by padster1976

25. Comment #232664 by shad0w on August 18, 2008 at 1:00 pm

This just doesn't make any sense. As far as i know and correct me if i am wrong, Bishops, priests, etc are suppose to abstain from sex. Safe or otherwise...
How can then anyone _especially_ goverment officials accept their 'expert' advice on sex?

Do they call up the gardener to get 'expert advice' regarding missile defence or astrophysics ?

Other Comments by shad0w

26. Comment #232666 by pwuk on August 18, 2008 at 1:03 pm

putting lives at risk for jesus.

Other Comments by pwuk

27. Comment #232667 by bluebird on August 18, 2008 at 1:07 pm

This kind of news makes my usually normal blood pressure go off the chart. grrrrrrrrrrrrr

Seems the Family Planning Association has similiar frustrations and roadblocks as Planned Parenthood. grrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Other Comments by bluebird

28. Comment #232668 by padster1976 on August 18, 2008 at 1:09 pm

I'M PUTTING THIS ON FACEBOOK - LETS GET A PARTY STARTED AND RAISE SOME CONSCIENCES!!!!!!

SPREAD THE WORD...

Edit- Oh bollock! Can't get facebook to work - will try later for those that give a shit.

Other Comments by padster1976

29. Comment #232669 by mr-zero on August 18, 2008 at 1:11 pm

WTF!
Why on earth is anyone listening to these genocidal morons let alone making deals with them.
I say again. WTF!
Z

Other Comments by mr-zero

30. Comment #232670 by Diacanu on August 18, 2008 at 1:12 pm

Oh, shit, welcome back, Veronique!!

*Waves*

Didn't even see you there. :P

Other Comments by Diacanu

31. Comment #232679 by johnc91 on August 18, 2008 at 1:29 pm

How does this jab promote promiscuity? It is a ridiculous and extremely poor excuse. It is just another way for religion to exclude itself from the 21st century.
I really hope teenagers aren't stupid enough to believe that this jab wil protect them from pregnancy and STI's. However if they are they need lots of sex education.
Religion is holding science, technology and modern medicine back, which shouldn't be the case in the modern age.

Other Comments by johnc91

32. Comment #232681 by Corylus on August 18, 2008 at 1:31 pm

The Catholic Church has now decided it will back the programme, with the jabs being available in its own schools.

Looks like it got this concession by threatening to deny access to the girls in their schools. Scumbags.

We wanted to make sure any support materials were appropriate in the Catholic schools, and we didn't want HPV and cervical cancer to be linked with artificial contraception.

No just death.
---

Veronique, sweetheart - so lovely to see you back.

Other Comments by Corylus

33. Comment #232700 by Raiko on August 18, 2008 at 1:58 pm

Why do the twats of the Catholic Church have any say in this?

But it's nothing new that they're not so fond of women, is it? Might as well get rid of a few. I think not getting the shot and teaching kids about it, completely, and urge them to get the shot themselves, would have been more effective than this idiot compromise.

It is just another way for religion to exclude itself from the 21st century.

Not only the 21st century...

Other Comments by Raiko

34. Comment #232709 by Szymanowski on August 18, 2008 at 2:11 pm

A VACCINE against cervical cancer will be given to schoolgirls without them receiving any safe sex advice as a result of a controversial deal struck between the Catholic Church and health officials, Scotland on Sunday can reveal.

I can't believe I'm reading this, it's just insane. Why would health officials even need to LISTEN to the Catholic Church?

Other Comments by Szymanowski

35. Comment #232712 by Skutter on August 18, 2008 at 2:15 pm

Why does the world's largest organised pedophile ring have ANY say in this matter?

What's happening Scotland!

Other Comments by Skutter

36. Comment #232715 by Quetzalcoatl on August 18, 2008 at 2:18 pm

Padster1976-

I'm sorry, but WHY THE FUCK SHOULD THERE HAVE BEEN 'A DEAL'?

I thought this, but the Catholics would have the power to prevent the jab being administered to girls in Catholic schools. This deal could be considered the lesser of two evils- it's just so damn irritating that it's even necessary.

Other Comments by Quetzalcoatl

37. Comment #232719 by Luthien on August 18, 2008 at 2:21 pm

If it's anything like the catholic school I went to as a teen they won't be getting any teaching about contraception anyway! The teacher handed out leaflets about it while telling lots of embarassed teenage girls that it was a sin and she was only handing out the leaflets because required by law. People were puting them in the bin without reading them, cause they didn't want to bring them home, and we certainly didn't get an opportunity to read them in class.

Other Comments by Luthien

38. Comment #232720 by AllanW on August 18, 2008 at 2:25 pm

Thanks, Luthien, for the first-hand narrative. I seem to remember that Frank Zappa had something to say about Catholic Girls ...

(where's Podaar when I really need him? He's the only other guy who knows who Frank Zappa is :))

Other Comments by AllanW

39. Comment #232734 by Nephite on August 18, 2008 at 2:39 pm

Why does the Catholic Church have so much influence?

Other Comments by Nephite

40. Comment #232739 by Manson on August 18, 2008 at 2:42 pm

I don't understand why the U.K. (or any government for that matter) doesn't just set up free immunizations at local shopping malls. That's where all the kids are any way.

Walk up, register, get your shot, get a cookie. Oh and feel free to take some safe sex brochures for you and your friends. Don't want the shot? Don't get one. Don't want the literature, don't take it. Done.

"To ask permission is to seek denial." --unknown

Other Comments by Manson

41. Comment #232759 by D'Arcy on August 18, 2008 at 2:59 pm

When the decision to give the jab was announced by ministers in August 2006, a spokesman for Cardinal Keith O'Brien warned it could be seen by pre-teenage girls as a "green light" for sexual activity.

My opinion of both Cardinal Keith O'Brien, and the Catholic hierarchy in general would require a Shakespeare to express correctly. As a mere mortal, I can only use the same language, to describe the Catholics specifically and all religios in general, as the cardinal when he described stem cell research as "monstrous" and of "Frankenstein proportion".
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article3597851.ece

I'm sure that David Robertson's (Wee) Free Church of Scotland will sort out the doctrinal disputes with the papists in an ecumenical pronouncement condemning non-belief in God as the root of all evil.

Other Comments by D'Arcy

42. Comment #232838 by secondsoprano on August 18, 2008 at 5:33 pm

Steve Zara said:

Does this mean that if a vaccine was found for HIV and rolled out nationally, bishops would be up in arms?

Of course, because that would mean those evil homosexuals would be free to have sex without the risk of dying a horrible death (of course, they'll still go to hell, so that's some comfort, but it would be so much better if they suffered here too, seeing as that is god's plan).

/sarcasm.

kkelly said:

what about that comment did you object to?

Very disingenuous. You and the Catholic church have a similar need to make everything about sex.

Other Comments by secondsoprano

43. Comment #232841 by GordonYKWong on August 18, 2008 at 5:39 pm

Wait a minute...

A threat of 100% chance of damnation in hellfire is not enough to discourage promiscuity?

But a vaccine that reduces the chance of cervical cancer by 70% would turn these sweet catholics girls into raging nymphos?

What does that say about their own dogma? They don't even think it will work...

Other Comments by GordonYKWong

44. Comment #232843 by Goldy on August 18, 2008 at 5:44 pm

From New Zealand
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/1/story.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10508192
However

Bishop questions girls' access to pill
7:00AM Wednesday May 07, 2008

Your Views
Should there be free access to the emergency contraceptive pill?

Register for Your Views
A Catholic bishop says widening young girls' access to the morning-after contraceptive pill could increase their vulnerability to unwanted sex.

"In my opinion, greater access to this pill has the potential to make women, young girls in particular, more vulnerable to pressure to have unwanted sex," Bishop Peter Cullinane said.

He was commenting on the Herald report yesterday that an Auckland District Health Board committee would today consider a staff proposal to make the emergency contraceptive pill free at community pharmacies for girls and women.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/1/story.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10508413
And of course women commentators get into the act as well...
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/466/story.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=10509357

Other Comments by Goldy

45. Comment #232845 by J Mac on August 18, 2008 at 5:48 pm

Wow, that quote (of goldy's) displays a complete ignorance of human behavior.

The morning AFTER pill.... increases vulnerability to unwanted sex?

Its reverse causality, who woulda' thunk it.

Yes, of course I realize that they mean that having the option would make people not take sex seriously. But seriously, what horny teenager is sitting in the back of their parents car with their significant other weighing over the options thinking "well, there is that morning after pill, so what the hell, let'me get pregnant."

Other Comments by J Mac

46. Comment #232846 by Goldy on August 18, 2008 at 5:52 pm

Could always do it the way Afghans and Pakistanis do it...
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/the-afghan-women-jailed-for-being-victims-of-rape-900658.html

Other Comments by Goldy

47. Comment #232848 by Laurie Fraser on August 18, 2008 at 5:55 pm

Comment by Allan W

(where's Podaar when I really need him? He's the only other guy who knows who Frank Zappa is :))

Ahem! *Looks sternly and wriggles eyebrows whilst waving baton*

Other Comments by Laurie Fraser

48. Comment #232849 by kkelly on August 18, 2008 at 6:02 pm

42, Secondsoprano, that was not disingenuous. There was nothing pointless or offensive about my comment so I naturally asked why he chose that one to get prickly and childish about.

Other Comments by kkelly

49. Comment #232850 by Ed-words on August 18, 2008 at 6:03 pm

To J Mac (Comment No.3)- - -

If you're comparing sex to shoving a rusty nail

into your eye, you're doing it wrong.

Other Comments by Ed-words

50. Comment #232851 by LaurieB on August 18, 2008 at 6:05 pm

Allan W

Although not a guy, I certainly know who Frank Zappa is. I saw him in concert in Portland, Maine in the late seventies. Had all his albums, etc. Dammit, where did I put those zircon encrusted tweezers?

Other Comments by LaurieB

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