1. Comment #99867 by Rtambree on December 17, 2007 at 5:55 pm

I don't think HD matters with four talking heads. If it was powerpoint slides or a documentary, sure, but in this case, I'm almost of the opposite persuasion - why not have a mp3 audio option?

The content wouldn't lose that much if it was just audio - and you could play it in when doing chores, commuting to work, or invading Poland (as atheists do).

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2. Comment #99868 by admin on December 17, 2007 at 5:57 pm

Rtambree,
I agree, it's not The Lord of the Rings or Titanic, with loads of special effects. :) The video was shot and mastered in HD, so (AT LEAST) in a few years when everyone has HD players of some sort we'll be able to release a nice version.

Honestly, if you have a DVD player with 1080p upscaling the DVD looks amazingly like HD. Regardless of your DVD player, the 4H DVD quality is really good.

And in case you missed it, the audio only mp3 option IS available HERE.

Josh

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3. Comment #99869 by Ben Jennings on December 17, 2007 at 5:59 pm

Forget audio only, I wanna see more of Hitch's awesome house! ;)

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4. Comment #99871 by Rtambree on December 17, 2007 at 6:02 pm

3. Comment #99869 by Ben Jennings

>Forget audio only, I wanna see more of Hitch's awesome house!

Audio as an option - not exclusive. If you want to drool over Hitchens' bookshelves in 1080i Blue-Ray Hi-Definition, by all means. :)

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5. Comment #99872 by Ben Jennings on December 17, 2007 at 6:03 pm

1080p, please. ;)

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6. Comment #99874 by Rtambree on December 17, 2007 at 6:05 pm

Excuse me.

Why not in 3D then on an IMAX screen?

We also want four commentary tracks on the DVD - director's commentary, cast commentary, technical and production crew commentary, and commentary from Alistair McGrath for those suffering insomnia.

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7. Comment #99880 by frost_byte101 on December 17, 2007 at 6:18 pm

We also want four commentary tracks on the DVD - director's commentary, cast commentary, technical and production crew commentary, and commentary from Alistair McGrath for those suffering insomnia.

That's priceless--I second it. And a making of.

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8. Comment #99882 by Rtambree on December 17, 2007 at 6:21 pm

A commentary track from Ann Coulter and Pat Robertson would be entertaining too.

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9. Comment #99892 by Zamboro on December 17, 2007 at 6:48 pm

THIRD OPTION:

HD-DVDs come in hybrid disc forms, which play both on HD-DVD players and regular DVD players. The discs contain two versions of the same film, one in HD and one in SD.

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10. Comment #99900 by HBarca on December 17, 2007 at 7:29 pm

Problem also is that format wars are still ongoing, you could release in both but I for one am not going to start buying all my DVD's in HD-DVD format, hybrid or not, and then Blu-Ray to become the dominant form. It is an amazing media though.

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11. Comment #99906 by thelivingbrian on December 17, 2007 at 7:54 pm

1080p! Wow! Perhaps you could do torrent files to save yourself the bandwidth. It's just a passing idea, I'm not trying to give Josh even more work.

Thanks guys, this place is awesome!

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12. Comment #99908 by JerryD385 on December 17, 2007 at 7:57 pm

I think Ill wait until the 2-disk unrated DVD is released, like any nerd worth his salt

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13. Comment #99909 by BathTub on December 17, 2007 at 8:00 pm

Yes, I would love some HD content. I would probably even pay to download it.

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14. Comment #99912 by Russell's Teapot on December 17, 2007 at 8:10 pm

Blu-ray? Are those the odd discs that only people with PS3s buy? ;)

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15. Comment #99914 by Ohnhai on December 17, 2007 at 8:28 pm

Blu-Ray please (<< currently enjoying GT5 Prologue, :P )

have you thought about making the content available on PlayStation Store and XBOX Live?

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16. Comment #99919 by Kinzuakid on December 17, 2007 at 8:58 pm

thelivingbrain (and all others): I am happy to torrent the file and seed it. I am downloading the 1080p version now and can post the .torrent file or send it on request.

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17. Comment #99920 by mdowe on December 17, 2007 at 8:59 pm

If you are going to go HD you have to justify it. So for the sequel I have a two word suggestion: pole dancers!! Ok, so this results in a vid of four of today's most influential atheist spokespersons gibbering incomprehensibly ... the male half of your target audience almost certainly won't notice. In fact we'll insist that it is best atheism video ever!

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18. Comment #99921 by Diacanu on December 17, 2007 at 9:08 pm

Can I have an MP3-only of this one too?

*Puppy-dog eyes, pout lip*

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19. Comment #99928 by jamesspills on December 17, 2007 at 10:05 pm

The HD is good if only to see some of Hitchens' reading material in the background.

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20. Comment #99929 by Don_Quix on December 17, 2007 at 10:13 pm

I'd rather forego the HD and instead have 3 other similar discussions in each of their respective houses with the host being required to drink as much as Hitchens did. That would be fair, enlightening, and profitable. :)

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21. Comment #99950 by eno on December 18, 2007 at 12:06 am

Quality of the image is not that important to me and for lots of other people. The story or content is always what people are looking for and The Four Horsemen certainly have it.

Idea for the next 'Conversations with Richard Dawkins':

The Dawk, Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Salman Rushdie and Philip Pullman

PLEASE!

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22. Comment #99972 by Geraint on December 18, 2007 at 2:23 am

Comment #99869 by Ben Jennings on December 17, 2007 at 5:59 pm
Forget audio only, I wanna see more of Hitch's awesome house! ;)

Oddly enough, you can, about half way through his interview on 'In Depth':
http://www.richarddawkins.net/article,1655,In-Depth-Christopher-Hitchens,Book-TV-C-SPAN2

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23. Comment #100020 by Kevin Ronayne on December 18, 2007 at 4:56 am

Many thanks to Josh for providing these clips. They provide a fascinating insight into the differences between the various formats. At one level I agree that you shouldn't really need a hi-def format to appreciate a discussion like this, but looking at these clips I know I'd choose the HD formats every time.

A couple of technical notes:

(1) The 1080 HD format will really tax your PC hardware - you'll need a suitably powerful graphics card and a 1920 x 1200 monitor to play it properly and appreciate it.

(2) The 480 ('DVD') format seems to confuse certain playback software. As you would expect, QuickTime plays it back properly. However, both Media Player Classic and AVS DVD player render it incorrectly - the aspect ratio is not wide enough (or too high). If you are using either of these players, you can manually override the aspect ratio, and set it to the correct 16:9. It will then display properly.

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24. Comment #100022 by Szymanowski on December 18, 2007 at 5:07 am

I'm not sure HD is necessary for four blokes chatting around a table. I'm not even sure that video is necessary for this, but I don't want to piss on your parade! Thanks for providing the clip and keep up the good work - this site is much appreciated!

*toddles off to download the audio version*

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25. Comment #100026 by eirik on December 18, 2007 at 5:15 am

It would be great if you started offering your own videos in HD. And as already mentioned, by using BitTorrent bandwith won't be an issue. Yes to HD and Torrents!

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26. Comment #100029 by krisking on December 18, 2007 at 5:27 am

I think it would be really good if they could capture the light which was emitted from the earth millions of years ago so that we can see evolution happening.

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27. Comment #100032 by steve99 on December 18, 2007 at 5:38 am

I think it would be really good if they could capture the light which was emitted from the earth millions of years ago so that we can see evolution happening.

It would, but we do see some awesome things in the fossil record. One of the most amazing things, I think, is the discovery of feathers, skin and scales in dinosaur fossils. The film "Jurassic Park" if re-done would look quite different!

We can see real, substantial evolution happening right now (not just bacteria becoming resistant to drugs). If you want some examples, message me.

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28. Comment #100035 by debaser71 on December 18, 2007 at 5:45 am

IMO HD HDD makes no difference to me. Whatever.

I don't like Christmas. It's a consumer orgy. I hate feeling obligated to buy gifts for people and I hate pretending that other people's gifts aren't (generally) a waste of money. I like a family part but I don't like the whole consumer affair.

I also don't like how Christmas is a time for religious people to shove their religion on others. Try saying, "Happy Holidays" and some old woman will glare at you. Nativities on government property, "happy birthday jesus" signs, wasteful energy use....it goes on and on. I long for a simple day, where I can spend quality time with my family (I am a father, husband, son, etc) without all the baggage that comes with christmas.

/rant off

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29. Comment #100041 by phasmagigas on December 18, 2007 at 6:00 am

I don't like Christmas. It's a consumer orgy. I hate feeling obligated to buy gifts for people and I hate pretending that other people's gifts aren't (generally) a waste of money. I like a family part but I don't like the whole consumer affair.

our family has got away from the multiple gift thing, thats one thing i absolutely detest.

the buying up of all that shit for everybody is nauseating. We now simply buy one gift each, pop them in a big pile and then on a hat pick of 1-10 #1 gets a gift, opens. then #2 can either grab gift from #1 or choose a new one, it turns into a game which is quite fun as later number fight for the 'best' gift. You leave with but one gift and have saved lots of resources because of it and dont feel like you have accumulated too much junk you honestly didnt want or need AND importantly had some fun with the family.

It works well because you try to buy something that people might actually like, it becomes a bit competetive. Bottles of wine work well, far better than some 'should never have been designed in the first place' electronic belly button cleaner.

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30. Comment #100043 by phasmagigas on December 18, 2007 at 6:04 am

I think it would be really good if they could capture the light which was emitted from the earth millions of years ago so that we can see evolution happening.

thats something thats always interested me, there will be some info out in the universe contained in light that was reflected from some dino or giant dragonfly but i guess its now highly fragmented due to interception from dust or planets or stars.

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31. Comment #100049 by RJCorfield on December 18, 2007 at 6:27 am

MP3 of this section would be interesting, or at least tell us which of the two huge files it's in and whereabouts.

Thanks

- Richard

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32. Comment #100050 by PaulJ on December 18, 2007 at 6:29 am

Here's my vote for a Super-8 cine film version...

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33. Comment #100463 by AtheistJon on December 18, 2007 at 4:37 pm

Anybody who owns an Xbox-360 will be able to playback an HD-DVD (but not a Blu-Ray disc). And, if I'm not mistaken, the HD-DVD format is commonly (in the industry) believed to have won the battle.

IMO, anyone who has actually seen a comparison of HD vs regular video is not likely to want to go back to normal PAL/NTSC quality videos.

I would say this is the case even for talking heads. An mp3 audio wouldn't give you the irony of Sam Harris' barbed comment towards Hitch about smoking... I was wondering if any of the other 3 horsemen would have the guts to say anything about it to him ;-) Professor Dawkins and Dan Dennett apparently have too much polite society drilled in to their psyches to admonish a friend.

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34. Comment #100561 by Zamboro on December 18, 2007 at 10:58 pm

AtheistJon: Not *anyone* who owns a 360. Remember they need to buy the HD-DVD addon drive.

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35. Comment #100672 by kryss187 on December 19, 2007 at 4:59 am

I am all for a HD DVD combo disk.

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36. Comment #100709 by celestial_nico on December 19, 2007 at 6:59 am

Totally agree with phasmagigas!

And I have been digging out some interesting links lately for those of you interested in the evolutionary origin of Saint NIcholas, Santa Claus and why New Year's Eve used to be called "Holy/Saint Prepuce" ... Worth checking out!

http://www.logosresourcepages.org/Holidays/santaclause.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Prepuce
http://www.americanantiquarian.org/Exhibitions/Christmas/santa.htm
http://www.worldhistoryblog.com/2005/12/evolution-of-santa.html

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37. Comment #100718 by cryptographix on December 19, 2007 at 7:47 am

I disagreed with Dennett/Hitchens on several points. I agreed with Dawkins on every point and Harris on all but one. I now have a better understanding of their differences, so I was glad to see this.

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38. Comment #100739 by AtheistJon on December 19, 2007 at 8:54 am

I tend to agree with Hitchens and Harris the most of all the Horseman. Hitchens has the most credibility when talking politics since he seems to have the most personal experience in actually visiting places abroad like Iraq. I just don't agree with Hitch about smoking (especially about forcing your friends to breath your second-hand smoke). His drinking seems also a bit over my limit, but that's sort of a minor disagreement. I find myself disagreeing with Dawkins the most... often about politics, although he seems to have eschewed/avoided the political Iraq discussions which Hitch was trying to bring up. I agree with Dawkins very strongly though about his attitude to truth and science... which is odd. I guess it goes to show that politics and truth are separate fields... Maybe the world needs to adopt a more scientific approach to politics (aha political science). Anyway, it would be a shame to link politics with atheism... since it would divide us in the same manner as with Christian denominations or Sunni's and Shia's.

On the other hand, it is nice to discuss politics with fellow atheists, despite our political differences, because you know that the foundations of our discussions are amenable. I wonder if anybody has done polling of atheist's political views? Hitchen's likes to say, "if you know that a person is atheist, you know nothing else about that person" (usually in the context of the Stalin discussion), but then when defending the morality of atheism, he tends to use the quip that "atheists wouldn't ever do that" (i.e. burn down your church)... Aren't these two views sort of a contradiction?

Regarding Daniel Dennett, my only gripe is that he tends to be too nice towards religion. Of all the 4 horseman, he's the only one who's books I haven't read (only watched his debate/YouTube appearances)... who has time for reading nowadays, when everything appears on YouTube?!!!

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39. Comment #100767 by bamboospitfire on December 19, 2007 at 10:02 am

This is bloody brilliant. One of the best things I have seen on this site to date. Thanks!

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40. Comment #102307 by whig on December 22, 2007 at 9:53 am

Hitchens seems a lot nicer about Christmas than he was on the clip of him singing Tom Lehrer's Christmas Carol, when he compared this month to living in North Korea.

AtheistJon, you bring up a few points I found worthy of comment. I agree with you I think about Hitchens on Iraq, as against Dawkins. Dawkins does take the British liberal stance on that, I would wish he were a little more critical. He tends to focus a little more on Christianity than Islam, which I think unfair. He uses the term American Taliban, for example, and I would have to disagree with that. American fundamentalists may be bad, but they don't stone women to death for being raped. But I suppose from a scientists' point of view, living in the West, he has had the most trouble on questions like evolution from Christians. Dennett's temperament is much more reserved than any of the other three, not that it did him much good it seems, but his books are worth reading. I've read Freedom Evolves and Breaking the Spell.

On your point about Hitchens saying that someone being an atheist tells us nothing more about them, I think the Objectivists are interesting on this. I had the President of the Ayn Rand Institute over for a talk in Dublin, and he said that in a way he preferred talking to students over here than in America, because we took criticism of religion for granted, that socialists at least claim to metaphysical rationality, so there can be a starting point. His view on politics was anti-Bush, because of religiosity of the Republican Party under the last few Presidents, and that Clinton wasn't really that bad economically.

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41. Comment #102379 by gabbydott on December 22, 2007 at 2:36 pm

Well, then: Mary Christmas for President! ho-ho-ho

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42. Comment #102383 by Dr Benway on December 22, 2007 at 2:50 pm

...the buying up of all that shit for everybody is nauseating. We now simply buy one gift each...

We outdo you. Each year we give each other the same gift: forgiveness. No shopping required!

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43. Comment #102522 by Teague on December 23, 2007 at 5:18 am

Where's tape 3 and 4? They only just got going and then they ended it.

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44. Comment #102544 by AtheistJon on December 23, 2007 at 7:36 am

Whig, thanks for your post!

Can you give me some more specifics about the interesting Objectivist material you referred to?

I've always been a big fan of Ayn Rand, but I have to take umbridge if that guy considers Clinton "not bad", in any respect. After 8 years of Mr. Rapist "intellectual" Clinton, and his friends on the religious left. I found myself strongly allied with the Rush Limbaugh crowd (to my astonishment). I remember feeling extremely satisfied with having Bush become president. Cannot comprehend liberals acceptance of all the Clinton horrors. And then hypocritical treatment toward GW Bush. Imagine what the media would do if Bush would trash the White House or pardon real criminals who are fugitives. Of course, I don't endorse his religious views, but I think the degree of his fundamentalism is exaggerated by the left. As far as Iraq and foreign policy is concerned, personally, I think Bush has done a wonderful job, although I also think that it is difficult, today, to be objective about such a hot political topic. I enjoy seeing Hitch debate peolple like Scott Ritter, it is extremely informative. I'm definitely on Hitch's side on this debate... and I think GW Bush is also on Hitch's side. Maybe Hitch should be President? (Let's see if a constitutional amendment will allow Arnold to run, and if so, then Hitch should immediately run ;-) Actually, I'm just joking, because I would miss his regular debates and articles on religion and politics.

Eventually I will get to reading Dennett... I have enjoyed his public debate appearances. He has a different approach/angle than the Hitch/Harris/Dawkins "religion is stupid" approach. It seems to have worked more effectively on my mother, too. How do you convince your own mother that religion is stupid? Not by introducing them to Hitch or Harris... but Dennett might actually work. Hitchens and Dawkins have been getting some really awesome debates/interviews on tv of late, so I might be wrong about this approach. They have been perfecting the atheist sound bite. But, the religious seem to have an unfair advantage in the eyes of people like my mother who when watching these types of interviews cannot seem to accept the "wishful thinking is not honest nor true" argument, nor can she understand, despite Dawkins' wonderful eloquence using the Teapot theory, erase the "atheism is fundamentalism" oxymoron/spin which apologists for religion (like my Mom) always use.

It also doesn't help that I still have an infatuation with Carl Sagan (who my mother still thinks is a nerd). She might be right, but I still think he was one of the most eloquent atheists of all time. Even his leftist politics seemed palatable, because his views never seemed carved in stone, rather they were reasoned and malleable. Perhaps that also has a lot to do with his wonderful use of Vangelis music! I also think that the marriage of astronomy and biology is something that more scientists ought to do. Simon Singh is one of the best substitutes for Carl Sagan, but to this day, only in book form, as far as I am aware.

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45. Comment #102768 by Dr Benway on December 23, 2007 at 3:31 pm

As far as Iraq and foreign policy is concerned, personally, I think Bush has done a wonderful job, although I also think that it is difficult, today, to be objective about such a hot political topic.

Dude, we thought we were invading Dr. No's island of scary WMDs. Turned out we invaded effin' Mexico.

People didn't do their jobs. They didn't properly evaluate circumstances in Iraq prior to the war. The evidence for WMDs was cooked. White House pressure drove the madness.

Our country once enjoyed unequalled respect in the world, for it's long tradition of fair play toward those less fortunate. Now we're viewed as just another manipulative bully serving its own interests.

The dollar is sinking through the floor as we borrow more to pay the interest on the debt we've already borrowed to fund a war we can't afford. People are losing their homes in record numbers.

"Wonderful" isn't the adjective that comes to mind when I think of Bush.

American "left" and "right" politics seems a strange misdirection to me. Do engineers solve problems from the left or the right? Aren't most of the problems we face matters of scientific understanding and engineering?

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46. Comment #102770 by Steve Zara on December 23, 2007 at 3:40 pm

I've always been a big fan of Ayn Rand

Would this be Ayn "For a woman qua woman, the essence of femininity is hero-worship – the desire to look up to man" Rand?

Or Ayn "I am humbly aware that the wife of a great man has to be contented with reflected glory" Rand?

or Ayn "there is a psychological immorality at the root of homosexuality" Rand?

Or some Ayn Rand I am unaware of?

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47. Comment #102774 by _J_ on December 23, 2007 at 3:49 pm

Dr B
Perhaps 'wonderful' in the sense of 'full of wonder', 'to be wondered at', 'I wonder how he ended up in charge'.

I'm pretty sure my reaction after your last election was something along the lines of 'What, Bush again? Oh, that's just wonderful'.

*Digressive anecdote alert*
I like America more than I did a few weeks ago, for wholly subjective and unscientific reasons. I was queueing for return tickets for Macbeth on the West End. About five minutes before the show, my sister and I had reached the front of the queue and two tickets became available - at £55 each. This was a touch beyond our budget, so we passed them on to the people behind us, the first of whom was a very pleasant American (possibly Canadian, I can't be certain, but I'm guessing USA) whom I'd been chatting with earlier. He took the ticket and, as he left, he shook my hand warmly and advised me to get a drink for me and my sister. I don't know whether it was because he'd overheard me describing on the phone how a job interview that day had gone really badly, or because we couldn't afford the insane ticket price, or because he was just really pleased to see the show, but as he did so, he slipped something into my hand which he would absolutely not let me get away without taking. It was a £5 note. I didn't need this money and felt a bit embarrassed to be given it, but I was very touched indeed. What a lovely man.

You may have an arsehole in charge of your foreign policy (indeed, all your policies), but in so far as America is 250M Americans, I currently feel that your "tradition of fair play toward those less fortunate" is still alive.

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48. Comment #102779 by AtheistJon on December 23, 2007 at 4:05 pm

Wonderful in the sense that, "wonderful, the POTUS is not a lying rapist!" That's just one reason. Leftism is clearly a dogmatic branch of thinking in the modern world. How else do you explain the ignoring of this simple case. Its astonishing how no leftist will go up against the immorality of the Clintons. Reminds one of a beloved communist dictator. I would be happy if people would be more engineer-like in their approach to politics, but I find leftists the most annoying group, since even this one single and simple concrete example of Clinton's behavior just slips through the cracks and they still find Bush bashing more worthwhile than wondering how Hillary Clinton (accomplice to a rapist, liar, briber) can possibly be considered seriously for the Presidency. On the other hand, I'd be willing to bet that 25 years (perhaps longer) from now, people will be looking back at Bush's presidency and, unlike Clinton or Carter, find a hero. Just imagine the day that the first terrorist nuclear bomb explodes somewhere. Who are they going to get mad at? Bush?

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49. Comment #102784 by AtheistJon on December 23, 2007 at 4:19 pm

That would be the Ayn Rand of the "altruism is not a virtue" who fled commmunist Russia after having seen first hand the flaws in that particular philosophy. I continue to admire her, eg. in the following interviews, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=go62Gl7aik4 and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzGFytGBDN8, where she talks about how the idea that love is above self interest is foolish. By the way, she was also a staunch atheist and promotor of the value of man's reasoning.

By the way, how does one setup those picture icons next to ones name in this blogging system?

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50. Comment #102786 by Steve Zara on December 23, 2007 at 4:27 pm

By the way, she was also a staunch atheist and promotor of the value of man's reasoning.

She was also an anti-feminist and homophobe.

I support atheists for their atheism. I don't assume that because they are atheists, that their views on other matters are worthy of consideration or admiration.

If you don't support her views on the matters I have mentioned, then you should qualify your admiration. Or are you prepared to worship such out-dated and illiberal views on the altar of libertarianism?

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