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Tuesday, October 7, 2008 | Reason : Physics and Chemistry | print version Print | Comments |

Document Big Bang or Big Bounce?: New Theory on the Universe's Birth

by Scientific American

Thanks to SPS for the link.

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=big-bang-or-big-bounce

Big Bang or Big Bounce?: New Theory on the Universe's Birth
By Martin Bojowald

Our universe may have started not with a big bang but with a big bounce—an implosion that triggered an explosion, all driven by exotic quantum-gravitational effects

Atoms are now such a commonplace idea that it is hard to remember how radical they used to seem. When scientists first hypothesized atoms centuries ago, they despaired of ever observing anything so small, and many questioned whether the concept of atoms could even be called scientific. Gradually, however, evidence for atoms accumulated and reached a tipping point with Albert Einstein's 1905 analysis of Brownian motion, the random jittering of dust grains in a fluid. Even then, it took another 20 years for physicists to develop a theory explaining atoms—namely, quantum mechanics—and another 30 for physicist Erwin Müller to make the first microscope images of them. Today entire industries are based on the characteristic properties of atomic matter.

Physicists' understanding of the composition of space and time is following a similar path, but several steps behind. Just as the behavior of materials indicates that they consist of atoms, the behavior of space and time suggests that they, too, have some fine-scale structure—either a mosaic of spacetime "atoms" or some other filigree work. Material atoms are the smallest indivisible units of chemical compounds; similarly, the putative space atoms are the smallest indivisible units of distance. They are generally thought to be about 10—35 meter in size, far too tiny to be seen by today's most powerful instruments, which probe distances as short as 10—18 meter. Consequently, many scientists question whether the concept of atomic spacetime can even be called scientific. Undeterred, other researchers are coming up with possible ways to detect such atoms indirectly.

The most promising involve observations of the cosmos. If we imagine rewinding the expansion of the universe back in time, the galaxies we see all seem to converge on a single infinitesimal point: the big bang singularity. At this point, our current theory of gravity—Einstein's general theory of relativity—predicts that the universe had an infinite density and temperature. This moment is sometimes sold as the beginning of the universe, the birth of matter, space and time. Such an interpretation, however, goes too far, because the infinite values indicate that general relativity itself breaks down. To explain what really happened at the big bang, physicists must transcend relativity. We must develop a theory of quantum gravity, which would capture the fine structure of spacetime to which relativity is blind.

The details of that structure came into play under the dense conditions of the primordial universe, and traces of it may survive in the present-day arrangement of matter and radiation. In short, if spacetime atoms exist, it will not take centuries to find the evidence, as it did for material atoms. With some luck, we may know within the coming decade.

Pieces of Space
Physicists have devised several candidate theories of quantum gravity, each applying quantum principles to general relativity in a distinct way. My work focuses on the theory of loop quantum gravity ("loop gravity," for short), which was developed in the 1990s using a two-step procedure. First, theorists mathematically reformulated general relativity to resemble the classical theory of electromagnetism; the eponymous "loops" of the theory are analogues of electric and magnetic field lines. Second, following innovative procedures, some that are akin to the mathematics of knots, they applied quantum principles to the loops. The resulting quantum gravity theory predicts the existence of spacetime atoms [see "Atoms of Space and Time," by Lee Smolin; Scientific American, January 2004].

Other approaches, such as string theory and so-called causal dynamical triangulations, do not predict spacetime atoms per se but suggest other ways that sufficiently short distances might be indivisible [see "The Great Cosmic Roller-Coaster Ride," by Cliff Burgess and Fernando Quevedo; Scientific American, November 2007, and "The Self-Organizing Quantum Universe," by Jan Ambjørn, Jerzy Jurkiewicz and Renate Loll; Scientific American, July]. The differences among these theories have given rise to controversy, but to my mind the theories are not contradictory so much as complementary. String theory, for example, is very useful for a unified view of particle interactions, including gravity when it is weak. For the purpose of disentangling what happens at the singularity, where gravity is strong, the atomic constructions of loop gravity are more useful.

The theory's power is its ability to capture the fluidity of spacetime. Einstein's great insight was that spacetime is no mere stage on which the drama of the universe unfolds. It is an actor in its own right. It not only determines the motion of bodies within the universe, but it evolves. A complicated interplay between matter and spacetime ensues. Space can grow and shrink.

Loop gravity extends this insight into the quantum realm. It takes our familiar understanding of particles of matter and applies it to the atoms of space and time, providing a unified view of our most basic concepts. For instance, the quantum theory of electromagnetism describes a vacuum devoid of particles such as photons, and each increment of energy added to this vacuum generates a new particle. In the quantum theory of gravity, a vacuum is the absence of spacetime—an emptiness so thorough we can scarcely imagine it. Loop gravity describes how each increment of energy added to this vacuum generates a new atom of spacetime.

The spacetime atoms form a dense, ever shifting mesh. Over large distances, their dynamism gives rise to the evolving universe of classical general relativity. Under ordinary conditions, we never notice the existence of these spacetime atoms; the mesh spacing is so tight that it looks like a continuum. But when spacetime is packed with energy, as it was at the big bang, the fine structure of spacetime becomes a factor, and the predictions of loop gravity diverge from those of general relativity.

Attracted to Repulsion
Applying the theory is an extremely complex task, so my colleagues and I use simplified versions that capture the truly essential features of the universe, such as its size, and ignore details of lesser interest. We have also had to adapt many of the standard mathematical tools of physics and cosmology. For instance, theoretical physicists commonly describe the world using differential equations, which specify the rate of change of physical variables, such as density, at each point in the spacetime continuum. But when spacetime is grainy, we instead use so-called difference equations, which break up the continuum into discrete intervals. These equations describe how a universe climbs up the ladder of sizes that it is allowed to take as it grows. When I set out to analyze the cosmological implications of loop gravity in 1999, most researchers expected that these difference equations would simply reproduce old results in disguise. But unexpected features soon emerged.

Gravity is typically an attractive force. A ball of matter tends to collapse under its own weight, and if its mass is sufficiently large, gravity overpowers all other forces and compresses the ball into a singularity, such as the one at the center of a black hole. But loop gravity suggests that the atomic structure of spacetime changes the nature of gravity at very high energy densities, making it repulsive. Imagine space as a sponge and mass and energy as water. The porous sponge can store water but only up to a certain amount. Fully soaked, it can absorb no more and instead repels water. Similarly, an atomic quantum space is porous and has a finite amount of storage space for energy. When energy densities become too large, repulsive forces come into play. The continuous space of general relativity, in contrast, can store a limitless amount of energy.

Because of the quantum-gravitational change in the balance of forces, no singularity—no state of infinite density—can ever arise. According to this model, matter in the early universe had a very high but finite density, the equivalent of a trillion suns in every proton-size region. At such extremes, gravity acted as a repulsive force, causing space to expand; as densities moderated, gravity switched to being the attractive force we all know. Inertia has kept the expansion going to the present day.

In fact, the repulsive gravity caused space to expand at an accelerating rate. Cosmological observations appear to require such an early period of acceleration, known as cosmic inflation. As the universe expands, the force driving inflation slowly subsides. Once the acceleration ends, surplus energy is transferred to ordinary matter, which begins to fill the universe in a process called reheating. In current models, inflation is somewhat ad hoc—added in to conform to observations—but in loop quantum cosmology, it is a natural consequence of the atomic nature of spacetime. Acceleration automatically occurs when the universe is small and its porous nature still quite significant.

Time before Time
Without a singularity to demarcate the beginning of time, the history of the universe may extend further back than cosmologists once thought possible. Other physicists have reached a similar conclusion [see "The Myth of the Beginning of Time," by Gabriele Veneziano; Scientific American, May 2004], but only rarely do their models fully resolve the singularity; most models, including those from string theory, require assumptions as to what might have happened at this uneasy spot. Loop gravity, in contrast, is able to trace what took place at the singularity. Loop-based scenarios, though admittedly simplified, are founded on general principles and avoid introducing new ad hoc assumptions.

Using the difference equations, we can try to reconstruct the deep past. One possible scenario is that the initial high-density state arose when a preexisting universe collapsed under the attractive force of gravity. The density grew so high that gravity switched to being repulsive, and the universe started expanding again. Cosmologists refer to this process as a bounce.

The first bounce model investigated thoroughly was an idealized case in which the universe was highly symmetrical and contained just one type of matter. Particles had no mass and did not interact with one another. Simplified though this model was, understanding it initially required a set of numerical simulations that were completed only in 2006 by Abhay Ashtekar, Tomasz Pawlowski and Parampreet Singh, all at Pennsylvania State University. They considered the propagation of waves representing the universe both before and after the big bang. The model clearly showed that a wave would not blindly follow the classical trajectory into the abyss of a singularity but would stop and turn back once the repulsion of quantum gravity set in.

An exciting result of these simulations was that the notorious uncertainty of quantum mechanics seemed to remain fairly muted during the bounce. A wave remained localized throughout the bounce rather than spreading out, as quantum waves usually do. Taken at face value, this result suggested that the universe before the bounce was remarkably similar to our own: governed by general relativity and perhaps filled with stars and galaxies. If so, we should be able to extrapolate from our universe back in time, through the bounce, and deduce what came before, much as we can reconstruct the paths of two billiard balls before a collision based on their paths after the collision. We do not need to know each and every atomic-scale detail of the collision.

Unfortunately, my subsequent analysis dashed this hope. The model as well as the quantum waves used in the numerical simulations turned out to be a special case. In general, I found that waves spread out and that quantum effects were strong enough to be reckoned with. So the bounce was not a brief push by a repulsive force, like the collision of billiard balls. Instead it may have represented the emergence of our universe from an almost unfathomable quantum state—a world in highly fluctuating turmoil. Even if the preexisting universe was once very similar to ours, it passed through an extended period during which the density of matter and energy fluctuated strongly and randomly, scrambling everything.

The fluctuations before and after the big bang were not strongly related to each other. The universe before the big bang could have been fluctuating very differently than it did afterward, and those details did not survive the bounce. The universe, in short, has a tragic case of forgetfulness. It may have existed before the big bang, but quantum effects during the bounce wiped out almost all traces of this prehistory.

Some Scraps of Memory
This picture of the big bang is subtler than the classical view of the singularity. Whereas general relativity simply fails at the singularity, loop quantum gravity is able to handle the extreme conditions there. The big bang is no longer a physical beginning or a mathematical singularity, but it does put a practical limitation on our knowledge. Whatever survives cannot provide a complete view of what came before.

Frustrating as this may be, it might be a conceptual blessing. In physical systems as in daily life, disorder tends to increase. This principle, known as the second law of thermodynamics, is an argument against an eternal universe. If order has been decreasing for an infinite span of time, the universe should by now be so disorganized that structures we see in galaxies as well as on Earth would be all but impossible. The right amount of cosmic forgetfulness may come to the rescue by presenting the young, growing universe with a clean slate irrespective of all the mess that may have built up before.

According to traditional thermodynamics, there is no such thing as a truly clean slate; every system always retains a memory of its past in the configuration of its atoms [see "The Cosmic Origins of Time's Arrow," by Sean M. Carroll; Scientific American, June]. But by allowing the number of spacetime atoms to change, loop quantum gravity allows the universe more freedom to tidy up than classical physics would suggest.

All that is not to say that cosmologists have no hope of probing the quantum-gravitational period. Gravitational waves and neutrinos are especially promising tools, because they barely interact with matter and therefore penetrated the primordial plasma with minimal loss. These messengers might well bring us news from a time near to, or even before, the big bang.

One way to look for gravitational waves is by studying their imprint on the cosmic microwave background radiation [see "Echoes from the Big Bang," by Robert R. Caldwell and Marc Kamionkowski; Scientific American, January 2001]. If quantum-gravitational repulsive gravity drove cosmic inflation, these observations might find some hint of it. Theorists must also determine whether this novel source of inflation could reproduce other cosmological measurements, especially of the early density distribution of matter seen in the cosmic microwave background.

At the same time, astronomers can look for the spacetime analogues of random Brownian motion. For instance, quantum fluctuations of spacetime could affect the propagation of light over long distances. According to loop gravity, a light wave cannot be continuous; it must fit on the lattice of space. The smaller the wavelength, the more the lattice distorts it. In a sense, the spacetime atoms buffet the wave. As a consequence, light of different wavelengths travels at different speeds. Although these differences are tiny, they may add up during a long trip. Distant sources such as gamma-ray bursts offer the best hope of seeing this effect [see "Window on the Extreme Universe," by William B. Atwood, Peter F. Michelson and Steven Ritz; Scientific American, December 2007].

In the case of material atoms, more than 25 centuries elapsed between the first speculative suggestions of atoms by ancient philosophers and Einstein's analysis of Brownian motion, which firmly established atoms as the subject of experimental science. The delay should not be as long for spacetime atoms.

Comments 1 - 50 of 70 |

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1. Comment #261506 by Pertwee's Bouffant on October 7, 2008 at 12:49 am

 avatarInteresting stuff. Made my eyes water reading it this early though. Still waiting for the coffee to kick in.

Other Comments by Pertwee's Bouffant

2. Comment #261507 by rod-the-farmer on October 7, 2008 at 12:51 am

 avatarFascinating that we have so many people on this site, who watch for news like this. I would have to spend my entire day browsing the web for neat stuff, and I find a lot of it already laid out for me here.

Other Comments by rod-the-farmer

3. Comment #261508 by Deadity on October 7, 2008 at 12:55 am

"They are generally thought to be about 10-35 meter in size, far too tiny to be seen by today's most powerful instruments, which probe distances as short as 10-18 meter"

Man, science hasn't progressed quite as quickly as I thought. Our probes suck.

Other Comments by Deadity

4. Comment #261526 by dhudson0001 on October 7, 2008 at 1:37 am

 avatarWonderful article. Nothing like waking up to reports of a new theory of the birth of our universe :)

Other Comments by dhudson0001

5. Comment #261528 by Steve Zara on October 7, 2008 at 1:45 am

 avatarI do wish people would use the term "singularity" with more care. Singularities are flaws in our models of reality. There is no reason to think that they are features of reality.

Other Comments by Steve Zara

6. Comment #261541 by King of NH on October 7, 2008 at 2:40 am

 avatarBumbles Bounce! (Damn you, Dawkins! Now I have a viral meme stuck in my head!)

This is fascinating. It could be completely wrong, but it does seem to tidy up some of the mess in astrophysics. When I have time, I'll have to audit some courses and revisit this. It sucks there's so much to learn in this world and I have only one brain to absorb it.

Other Comments by King of NH

7. Comment #261554 by dvespertilio on October 7, 2008 at 3:20 am

Leave it to the universe to always bounce back!

Other Comments by dvespertilio

8. Comment #261564 by Michael_Oudenalder on October 7, 2008 at 3:51 am

Very interesting article indeed. The last time I heard about developments on the research of the creation of the universe, scientists thought there was no dimension of time before the Big Bang. Thank goodness they stepped away from that =)

And yeah, just like King of NH, I'd have to rekindle my knowledge about physics before I understand all about this new theory.

Other Comments by Michael_Oudenalder

9. Comment #261569 by Jamie V on October 7, 2008 at 4:06 am

Using the difference equations, we can try to reconstruct the deep past.


So cool!

"A long time ago in a singularity far, far away..."

Other Comments by Jamie V

10. Comment #261585 by Rosbif on October 7, 2008 at 5:05 am

 avatarLove the idea, but gave up tryng to research all the maths that go with it.

Ah space/time atoms. Just what we need.
Space/time atoms so closely packed together that they create a fabric.
But did god have a hand in this fabric?
Did he cut the cloth?
Was he a tailor? Maybe the Jews were on to something after all.

I can feel a new cult coming on. The Armarniists.
The distant galaxies creating that shiny affect on god's new suit, the planets providing the designer buttons.
With a dusty old book and the promise of life on the spring collection after death, I could probably even persuade Tom Cruise on this one.

Other Comments by Rosbif

11. Comment #261587 by Azven on October 7, 2008 at 5:08 am

 avatarDeadity: Half way there...

BTW, it's hopefully obvious from the context, but just in case... '10-35 meter' means 10 to the power of -35 meters (10 meters divided by a trillion trillion trillion).

Other Comments by Azven

12. Comment #261591 by lol mahmood on October 7, 2008 at 5:20 am

 avatarThat straining noise you can hear is the sound of all the 'uncaused cause' cosmological christian apologists trying to shoehorn 'goddidit' into the hypothesis....

Other Comments by lol mahmood

13. Comment #261593 by isaone on October 7, 2008 at 5:34 am

In a similar vein I read an excellent book on similar approach called "The Endless Universe" http://www.actionbioscience.org/newfrontiers/steinhardt.html

After the third time through it began to make some sense . Very interesting but clearly over my pay grade.

Other Comments by isaone

14. Comment #261614 by Logicel on October 7, 2008 at 6:25 am

 avatarI suspect the author loves his work. His writing style allows his passion to shine through without mucking up the clarity of his prose.

The right amount of cosmic forgetfulness may come to the rescue by presenting the young, growing universe with a clean slate irrespective of all the mess that may have built up before.
____

The universe suffers from amnesia?

Other Comments by Logicel

15. Comment #261619 by Spinoza on October 7, 2008 at 6:36 am

 avatarWoo! Love infinities.

Other Comments by Spinoza

16. Comment #261630 by Swordmaiden on October 7, 2008 at 7:01 am

 avatarOh, I get SO frustrated ! I SO MUCH want to understand this as its something I am so interested in. But I do not have a mathematical brain so it is like reading Chinese...all this is like a foreign language which I am not privvy to! I wish someone would write a "..for Dummies" version for people like me,with simple pictures and diagrams, (I work better with images....maths just makes my brain shut down)I can't be the only one on this site who isn't a scientist boffin person? I still don't understand what "Relativity" is!! Anything I read to try to learn just assumes you already know all this basic stuff... I DON'T but I really want to!!!
SOMEONE HELP!

Other Comments by Swordmaiden

17. Comment #261634 by aquilacane on October 7, 2008 at 7:09 am

 avatarI can't wait until science accepts that time is nothing more than an observable concept and not actually real. Perhaps when we replace time with the equation that properly calculates the effect we observe (some sort of energy transfer) we can do all of these equations again. Yeah!

Other Comments by aquilacane

18. Comment #261635 by Mbee on October 7, 2008 at 7:12 am

 avatarSwordmaiden
You might try and get a copy of 'Relativity for the Layman'. It is an old book 1969, so it is probably out of print but Amazon (US) has an old copy (expensive though).

Don't know any books on the big bang though that I can recommend - anyone else?

Other Comments by Mbee

19. Comment #261641 by Swordmaiden on October 7, 2008 at 7:23 am

 avatarMbee

Thanks, I will have a look. Grateful for all suggestions.

I thought of looking at children's science books as they might be more my level. I LOVE Prof Dawkins Xmas Lectures; I just have to accept that I have the scientific capacity of an 8 year old.....I am good at lots of other things though....not a complete divvy! I blame it on bad maths teachers !

Other Comments by Swordmaiden

20. Comment #261649 by SomeDanGuy on October 7, 2008 at 7:32 am

Interesting stuff. Made my eyes water reading it this early though. Still waiting for the coffee to kick in.

Heh, I was about to say something similar, Bouffant. Gotta get a mugfull of coffee for these giant physics articles. I find them fascinating, but it's so far out of my knowledge base that it takes a lot of concentration.

Other Comments by SomeDanGuy

21. Comment #261652 by Dhamma on October 7, 2008 at 7:35 am

 avatarThis is probably the first article I've read before being published here *w000t*

It's a facinating article, but I'm eagerly awaiting Øystein's comment on this.

Other Comments by Dhamma

22. Comment #261658 by zeroangel on October 7, 2008 at 7:41 am

 avatarSwordmaiden:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=wteiuxyqtoM

Relativity and Simultaneity explained (at least part of it).

Other Comments by zeroangel

23. Comment #261702 by Scep on October 7, 2008 at 8:36 am

From the flat earth to the universe, the big bang, the multiverse and the big bounce.

Does it all fit into, "simplicity ends up in complexity" and then turns around. Let's hope we don't blow ourselves to bits, physically, environmentally or financially, in order to start from scratch.

Its wonderful to have an imagination!

Other Comments by Scep

24. Comment #261745 by NewEnglandBob on October 7, 2008 at 9:45 am

 avatarSwordmaiden:

I have recently read 6 Physics books by Feynman, Susskind, Rosenblum & Kuttner and McMahon but I still have some difficulty understanding what is in this article and I will read it a couple more times at least.

What this shows me is that I need to read more books and articles by Smolen, Bojowald and others.

For me, this is not frustrating, but exciting that there is so much more to learn.

Other Comments by NewEnglandBob

25. Comment #261755 by decius on October 7, 2008 at 10:15 am

 avatarComment #261528 by Steve Zara

I do wish people would use the term "singularity" with more care. Singularities are flaws in our models of reality.


Except, of course, for triune singularities.

Other Comments by decius

26. Comment #261759 by apoc on October 7, 2008 at 10:20 am

I believe that our universe is made of multiple bounces.

I imagine that black holes keep on feeding and moving through space. Then, it happens to find another black hole, fusing and growing stronger, also keeping on moving.

This could happen again, and again, until the energy density is uncontainable and then exploding, sending matter in all directions.

Meanwhile, as this happened in a sector of the universe, other black holes scattered throughout the universe could create the same phenomenon in another sector.

This way, the universe is not expanding. When you look at the big picture, it is moving matter back and forth. We just notice the expansion because we're part of such an explosion and thus we're too small, or technologically unable, to perceive or observe other explosions.

But, still, where did all this matter came from? How we came to be? How did it all begin?

Other Comments by apoc

27. Comment #261762 by ggab7768 on October 7, 2008 at 10:29 am

 avatarDude!!
gurgle...drool...gurgle...
I love this stuff.
The bounce theories have been around for ages in one form or another.
This is some exciting stuff here.
We is learnin'.

Other Comments by ggab7768

28. Comment #261763 by Oystein Elgaroy on October 7, 2008 at 10:34 am

 avatarThis is interesting, but I think it is worth to bear in mind that this is just one possible scenario within a framework for quantum gravity which is every bit as lacking in empirical evidence as string theory. Any theory of quantum gravity would have to get rid of the singularities in classical general relativity to be counted as successful.

Other Comments by Oystein Elgaroy

29. Comment #261769 by Sciros on October 7, 2008 at 10:48 am

 avatar
But, still, where did all this matter came from? How we came to be? How did it all begin?
Whoa the English got worse, too!

Other Comments by Sciros

30. Comment #261779 by owen375 on October 7, 2008 at 11:14 am

So ... the universe is rebooting.

Other Comments by owen375

31. Comment #261781 by William Carlton on October 7, 2008 at 11:18 am

 avatarDeadity, just in case you weren't joking, I think that 10-35 meter is meant to be read "ten to the negative thirty-fifth power", rather than "ten to thirty-five meters".

Just in case.

Other Comments by William Carlton

32. Comment #261782 by mordacious1 on October 7, 2008 at 11:19 am

 avatarAlso, if you click on the sciam link, the article has links within for clarification, eg. there is a link to an article from 2004 from Lee Smolin.

Other Comments by mordacious1

33. Comment #261791 by Steve Zara on October 7, 2008 at 11:32 am

 avatarComment #261763 by Oystein Elgaroy

A while back there was some criticism in New Scientist about such speculative scientific articles. They called in "Science Porn". It is the difference from describing cautiously that a certain model of the origin of the universe is possible, and saying "New Theory - Big Bounce!".

However, I find New Scientist is usually more guilty of this than Scientific American.

Other Comments by Steve Zara

34. Comment #261802 by Oystein Elgaroy on October 7, 2008 at 12:02 pm

 avatarComment #261791 by Steve Zara

One of the dangers of Science Porn is that it makes subjects like cosmology look more like guesswork and speculation than science. For people who are not specialists bouncing universes, inflation and dark matter all seem like equally crazy ideas, and unless one explains clearly what the empirical basis for these ideas is (respecitvely none, some, and quite a lot in these three cases), the impression they are left with is that cosmology is pure speculation, and that "goddidit" is as valid a theory as any other.

Other Comments by Oystein Elgaroy

35. Comment #261804 by Frankus1122 on October 7, 2008 at 12:08 pm

 avatar

"Science Porn"


I think these magazines try to walk a fine line between being 'sexy' and 'flashy' and interesting and highly accurate and careful.
The flashy headlines may draw in those who might otherwise not be interested but you have to ask at what cost?

Other Comments by Frankus1122

36. Comment #261808 by clodhopper on October 7, 2008 at 12:11 pm

 avatarA Vatican spokesman said later - "Catholics will have no difficulty with this as we believe that God has a great love for all sorts of bouncy things"

Other Comments by clodhopper

37. Comment #261809 by Bonzai on October 7, 2008 at 12:12 pm

 avatarHow about some "God porn"?

Other Comments by Bonzai

38. Comment #261811 by Count von Count on October 7, 2008 at 12:15 pm

 avatarSteve-

Great comments. I think there are many people who don't understand science, but want to hear about it. You can't blame them, but the result is wide spread misconceptions (such as with singularities) and "trashy science," that is, science which is much closer to science fiction than science.

I think the poster in Mulder's office in the X-Files was a prime example of this. It said, "I want to believe." When people hear about science, they want to hear about worm-holes, monsters, teleportation, etc. They miss out on the even more bizarre (and actually true) ideas, such as the double-slit experiment. Science does not need any decoration. It is already more fantastic than we can imagine.

Other Comments by Count von Count

39. Comment #261812 by clodhopper on October 7, 2008 at 12:17 pm

 avatarOh God YES, Oh God YES, Yes yes, God YES YEESSSS YESSSSSSSSS

Will that do?

Other Comments by clodhopper

40. Comment #261815 by Frankus1122 on October 7, 2008 at 12:27 pm

 avatarFor many years I thought my name was, in fact, 'God'.

Other Comments by Frankus1122

41. Comment #261818 by clodhopper on October 7, 2008 at 12:32 pm

 avatarThere are many many children on the estate round my way who all think their name is Gedere Now.

Other Comments by clodhopper

42. Comment #261844 by DWLehning on October 7, 2008 at 1:47 pm

 avatarI just read this in the print edition of Scientific American and I think it is very interesting stuff. Cosmology is one of several of my favorite areas of scientific research. It is exciting because there is so very much we do not know and that is yet to be discovered about the universe, but also our own planet and our solar system. Anyway, neat stuff.

Other Comments by DWLehning

43. Comment #261850 by gazzaofbath on October 7, 2008 at 2:00 pm

 avatarThe article is just speculation albeit inspired by extrapolation of current scientific theories under development. Nothing wrong with that - as long as some testable predictions come along somewhere along the line that have the potential to be tested in due course, then that's how science advances.

I also find these speculations far more interesting and exciting than an origin to the universe based on some Being clicking his fingers to bring the big bang into action. And that 'first cause' justification for the existence of a god has plenty of competition from some reasonable scientific speculations such as this article.

Other Comments by gazzaofbath

44. Comment #261854 by gazzaofbath on October 7, 2008 at 2:08 pm

 avatarSorry - another comment on this.

I've often wondered whether the pure singularity does actually exist - a point of infinite curvature in space.

This is becuse of my experience with mechanics and specifically elasticity of solid matter. Here it was theorised that a sharp crack-like feature should have a point of infinite stress just ahead of the crack tip. The mathematics is indisputable. However, at a high enough stress materials yield ('plasticity'). But the stress field should still be infinite at the crack tip. But what actually happens is the material distorts spatially - the crack tip blunts and is no longer sharp - hence no infinite stress (still very large though!).

A long winded analogy to suggest that perhaps other currently unknown laws of physics kick in in the vicinity of a singularity andstop it actually exisiting in its purest form. Though I've no doubt that surrounding balck holes and very significant gravity fields exist aroundabout.

Other Comments by gazzaofbath

45. Comment #261869 by quantum_flux on October 7, 2008 at 2:34 pm

 avatarQuantum loop gravity must be a succession of curl fields. Interesting that it might explain the origins of the Universe!

Also, I think that the bulk of "dark matter" and perhaps "dark energy" could be mostly unaccounted for electromagnetic forces. Gravity can not explain galaxy formation alone, but plasma currents resulting from voltage potentials between stellar bodies must play a significant role too.

Other Comments by quantum_flux

46. Comment #261935 by ~manic-depressive on October 7, 2008 at 4:34 pm

 avatar@Swordmaiden
I really recommend Brian Greene's "The Fabric of the Cosmos". He is both a great physicist and a brilliant communicator. He tries really hard to be understood. With regard to relativity, he explains it with analogy to Bart Simpson on a skateboard travelling near the speed of light. It's just fantastic.

I have been reading books on physics most of my life, though that is not my primary field of interest and Professor Greene's book is superior to work of Davies, Gribbin and definitely Hawking.

This article reminds of the time I wanted so much to be a mathematical physicist, or even just a pure mathematician. As Bertrand Russell said, mathematics has an austere beauty like that of sculpture. Unfortunately I was never a great mathematician nor a great physicist. Oh, with regard to my field of interest... Russell said that in his youth his love of mathematics was the one thing that kept him from suicide.

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47. Comment #261937 by Laurie Fraser on October 7, 2008 at 4:37 pm

 avatarI agree, ~md; Greene is a brilliant communicator. I thoroughly enjoyed "The Elegant Universe". Haven't read "The Fabric of the Cosmos", thanks for the tip.

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48. Comment #261950 by ~manic-depressive on October 7, 2008 at 4:52 pm

 avatarHi Laurie, I really have to get around to reading "The Elegant Universe". Unfortunately my reading list keeps piling up!

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49. Comment #261957 by Laurie Fraser on October 7, 2008 at 4:59 pm

 avatar~md, "The Elegant Universe" is a wonderful, wonderful book. I'm currently reading Lee Smolin's "The Trouble With Physics", which takes a very critical look at string theory, from a philosophy of science perspective. Highly recommended, as well.

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50. Comment #262011 by wndrwll84 on October 7, 2008 at 7:25 pm

This is the way the world begins
This is the way the world begins
This is the way the world begins
Not with bang but a bounce.


Kind of puts a happier spin on T.S. Eliot, doesn't it?

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