1. Comment #264410 by tkdvipers on October 14, 2008 at 11:05 am

I found that very nice to listen to.

I really like Rowan Williams, he reminds me of the narrator of a story tape I used to listen to at bed time as a kid.

I find Ricky Gervais very funny but also he has a good knowledge of basic science and philosophy, if you listen to his early radio shows you can sometimes hear him digress into this.

A very light exchange but good to hear none the less.

Other Comments by tkdvipers

2. Comment #264412 by LaurenceH86 on October 14, 2008 at 11:06 am

good chat, quite enjoyed Rowan's contribution

Other Comments by LaurenceH86

3. Comment #264413 by Quetzalcoatl on October 14, 2008 at 11:07 am

Light-hearted and fun to listen to. Most of the time I quite like Rowan Williams, he comes across well here.

Other Comments by Quetzalcoatl

4. Comment #264415 by Daydream Believer on October 14, 2008 at 11:13 am

Father Christmas does generate a moral code albeit a simple one that kids can understand (be good or you won't get any pressies) - on the other hand, Christianity says "be good or you won't get in to heaven" - pretty similar wouldn't you say.

Other Comments by Daydream Believer

5. Comment #264424 by SteveN on October 14, 2008 at 11:36 am

I too have a soft spot for the Archbishop of Canterbury, mainly because I feel rather sorry for him. He's head of the CofE (apart from Her Majesty, that is) and is clearly an intelligent man, and he always tries to be reasonable, but isn't it a bit embarrassing that a man in his position and education is made to look so desparate in a conversation with Ricky Gervais*?

*Who, I must say, I admire immensely. I literally cried with laughter watching his stand-up bit about the Garden of Eden and his dissection of 'Humpty Dumpty'.

Other Comments by SteveN

6. Comment #264425 by HandyGeek on October 14, 2008 at 11:38 am

That was top shelf. I've always liked Gervais and now even more. :D

Other Comments by HandyGeek

7. Comment #264427 by mbobo on October 14, 2008 at 11:42 am

A bit more unnerving are those who dwell a bit too much on "The Simpsons" to begin with...

Other Comments by mbobo

8. Comment #264429 by amalthea on October 14, 2008 at 11:43 am

Does anyone else think Rowan Williams sounds like the younger brother of Christopher Lee?

OK, just me then. Great voice though.

On topic though, It's typical of us Brits to take religion as a joke, both sides not getting too involved but happy to banter, especially if the religion is Church of England tea-sipping. Then I remember that this is the same Rowan Williams who admitted that Shari'a law would become integrated into British Law at some point. Not good, DO NOT WANT.

A

Other Comments by amalthea

9. Comment #264434 by gazzaofbath on October 14, 2008 at 11:56 am

I'm not sure about Rowan Williams - he seems a nice kindly sort of gent, but I think he is deeply intellectualy confused, even more so than the creationist variety of christian.

I've heard the guy before, seemingly genuinely agonised that an interviewer can't grasp his inoffensive but fuzzy and shapeless version of his religion.

He exudes reasonableness but you never really know precisely where he stands on critical issues. It's tempting to feel sorry for the guy playing referee between the pro- and anti-gay branches of his church, his big issue at the moment. But if he had any firm beliefs he would nail his colours to the mast and say precisely where he stands rather than trying to mediate between two profoundly opposing strands who will never agree. Of course if they split off it would reduce the size significantly of his empire.

I think basically he is an agnostic but hasn't the intellectual courage to make that final step....

Other Comments by gazzaofbath

10. Comment #264442 by Eshto on October 14, 2008 at 12:08 pm

HEY! WTF archbishop, why are you dissing Santa Claus?

Doesn't inspire morality? Hello, that's the whole point of it. "Don't fight with your brother or Santa will bring you both coal instead of presents". DUH!

Doesn't inspire art? Check out this masterpiece that I made at the age of four: http://eshto.deviantart.com/art/Eshto-age-4-98857756

EDIT: oops that's a snowman, but I definitely have one I made of Santa and his sleigh.

(You can be damn sure I made this depiction of my brother and me getting along so Santa would bring me presents)

Psshht. Santa owns Jesus any day.

Other Comments by Eshto

11. Comment #264445 by bendigeidfran on October 14, 2008 at 12:15 pm

That was pointless drivel by two smug self-worshippers. The Church of England has only recently sold it's millions of shares in the arms trade. That must be some disarming smile Rowan's got.

Other Comments by bendigeidfran

12. Comment #264453 by 8teist on October 14, 2008 at 12:25 pm

Yeah, I`ll forgive them both for that rather inane exchange.

Other Comments by 8teist

13. Comment #264455 by Swordmaiden on October 14, 2008 at 12:33 pm

Santa v Jesus...hmm..well I never believed Jesus would bring me prezzies when I was a weeny child...but Santa I actually wrote letters to!And it worked! Prayers didn't get me anywhere with god.
Is religion just a "grown ups" Santa? Believe in me and you'll go to heaven? At least children grow out of it !
Ricky Gervais...love him!
The Bish? Feel sorry for him. He always sounds like he's secretly an Atheist but just reciting the god stuff cos its his job. His interview with RD on Enemies of Reason was quite pathetic...he's very good at the "flowery" talk. Bless him.

Other Comments by Swordmaiden

14. Comment #264465 by Rawhard Dickins on October 14, 2008 at 12:57 pm

Rowan Williams doesn't know jack, yet he holds a highly influential position.


Let's see a sound argument from his side rather than the cosy, wishy-washy views he puts forward.

Other Comments by Rawhard Dickins

15. Comment #264478 by BicycleRepairMan on October 14, 2008 at 1:33 pm

"Belief in Santa doesnt generate a moral code.."

Neither does belief in God, it seems to be innate.

"..it doesnt generate art, it doesnt generate imagination"

Well, thats not entirely true, there are movies, pictures, poems, songs, hymns, paintings, dances and all sorts of shit about santa, perhaps they arent anything fancy or "serious" like some of the god-inspired arts, but thats probably because noone over the age of 5 takes Santa seriously.

Nonetheless Mr.Williams, none of these 3 "arguments" are really arguments at all, even if they were all true, it wouldnt actually elevate the "Case for God" over the "Case for Santa". The two are still on EVEN GROUNDS. I know you dont think so, but nothing you, or any of your fellow believers have ever said, has ever been convincing enough for me to take God out of the Santa-category of things I dont believe in.

Other Comments by BicycleRepairMan

16. Comment #264482 by Dr Technical on October 14, 2008 at 1:47 pm

I have no respect at all for Rowan Williams, he is clearly deluded and the head of delusional society.

As for intelligence, well if my kids can understand "the who created God ?" question and he can't, well that sounds pretty thick to me.

Any one who is the head of a death cult that seeks to perpetuate its lies by indoctrinating children is a pretty odious person in my mind.

Oh, and if he was THAT worried about world debt and poverty, he could sell all the church's assets and help them that way.

I'm sorry, but the bloke is a grade A berk.

Other Comments by Dr Technical

17. Comment #264486 by tvictor on October 14, 2008 at 1:56 pm

STUTTERING

Other Comments by tvictor

18. Comment #264488 by bendigeidfran on October 14, 2008 at 2:00 pm

He doesn't need 6 minutes with a giggling Gervais and his christ-like forgiveness horseshit, he needs 6 minutes with Hitchens kicking him in the nuts. Metaphorically.

Other Comments by bendigeidfran

19. Comment #264494 by Dr Technical on October 14, 2008 at 2:13 pm

Hitchens would destroy him.

Other Comments by Dr Technical

20. Comment #264499 by dochmbi on October 14, 2008 at 2:33 pm

@14 There IS no sound argument he could put forth to begin with.

Other Comments by dochmbi

21. Comment #264502 by Vinelectric on October 14, 2008 at 3:05 pm

I like the "refusing to receive God's forgiveness".


Actually, I try hard not to feel deeply offended when someone insults your intelligence in this manner.

Other Comments by Vinelectric

22. Comment #264504 by Homo economicus on October 14, 2008 at 3:15 pm

You can see them being flimed during the broadcast here:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=vJosQdY6P_A

Other Comments by Homo economicus

23. Comment #264507 by Apathy personified on October 14, 2008 at 3:31 pm

Ha - Ricky Gervais is getting some use out of his philosophy degree then.

I particularly liked his remark at the end, 'What's he here to plug?'

AoC yet again manages to speak without saying anything - he gets tongue tied far too easily when people dare to question his belief or even
any aspect of it.

Other Comments by Apathy personified

24. Comment #264531 by Inferno on October 14, 2008 at 4:55 pm

Vinelectric said:

I like the "refusing to receive God's forgiveness".

I would refuse it. I'm still angry about all those people he killed in the OT (not to mention the blameless animals in the flood). He should be seeking MY forgiveness!

Other Comments by Inferno

25. Comment #264533 by notsobad on October 14, 2008 at 5:14 pm

Belief in god doesn't generate a moral code.
It's just people writing down stories and, more importantly, rules to command others.

Other Comments by notsobad

26. Comment #264555 by christianapologetic on October 14, 2008 at 8:25 pm

Its videos like this why atheists never get any repect. Because do to their overwhelming lack of morals, they take things too lightly. Even the creator of the Universe. How dispicable. Oh by the way...anyone want to answer the question as to why we're not giving birth to monkeys; or visa versa. Hmm, didnt think so.

Other Comments by christianapologetic

27. Comment #264565 by Elli on October 14, 2008 at 9:51 pm

christianapologetic, i dunno... Rowan Williams kinda looks like a monkey to me. Kinda thinks like one also.

Other Comments by Elli

28. Comment #264567 by black wolf on October 14, 2008 at 10:00 pm

#26
naw, you wouldn't understand. Pearls before swine and all that, or 'hate the willful ignorance, not the ignorant'.

Other Comments by black wolf

29. Comment #264571 by 8teist on October 14, 2008 at 10:24 pm

christiana pologetic,

Because do to their overwhelming lack of morals, they take things too lightly.

.

Care to rephrase that in english?

Other Comments by 8teist

30. Comment #264574 by Lev-CapeTown on October 14, 2008 at 10:26 pm

anyone want to answer the question as to why we're not giving birth to monkeys; or visa versa. Hmm, didnt think so.

How clever you are!! what a thought provoking question.
<*end sarcasm>
That half witted question does not deserve the time it took your spiny little fingers to write it. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt here and assume you are ignorant rather than a troll, so... that question has been answered many times before and if you do a little reading you might come up with the answer yourself. It's more gratifying that way. I will give you a HINT though. It doesn't involve the word create.... (except maybe when prefixed by pro-)

Other Comments by Lev-CapeTown

31. Comment #264585 by gcujimmy on October 14, 2008 at 11:15 pm

Christianapologetic,
Brilliant, hilarious. You are taking the piss, right?

Other Comments by gcujimmy

32. Comment #264594 by Thor'Ungal on October 15, 2008 at 12:23 am

gcujimmy,

Christianapologetic,
Brilliant, hilarious. You are taking the piss, right?

It's sometimes hard to say but yes I too vote Poe's Law here.

Other Comments by Thor'Ungal

33. Comment #264597 by Laurie Fraser on October 15, 2008 at 12:30 am

"do to", "dispicable" ? Yep, he's taking the piss, Lev. He's learnt that spelling from youtube, no doubt.

Other Comments by Laurie Fraser

34. Comment #264615 by mixmastergaz on October 15, 2008 at 1:11 am

"Its videos like this why atheists never get any repect"

Well, the feeling isn't necessarily mutual. Take a look at the first dozen or so posts on this thread. Most contributors found something nice to say about the Archbishop. It's a shame you need to lump all atheists together and make sweeping generalisations, but it's not a surprise. You might also notice that we disrespected atheists take a more nuanced view of Christianity than you've managed to convey in your contribution regarding atheists; we can distinguish between denominations and between, for example, liberals, conservatives and fundamentalists. We can also cope with holding a person's views in disdain without holding the person themselves in disdain (well, most of us). By the way, the courteous Archbishop doesn't seem to disrespect atheists; he recently said of Richard Dawkins that "there's something rather endearing about him". The interview is also on this website if you care to look. Maybe your deviant spelling does indicate that you're a troll or a hoaxer. I'm wondering why a person who can spell 'apologetic' (and who presumably knows what the word means) can't spell the word 'due'...

Other Comments by mixmastergaz

35. Comment #264618 by Lev-CapeTown on October 15, 2008 at 1:18 am

Laurie,
well if he/she is taking the piss. I apologise to the apologetic.(I hope they are).

BTW, loving your adventures on the blog. Well done.

Other Comments by Lev-CapeTown

36. Comment #264620 by Laurie Fraser on October 15, 2008 at 1:22 am

Thanks, Lev - glad you're enjoying them. Yeah - I don't know about Mr/Ms apologetic; could be just a xtian, poor thing.

Other Comments by Laurie Fraser

37. Comment #264638 by bendigeidfran on October 15, 2008 at 2:09 am

Laurie - some of the Palin thread makes youtube look good.

Did anyone remake 'It's a wonderful life'? The maid is straight out of Tom & Jerry.

Anyone know where I can see Rowan get a proper grilling? A lovely voice and beatific smile seem to be enough. I'm told Bin Laden has beautiful eyes too. Any studies on people taking more horseshit from beardies?

Other Comments by bendigeidfran

38. Comment #264640 by Laurie Fraser on October 15, 2008 at 2:17 am

Comment #264638 by bendigeidfran

Laurie - some of the Palin thread makes youtube look good.

Agreed, mate - especially all of that illiterate nonsense by al rawandi!


*puts head down, clears off fast*

Other Comments by Laurie Fraser

39. Comment #264729 by Swordmaiden on October 15, 2008 at 5:39 am

Comment #264555 by christianapologetic


...well at least we can spell ! (ooh dat sounds lik witchycraft!)

Other Comments by Swordmaiden

40. Comment #264733 by George Lennan on October 15, 2008 at 5:56 am

OK he stutters a bit but Ricky says the word 'I' 77 times in this interview.

Other Comments by George Lennan

41. Comment #264755 by Stephan on October 15, 2008 at 7:27 am

Hm, not very spectacular, in my opinion. Gervais needs to slow down, get his thoughts a bit more in order and talk less (particularly about himself). Aside from that: a nice standard chat without any informational or new content.

Other Comments by Stephan

42. Comment #264924 by the great teapot on October 15, 2008 at 1:02 pm

Christianaplogist,
You are absolutely correct, atheists shouldn't take the subject of god lightly.
The only way to disabuse people of the childish notions you and your kind hold is not to patronize , but to insult. Your religious belief is retarded in the extreme and should not be given even the respect afforded here.
your religion is horseshit as are your confused thought processes. Please don't embarass yourself by posting here any further.
That serious enough for you.Idiot.
And to those who criticise Gervais, this wasn't his phd submission he was just having a chat, and he is a comedian, not a professional "contrarian".

Other Comments by the great teapot

43. Comment #264961 by yogibear on October 15, 2008 at 2:05 pm

Well said great teapot.

Nice to hear ricky gervais in this setting.

Here is some stand up of his regarding genesis.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_EXqdJ4L7I

Other Comments by yogibear

44. Comment #264965 by Peribolos on October 15, 2008 at 2:13 pm

I'm reasonably convinced that the AoC is actually a closet atheist. Faced with some of the mildest interrogation I've seen Dawkins do he offered a half hearted pseudo philosophical defence of his extra-weak brand Christianity and before Dawkins could actually respond finished with 'I suppose that all sounds rather like mumbo jumbo'. To which Dawkins simply nodded.

Clearly he is working to bring the C of E down from the inside by being massively insipid and admitting intellectual defeat at every available opportunity, could the NSS please make him an honoury associate as well.

Other Comments by Peribolos

45. Comment #264968 by the great teapot on October 15, 2008 at 2:26 pm

Of course he is an atheist. He appears to be a reasonable and charming man.
But, hell, everyone has to earn a living.

Other Comments by the great teapot

46. Comment #264998 by notsobad on October 15, 2008 at 4:02 pm

Church Pastors Dismiss Mental Illness

In a study of Christian church members who approached their church for help with a personal or family member's diagnosed mental illness, researchers found that more than 32 percent were told by their pastor that they or their loved one did not really have a mental illness.

http://www.livescience.com/health/081015-church-mental.html

Other Comments by notsobad

47. Comment #265010 by secondsoprano on October 15, 2008 at 5:03 pm

Church Pastors Dismiss Mental Illness

In a study of Christian church members who approached their church for help with a personal or family member's diagnosed mental illness, researchers found that more than 32 percent were told by their pastor that they or their loved one did not really have a mental illness.

Not surprising, since most of them spend most of their life in denial of mental illness.

Let's see:
- has imaginary friend
- sincerely believes imaginary friend talks to them, and will do things if asked
- hears voices, which tell them what to do
- gets very distressed if anyone doubts existence of imaginary friend

Sounds like mental illness to me ... and I mean absolutely no disrespect to those who live with clinically recognised mental illnesses.

Other Comments by secondsoprano

48. Comment #265015 by MaxD on October 15, 2008 at 5:11 pm

Secondsoprano,

This seems telling indeed. I have always wondered why the modern faithful never take a closer look at those who claim to be higher beings in the here and now.
Jim Jones, Charles Manson, Babba (sp?), that guy in Waco. No one hesitates in their own diagnosis and everyone agrees with the professionals when they diagnos such people as lunatics. Why, I wonder do they never suspect Jesus, or Moses or John the Baptist of similar psychosis? If I were a faithhead, I might be seriously worried about that trend in religious madmen.

Other Comments by MaxD

49. Comment #265220 by Border Collie on October 16, 2008 at 9:08 am

christianapologetic ... silly giving-birth-to-monkeys questions won't get you anywhere with this group ... most people who inteact on this site are very smart and very educated and very understanding to reasonable questions. If nothing else and at the least, read Darwin's Origin and Descent of Man a couple of times. Then come back and join reasonably into the discussion. I'd venture to guess that many or most people who come to this site have at least some religious background and have read the Bible more than once. I had a huge religious background as a child, read the Bible more than once, had big sections of it memorized at one time. So, you can skip telling me to read the Bible.

Other Comments by Border Collie

50. Comment #265248 by andraste77 on October 16, 2008 at 9:38 am

Wouldn't surprise me in the least if the AoC was an atheist. What comic is it who said the Church of England has less to do with real religious belief than with tea and having no arm bones? I'm thinking Eddie Izzard, but I could be wrong.

Other Comments by andraste77