1. Morality, with limits

Comment #470519 by Enlightenme.. on March 19, 2010 at 7:00 pm

#9, Keddaw:

"Unfortunately you hold back from being truly liberal to try to appease some sense of collective responsibility or togetherness by forcing views onto others."

Someone else who confuses 'truly liberal' with an extremist Libertarian position?

2. Morality, with limits

Comment #470406 by Enlightenme.. on March 19, 2010 at 6:41 am

^ "environment pulls the trigger"

I think we passed Earth's carrying capacity in about 1980 or so - the trigger's already been pulled.

3. Richard Dawkins - Gratitude Evolution & Vice Versa

Comment #469633 by Enlightenme.. on March 15, 2010 at 4:05 pm

"It was nevertheless a great privilege to hear Mr Dawkins express his opinion and the enthusiasm of his skeptical scientifically minded followers is certainly a sight to behold.

ENDS"

Ahhhh, he almost sounds grateful.. through gritted teeth!

4. Court clears reciting of Pledge of Allegiance at Western schools

Comment #469526 by Enlightenme.. on March 15, 2010 at 6:17 am

55. Comment #469260 by blessedreleaf

"I pledge allegiance to the earth and all the life which it supports. One planet in our care, irreplaceable, with sustenance and respect for all."

Except that some people just don't give a damn. But that's their right.

----------------------------------------

No it damn well ain't.

I know of no established recognised Anarchy states on this Earth.
Nor non-state actors licensed to act in such a way.
Our current Authorities worldwide are failing to hold actors of all kinds to account, most especially America.
And not just on the environment!


Rights entail corresponding responsibilities.

5. Public Statement Concerning Science and Christian Faith

Comment #469357 by Enlightenme.. on March 14, 2010 at 4:23 pm

59. Comment #469092 by MrPickwick:

"Please waste a couple of minutes of your time and google any of these "Professional scientists and others..." together with the words "Dawkins" "god" or even "templeton" if you want to have a good laugh."

--------------

Actually, that's one of the problems with this article (apart from them failing to dredge up a couple of Steve's)
Was this sent in specifically to this site?
If not, where was it published, why no link? (New Zealand post?) and did the editor do any investigative work to qualify it's claims?

6. Public Statement Concerning Science and Christian Faith

Comment #469353 by Enlightenme.. on March 14, 2010 at 4:10 pm

Koreman:

.."Well. Everything starts and ends with mathematical laws. Everything. Even a god would be bound tight to these laws and would therefor be extremely limited. In the universe there is no room for magic and there is no need for magic. Existence is not magic, it's logic."

Epic Theology fail there, Mr Koreman.
Rule #1 is your deity is Supernatural (magic).

7. Public Statement Concerning Science and Christian Faith

Comment #469041 by Enlightenme.. on March 13, 2010 at 7:38 am

..and not one of them called Steve!

Phew!

Steve Murray. aka Enlightenme..

8. 'Stroke of luck' led to life on Earth

Comment #469040 by Enlightenme.. on March 13, 2010 at 7:27 am

Mr Darcy:
.."if Ray Comfort's parents had delayed their their love making by, say, half an hour, there would have been no Ray Comfort. Maybe someone else like him but not Ray."

The contingency is far far narrower than half an hour, more like a split second, or the slip of an elbow on the bedsheet.

Then factor in all the other contingencies..

The meteor that wiped out the Dinosaurs hitting at exactly the right angle..
All the religions, all the wars, all the black deaths turning out just so..
No ancestor losing their grip on a tree branch before reproduction for 3.5 billion years.

9. Court clears reciting of Pledge of Allegiance at Western schools

Comment #468871 by Enlightenme.. on March 12, 2010 at 6:44 pm

24. Comment #468832 by Christopher Davis

"... I think these are the wrong battles to be waging at this time.
...Lawsuits such as this are a waste of time and resources"

--------------------------------

Agree with this.

As pointed out in this thread, the constitution statement about 'all men* created equal' is not going to be effectively challenged is it?

Also, the statement 'We hold these truths to be self-evident' is something that requires swearing fealty to, to hold water.

*persons

======================

Comment 34, Roger Stanyard,

As per usual, it is all our fault.
We had the hegemony for 200 years and sang of building 'Jerusalem'.

Iraq might hopefully be the last stand for us as lackey to 'World team America'

..though it seems we regressed somewhat after managing to call it right on Vietnam.

10. Court clears reciting of Pledge of Allegiance at Western schools

Comment #468847 by Enlightenme.. on March 12, 2010 at 5:00 pm

The guy 'on the plaintiffs side' gets it all wrong here:

In dissent to Thursday's ruling, Judge Stephen Reinhardt said the pledge was an overtly religious message.

"Carrying out such an indoctrination in a public school classroom unconstitutionally forces many young children either to profess a religious belief antithetical to their personal views or to declare themselves through their silence or nonparticipation to be protesting nonbelievers, thereby subjecting themselves to hostility and ridicule," he wrote.

11. Richard Dawkins and The Greatest Show on Earth

Comment #468334 by Enlightenme.. on March 11, 2010 at 3:58 am

Reckon 'Gazza of bath' is trolling.

12. Liberalism can be defended

Comment #467635 by Enlightenme.. on March 9, 2010 at 7:34 am

Has somebody gotten Liberalism mixed up with Libertarianism again?

13. What Is Time? One Physicist Hunts for the Ultimate Theory

Comment #464745 by Enlightenme.. on February 28, 2010 at 4:39 pm

So at max entropy, time ceases to exist?
-Cool!

14. Depression’s Upside

Comment #464627 by Enlightenme.. on February 28, 2010 at 4:59 am

"Darwin, of course, was wrong.."

JEEzuus,
Did he get anything right?

;)

15. Pacific under tsunami threat after massive 8.8 quake strikes Chile

Comment #464498 by Enlightenme.. on February 27, 2010 at 7:07 pm

As soon as I heard mention of the nearest town - Concepción, I was reminded of the Beagle voyage.

16. Libya's Gaddafi urges jihad against Switzerland

Comment #464203 by Enlightenme.. on February 26, 2010 at 6:55 pm

"Can't we just bomb the shit out of this country? Please?"

As long as we can bomb the shit out of America if Sarah Palin becomes president in 2016 and says something dumbass.
Or if the next president is ugly.

----------

I wonder where the next OPEC conference is going to take place?
They're normally in Geneva aren't they?

17. Doing what comes supernaturally: Stanley Fish on fact and value

Comment #464165 by Enlightenme.. on February 26, 2010 at 5:06 pm

I followed the link at the start of Russell's article to the book review.

What I came to realise is that his (Stanley Fish's) closing line;

.."it hasn't got a leg to stand on", applies just as much to the phrase "We hold these truths to be self-evident..."

-----------

There was another glimpse of sanity in the depressing Question Time debate Carto refers to, as well as the audience member who brought up Creationism, there was another lad there who pointed out that it was the parent's credo's that were being pandered to, not the pupil's.

18. The trouble with homeopathy

Comment #463681 by Enlightenme.. on February 24, 2010 at 6:40 pm

"80. Comment #463653 by brainsys on February 24, 2010 at 5:39 pm

The basic problem is that Homoeopathy works!

That is - placebos work...


Which leaves the ethical question: is it ever justified to kid someone - if it will make them feel better? Isn't that something you do everyday - especially if you are married?

Still uncomfortable about my taxes being spent on it though ... "

---------------

Well said, Brainsys, you said pretty much exactly what I wanted to say with your first & last sentences.

The NHS though, is always a compromise making a cost/benefit judgement.

To me, NHS subsidy of this Charlatanry indirectly causes Deaths elsewhere in the system.

19. How prayer can crack crime

Comment #462567 by Enlightenme.. on February 21, 2010 at 6:59 pm

I'm most disappointed.

Western morning news' headline suggest that we are finally going to hear how prayers can cut crime.

20. Origin of the specious

Comment #462122 by Enlightenme.. on February 19, 2010 at 4:44 pm

Tomahawk, 44;
"I was just wondering if there is anything in particular that prompted the change in mood?"

I think it's to do with the closeness to the time when Stephen J unfortunately passed away, and was not able to answer back.

There is a convention where one refrains from speaking ill of the dead for an (unwritten) period of time after their passing.

In fact, from my recollection of the Devil's Chaplain piece, I thought that RD said something along those lines himself at that time.

21. Origin of the specious

Comment #462116 by Enlightenme.. on February 19, 2010 at 4:31 pm

It's amusing that in Stephen J Gould's 'Darwinian Fundamentalism' article, he also referenced in chapter 3 the Maynard Smith critique, and telling him to stuff his patronising bit of outreach with this response:

It seems futile to reply to an attack so empty of content, and based only on comments by anonymous critics; if they were named, they would, Isuspect, turn out to be a very small circle of true believers. And if I may beg the editor's indulgence for one emotional outburst, may I say, at least, that I resent Maynard Smith's pompous offer of grudging acceptance for my utility in fighting creationism. I did not do so to win entry into his circle of genuine professionals (for I think that we both hold honored union cards therein), but rather as a member of the larger scientific community, and as a small contribution to the continual struggle of people who cherish rationality. We will not win this most important of all battles if we descend to the same tactics of backbiting and anathematization that characterize our true opponents.

Instead of responding to Maynard Smith's attack against my integrity and scholarship, citing people unknown and with arguments unmentioned, let me, instead, merely remind him of the blatant inconsistency between his admirable past and lamentable present...

22. Origin of the specious

Comment #462088 by Enlightenme.. on February 19, 2010 at 2:57 pm

"The tricks of learning and language have given homo sapiens the ability to do some carpentry and build ladders."

But crows have had them too, for a long time.

The extra bit (me trying to understand the spandrels concept I s'pose) is that we suddenly found ourselves with the same redundant set of limbs* (already equipped with opposable thumbs) to be turned to other uses, like ranged weaponry.
Does that comply with Spandrel Theory?, or is that just Darwinian 'preadaptation' (WTF?!)

Imagine how differently life might have developed if a six-limbed Bauplan had won through after Gould's pet punctuation of equilibrium.

We can have Dragons then for starters!
And Angels..

*But later along our evolutionary path than crows did.

23. The crooked judges of Amsterdam

Comment #459888 by Enlightenme.. on February 10, 2010 at 9:31 am

235, ezee;

"Islam being evil is debatable"

No, I don't generally like the usage of ultimate terms, but spades do need calling spades sometimes.

The word & concept - Submission - is evil in itself.

That might not be enough for some, so allow me to just ask a straight question of you:

Was its middle-aged prophet's 'consummation' of marriage to his child 'bride' evil?

To be clear I'm not questioning whether people in olden times having ~30 year lifespans provides 'qualifications'.

No - I'm asking whether the Islamic creed that the prophet's life sets the exemplary standard for all time - is evil?

So that we're on the same page I'll just ask
Is Christianity evil?

That the Synod has to debate whether to schism over Women Priests acceptable vs Women Bishops unacceptable, in the 21st century = Yes.

-----------------------------

37: Sciros:
From my perspective, the assertion that "Islamic violence" or "Muslim violence" is not based on religion is contradictory so you need to find another way to approach the topic. The alternative is to concede that it's based on religion.

There's a missing nuance here that I can't quite pin down at the moment.
It's got something to do with the way we apply those labels.
We often talk of Muslims killing each other...
But to talk of Islamists killing each other just doesn't seem to scan right somehow.

------------------------------------

Ezee again:

"The point i made being that in the sixties seventies and eighties and part of the nineties the view of islam was vastly different. Why has that changed so drastically if the religion is so old and been around such a long time."



..in the sixties seventies eighties and nineties the view of the New York skyline was vastly different.

Sorry, I don't mean to be getting at you, and I am being a bit facetious.
;)

No doubt Christianity is capable of being used to justify burning people at the stake again if the World moves down a bad timeline.

Das Kapital could also haunt the world again, just as Progress utilising Capitalism's current mammon-centric supremacy demands growth demanding Eco-rape.
But those philosophies don't have The Creator's stamp of authority, making them much harder to justify.

24. The crooked judges of Amsterdam

Comment #459603 by Enlightenme.. on February 9, 2010 at 9:16 am

@ezee,

Can you please insert some paragraph breaks to ease readability.

Your first post expressed concern that this place is becoming Islam-phobic.

I share your concern, but with an important caveat; Islam is evil, just as Christianity and Judaism are.
The ten commandments are evil, eg #10 controlling thoughtcrime, but especially, as Stephen Fry wonderfully pointed out, by the fact that in Jesus' wonderful new dispensation from having to observe all the 213 Mosaic laws God completely forgot to promote 'Thou shalt not own slaves' into the top ten.
In fact I think he forgot that in the whole 213.

He also forgot 'Though shalt not marry children', after cogitating on it for another 700 years.


But,
In a country with some 1.5 million Muslims in it,
Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaah managed to muster a pathetic contingent of 20 odd malcontents for their Luton protest and the main UK rageboy is now reduced to publicity stunts.
Also, when Sudan tried to pull the Mohammed the bear stunt, the response from our hordes of homegrown fanatics was..
??
..an embarrassed silence?
And the partial redemption of Lord Ahmed who in a previous life was all "blood on his hands" regarding Rushdie

So yes, the Muslim-phobia displayed by the odd passer-by here is correctly identified by you.

---------------
^Roland;
"Most extreme is the Christian religion with something around 33.000 denominations"

Soon to be 33,001 I reckon:
Interesting BBC Hardtalk I've just watched.
You could really see Broadhurst's deep frustration at not getting his way after ten years of this fight.
Sackur pressed him; "why are you still hanging around? Isn't it just the Vicarage and, frankly, the money?"
Broadhurst fended him off, telling Sackur he's so poorly paid, his kids earn more in their bonuses and that it's a sacrifice.
He also seemed extraordinarily world-weary as he suggested the majority Anglican communion are so compromising that he wouldn't see the point of getting out of bed in the morning!

The Anglican communion "is over"

25. Sikh judge Sir Mota Singh criticises banning of Kirpan

Comment #459585 by Enlightenme.. on February 9, 2010 at 6:52 am

68, mlgatheist:
"If a school has a rule that the head is not to be covered in class then turbines and other headcoverings should be removed."

26. Teenage girl buried alive in Turkey for talking to boys

Comment #459298 by Enlightenme.. on February 8, 2010 at 10:03 am

262. Comment #459265 by True Believer on February 8, 2010:

"Their is either a coincidental or cause and effect relationship with premarital sex promiscuity and the divorce rate in Western society in recent times, I tend to believe the latter."


You seem to be suggesting that divorce is always worse than people being trapped in loveless wedlock truebeliever.

Why?

27. The crooked judges of Amsterdam

Comment #459078 by Enlightenme.. on February 7, 2010 at 10:21 am

^
I think you're dead wrong, uuaschbaer,

We are right to call Pat Condell on this occasion for not qualifying his support for the odious & transparent Wilders.

The Free speech case is much better made by denigrating prosecutions of the likes of David Irwin, not - as Pat has done here - by completely failing to mention that someone supposedly 'in your camp*' stands for pre-enlightenment values like banning books and dispensing with equality under the law.

*the other stuff he did say, like tacking on his rant about multiculturalism shows this 'common-ground' here.

He's seriously beginning to acquire a distinct whiff of Daily Mail.

28. The crooked judges of Amsterdam

Comment #459075 by Enlightenme.. on February 7, 2010 at 9:40 am

"But in reality the fight is not about religion it is about oil!"

That's why the approx 100 deaths (of mainly Shias, this time) happened in Pakistan & Iraq yesterday is it?

If you're talking about reasons for the Iraq war (rather than Afghanistan), then I think Bush spoke straight when he spoke of delivering up freedom and democracy to a state in the Middle East, borne mainly out of hubris after Western success in The Balkans and (oil-less) Afghanistan.

29. The crooked judges of Amsterdam

Comment #459072 by Enlightenme.. on February 7, 2010 at 9:20 am

^
Or the Dutch version of the Crown Prosecution Service!
This case wouldn't even make it to court in England.

..Which leads me to be suspicious of how well the separation of powers is going on there.

Actually, no.
Just seems to be bad law if VrijzinnigMan's description of 137c & d are accurate.

-----

"Thank you for crystallising my hitherto nebulous thoughts about how we decide where to draw the line.

I'll let you know if I ever DO find an example..."

I suspect there's an awful lot of the Law though that requires judges & juries rather than a computer.

30. Hear the rumble of Christian hypocrisy

Comment #457266 by Enlightenme.. on February 1, 2010 at 10:39 pm

Off topic;

Richard is on radio 4 tomorrow at 1630 in the series 'Great Lives' talking about W.D. Hamilton.
Also on Friday 5th @ 2300

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006qxsb

31. Real men find Church too girly

Comment #456928 by Enlightenme.. on February 1, 2010 at 7:37 am

"The charity wants vicars to erect big screens above the pulpit during this summer’s World Cup in South Africa and even serve beer during games."

Nah!
Fool me once and shame on.. um shame on you, fool me.. you can't get fooled again.

This is from the onion again, isn't it?

32. French report wants limits on Muslim face veil

Comment #456504 by Enlightenme.. on January 30, 2010 at 7:24 pm

So it begins.

Solutions to address 'The Muslim question in Europe'.

Calling IG Farben..

33. Why David Cameron wants a boom in faith schools

Comment #456406 by Enlightenme.. on January 30, 2010 at 4:23 am

^
Ha Ha,
You know, I'm kinda warming to the fellow!

“Noam Chomsky was correct when he compared the U.S. policies to those of the Mafia,” Al Jazeera quoted Mr. bin Laden as saying. “They are the true terrorists, and therefore we should refrain from dealing in the U.S. dollar and should try to get rid of this currency as early as possible.”

But Mr. bin Laden’s aim in turning away from the dollar appears to be to inflict harm on the American economy.

“I am certain that such actions will have grave repercussions and huge impact,” he was quoted as saying.

------------------

The funny thing is, de-dollarisation would probably do USA, and The World some good, taking the long view.

The U.S. would be less likely to evolve down the road of fascism 'ol Chomskers and Gore Vidal forewarn.
The massive world depression that would follow the fiscal, and probable social collapse of China and others would hasten the arrival of the four horsemen and probably cull some billions before the world has to cross The Energy Desert, leaving USA (and their lapdogs) in total control. (of the post-apocalypse)

34. Why David Cameron wants a boom in faith schools

Comment #456293 by Enlightenme.. on January 29, 2010 at 7:08 pm

@Invariance 83,

"I think there should be two separate cultural wars. One is Western culture versus Islam, the other is the sort of New Atheist.."

Osama Bin Laden pwns Invariance?

"Islam, since it is so uniquely horrible, deserves "special treatment". ... and immigration of Muslims from third-world nations needs to be drastically curbed unless you want to see our countries become like theirs."

I rather hope that - over time - we might hope that through the influence of 'Westernised Muslims' their countries might become more like ours. (To generalise)

By which time our culture probably won't be worth emulating anyway!

35. Reminder - 10:23 Event

Comment #456087 by Enlightenme.. on January 29, 2010 at 7:22 am

I intend to be there, even at the less than civilised 9:30 form-up.

I figure the numbers are somewhat underestimated, as I haven't bothered signing up to the local group yet.
(Forecast is for a cold Northerly on Saturday as well - bummer)

The Bristol Homeopathy site has accreditation from Gandhi:

“Homeopathy cures a larger percentage of cases than any other method of treatment.” - Gandhi.

I always knew the guy was a bit of a nutter, I watched a documentary on him a while back where his ultimate dream was to lead his people into some kind of wacky Anarchistic-Agrarian utopia of self-sufficient smallholdings.
He'd have ended up condemning millions more to starvation.

36. Hear the rumble of Christian hypocrisy

Comment #456085 by Enlightenme.. on January 29, 2010 at 7:03 am

If Robertson is a little bit extreme & firebrand old testament, perhaps we should expect better from those nice mild Anglican village-green preservationists, yes?

Except that the former Bishop of Carlisle attributed the UK floods in summer 2007 to our Faggot-loving tolerance of civil partnerships.

Did they fire him?
No. He just retired in November, presumably with his nice fat pension intact.

37. Between God and a Hard Place

Comment #455259 by Enlightenme.. on January 27, 2010 at 8:00 am

Actually, that phrase, normally left incomplete these days - "There, but for the grace of God..."

Is an appeal to put yourself in the place of the victim, recognising any of us could suffer misfortune.

It's a mere carry over, making the Obama portion of this piece a swing and a miss.

38. The Bible : A History - Creation

Comment #455018 by Enlightenme.. on January 26, 2010 at 6:18 pm

Off Topic,
Dark matter, d'you still live in Bristol?

I'm going off in about twenty minutes to enjoy Bristol uni Atheists, agnostics & secular society debating with B.U. Christian Union.

39. Atheism as extremism

Comment #455013 by Enlightenme.. on January 26, 2010 at 6:11 pm

60, 61;

So.. Dawkins, noted campaigner against our libel laws, should sue?

40. Atheism as extremism

Comment #455010 by Enlightenme.. on January 26, 2010 at 6:07 pm

56, Phatbat;
"This lack of a definition as to what this god entity is, is why it is often more accurate to describe oneself as an igtheist rather than an atheist, when looking at the question of what it would take to believe in the existence of said entity."

The term gnosticism lends itself better to this case (the Huxley term 'agnosticism' being about as awful as 'Islamophobia')
The term 'Ignostic' does work.

But I prefer 'Theological Noncognitivism'.
:)

41. The Bible : A History - Creation

Comment #454953 by Enlightenme.. on January 26, 2010 at 4:42 pm

92, Epeeist,

New word: Nomological.
Thanks.

95, Darkmatter,

"SSGARRITY also forgot to carefully explain what he actually meant by asserting that Atheists "believe in nothing".
I can assume that he means that all Atheists are Nihlists which is plainly ridiculous...
I am not sure if that is what SSGARRITY meant but he seems reluctant to expand on what he actually did mean."

Hmmm, being charitable, I took SSGARITY to be (somewhat cackhandedly) stating that Atheists tend generally to 'believe' that Something can come from Nothing, considering these uhhm.. nomological (usage?) questions.

On the other matter:

"Ironically, "believing in nothing" (assuming that this is possible) actually sounds like a very liberating position - free from the baggage of any belief system then it kind of implies that a person who "believes in nothing" is actually open-minded enough to consider all options as they are evenly sceptical of all beliefs."

I don't particularly want to interact with such liberated people though!
As a bare minimum, I would want them to 'believe in' and have some regard to the necessity to subscribe to such basics as social contract theory/Law, or whateva.
If not, they should piss off and form a new AynRandland, but don't come back crying to us if you get sick.
Perhaps we in the UK ought to consider swearing some form of Oath of Allegiance at the Age of Criminal Responsibility (once we've gotten a constitution of course)
[One must always find a use for an 'ought' in any dialogue with Hume in it]

97, SSGARRITY,
"Hume believed in the existence of God.. In none of his writings does Hume say or imply that he does not accept the existence of God."

Bollocks,
Wikipedia will do:
In simplified terms:

Cleanthes... bases his beliefs about God's existence and nature upon a version of the teleological argument,

Demea.. "defends the Cosmological argument,

And (fanfare drumroll etc)

Philo, according to the predominant view among scholars, "probably represents a viewpoint similar to Hume's own."[3] Philo, along with Demea, attacks Cleanthes' views on anthropomorphism and teleology; while not going as far as to deny the existence of God, Philo asserts that human reason is wholly inadequate to make any assumptions about the divine, whether through a priori reasoning or observation of nature.

That.. along with the very existence of the Dialogues itself, is about as close to scepticism as anyone dare go in his time.

For me, the possible, or rather very very improbable, existence of some vague uncaused cause deity SSGARRITY, gets you precisely nowhere, considering how immense the journey is from entertaining that position to eliciting 'his' opinion on the 'error of foreskins'.

BTW, I went to an excellent talk on Hume last year, hosted by Bristol Uni Philosophical soc given by one of our foremost Hume scholars:

http://www.phil.cam.ac.uk/~swb24/

Damn Darkmatter, I should write faster!

42. The Bible : A History - Creation

Comment #454800 by Enlightenme.. on January 26, 2010 at 7:26 am

SSGARRITY:
"I want to know what you think caused the whole creation of every molecule."

The Big Bang?

God?

What caused that?
I don't know.. do you?

43. Atheism as extremism

Comment #454638 by Enlightenme.. on January 25, 2010 at 9:05 pm

"But it’s unusual to see aggressive atheism – ie, the type which seeks to mock people with religion – depicted as a form of extremism."

Unusual? Where's this guy been for the last five years!

And for Jacobson:
"The big question for me is how to believe, and not to believe, at the same time."

What sort of a stupid question is that?

'The big question for me is how to achieve a desultory state of cognitive dissonance'

That betrays just about the most pathetic and pitiable aspiration imaginable.

44. Geert Wilders Goes on Trial

Comment #454625 by Enlightenme.. on January 25, 2010 at 7:53 pm

Adrian B:

"Do you disagree with him to the point you think he should be imprisoned for it?"

Most definitely not!
His wish to alter the 1st article from the Dutch constitution guaranteeing equality under the law, adding a clause stating the cultural dominance of the Christian, Jewish and humanist traditions - apart from being fallacious, in that (I'd assert) any 'Humanist traditions' I would recognise would state the 1st article unbastardised - is reason enough to be very wary of this character.

This quote from wiki is quite funny;

"My allies are not Le Pen or Haider... We'll never join up with the fascists and Mussolinis of Italy. I'm very afraid of being linked with the wrong rightist fascist groups."[27]

I suppose then that he wouldn't mind my linking him with the 'right' rightist fascist groups!!

45. The Bible : A History - Creation

Comment #454617 by Enlightenme.. on January 25, 2010 at 7:27 pm

From the Guardian piece by Vernon:

"However, the biblical poetry did come alive for him when he, finally, visited the philosopher Mary Midgley. She talked to him of myth, of the need we have to grasp the world through imaginative visions..
..it is only human to sense a greater whole, a meaning, a purpose. [etc]

This insight was a release for Jacobson. He could relate to the text, could make it his own, in his own way."

Midgley for the win! LOL.

Dribble ..Gibber..

46. The Bible : A History - Creation

Comment #454339 by Enlightenme.. on January 25, 2010 at 6:47 am

12:
"HJ told of the rabbi who said to the atheist "I don't believe in the god you don't believe in either". Ok - hypothetical-rabbi, please explain exactly what "God" means to you?"

Will (real) Rabbi Johnathan Sacks' answer do?:

"Religion is the redemption of solitude".

Get in the sack!
(You forgot the feckin', Mark Jones)

Get in the feckin' sack!

A snippet of Dara was shown in the episode, as it happens.
And it was clear this was gonna be painful to sit through within the first minute when the false dichotomy of 'this creation myth true or false' was diarrhoea'd out.

47. Interview with Ophelia Benson

Comment #454164 by Enlightenme.. on January 24, 2010 at 11:52 am

Blitz:
"Why weren't they just weeded out by the He-men?"

!!!
:)

48. Open Your Eyes

Comment #454163 by Enlightenme.. on January 24, 2010 at 11:36 am

@etny #43,
I'm a little puzzled in what way you seem to be trying to be deliberately obtuse on here, etny?

I can't see why the marvel does not apply in the millions to one sperm context that lead to you vs (not-you x10^of whatever), in the same way to the marvel that all the wars, religions, plagues, species extinctions & eukaryotic revolution etc all had to play out absolutely just so..

49. Open Your Eyes

Comment #454155 by Enlightenme.. on January 24, 2010 at 10:01 am

33, Bethe123:
Einstein:

"Time is infinite"

Uhhh.. sorry?

50. Geert Wilders Goes on Trial

Comment #454153 by Enlightenme.. on January 24, 2010 at 9:48 am

Geert Wilders wiki:

...example, he supports implementing Israel's administrative detention in the Netherlands, a practice heavily criticized by human rights groups, which he calls "common sense".[28]

Wilders published his political manifesto, called Klare Wijn ("Clear Wine"), in March 2005.[19] The program proposed ten key points to be implemented:
“
Considerable reduction of taxes and state regulations.

The present Article 1 of the Dutch constitution, guaranteeing equality under the law, will be replaced by a clause stating the cultural dominance of the Christian, Jewish and humanist traditions.

Reduction of the influence of the European Union, which may no longer be expanded with new member states, especially Turkey; the European Parliament will be abolished. Dutch financial contributions to the European Union should be reduced by billions of euros.

An immigration ban of five years for immigrants from non-western countries. Foreign residents will no longer have the right to vote in municipal elections.

A ban of five years on the founding of mosques and Islamic schools; a permanent ban on preaching in any language other than Dutch. Foreign imams will not be allowed to preach. Radical mosques will be closed and radical Muslims will be expelled.

Educational standards will be restored, with an emphasis on the educational value of the family.
Introduction of binding referenda and elected mayors, chiefs of police and prime ministers.

Introduction of minimum penalties, and higher maximum penalties; introduction of administrative detention for terrorist suspects. Street terrorism will be punished by boot camps and denaturalisation deportation of immigrant offenders.

Teachers, policemen, health care workers and military personnel will regain a position of respect and be better rewarded.

The health care system should not be complicated by reorganisations but be more accessible and humane, especially for elderly citizens.[31]
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Just for those in doubt of the 'flavour' of thought we are dealing with.