1. I Am Evolution

Comment #178632 by will young on May 11, 2008 at 7:24 pm

Since this was from the NPR series 'This I Believe' it would be sort of hard to avoid using the word believe, I believe.

No one owns language, not even the religious fascists. She made her point quite poetically and I especially liked the title.

2. Evolution: What is 'Natural'?

Comment #178618 by will young on May 11, 2008 at 6:47 pm

jphilosophys

"Surely what they say is false or inconclusive."

No doubt...
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/po-halos/gentry.html

The Evolution's Tiny Violences: The Po-Halo Mystery link was the one I liked.

3. My Response to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #177682 by will young on May 9, 2008 at 1:19 pm

100. Comment #177465 Styrer:
"This is no small-time and insignificant Robertson, whom he rightly and consistently ignores; this man has quite a choir behind him:"

Pat Robertson? Small-time and insignificant? Rabbi Boteach could only dream of having a "choir" the size of the 700 Club and the worldwide influence of Robertson. From what I have seen, the only thing Boteach and Robertson share in common is ridiculousness.

(edited for clarity & to add comment number)

4. My Response to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #177281 by will young on May 8, 2008 at 9:12 pm

Boteach is a Jewish Jimmy Swaggart.

5. The detail in the Devil

Comment #175902 by will young on May 6, 2008 at 8:19 am

Darwin...Daemon...Great Caesar's Ghost! My Mac is possessed!

6. Research Volunteers Needed

Comment #175316 by will young on May 5, 2008 at 8:17 am

beeline...

"I *really* wanted to click 'Strongly Agree' after that one... "

I know what you mean! But since he, I believe, owns a Mac, I had to mark 'Disagree' ;)

7. Evolution's Critics Shift Tactics With Schools

Comment #175106 by will young on May 4, 2008 at 12:36 pm

RainDear...

Will Young --
Not sure if your post was aimed at me, but I'll put a few words in anyway.

It wasn't.
If you will read closely I quoted K1mgy before my comment.

In an earlied thread a few months ago I encountered some resentment for my commenting on my personal experience with some American people I've met. Apparently many, even smart and enlightened Americans are strangely touchy about their country.

I can sort of see why. Your assertions seem to be generalizations of things you have heard rather than from personal experiences. You could be right of course, but, to me anyway and in a small sense, you do sound a tad condescending, if you don't mind me saying so.

I can't understand how criticizing something or commenting on an honest observation is counter-productive. Critique is the beginning of changing things. Or, in my case, learning. Asking for responses, not conversation-killing resentment. Critique is not bashing. In my case, I'm constantly wondering how a nation with some of the best universities of the world can have such a low level of basic, general education. If this view is incorrect, it is easily corrected by stating facts to the contrary.

It would probably seem less confrontational if, when you made such assertions, you backed them up with data rather than expect me, or anyone else, to prove your assertions wrong. What do you think?

Furthermore, having a few words in a constitution about being a secular country means nothing, if the reality is something else.

Well it means a lot in the United States and, so far, the reality here is that of a secular nation with secular laws.

Freedom of religion means nothing without freedom from religion and most people here in the United States, when pressed, would understand and agree, religious or otherwise. You might want to make a note of that to avoid confusion in the future.

There are many highly developed countries with all kinds of gods or faiths written all over their old constitutions and ancient laws. But it means nothing in reality, in everyday politics, and the way these countries run their schools and universities.

Sorry, I fail to understand your point. But the United States Constitution is a very powerful and active document when it comes to everyday politics and in the way we run our schools and universities. (make another note)

In no other developed, civilized, high-literacy nation than the US is a scientific fact like evolution denied in such a fervour. Certainly in no other nation than the US is a scientific fact like evolution under such idiotic campaigns, even legal attacks. Thankfully, the ID-proponents and other liars for Jesus seem to be on the losing side, but in most other countries, these ID-cases would be laughed at, not taken seriously.

I think there is considerable truth to what you are saying, but for the most part I think you are assuming too much. Can you present statistical information for these assertions? I would really like to know how you arrived at this position since you seem rather convinced of the alleged high degree of ignorance here in the United States (another reason for the resentment you claim to have encountered perhaps?)

So, the reality in which the Americans live is extremely relevant to this topic.

Did I say it wasn't or are you trying to put words in my mouth? Is it getting any clearer why you might have been met with a smidgen of resentment? Maybe I misunderstood.

Personally my first impression, from your comments, was that you actually enjoy bashing the United States, if you want to know the truth. And when you make generalized statements and present them as foregone facts without evidence to back up your claims you are always going to get repercussion, or hopefully anyway.

P&L,
will

Edited for clarity

8. Evolution's Critics Shift Tactics With Schools

Comment #175048 by will young on May 4, 2008 at 9:16 am

Christopher Davis,

Here's the link you asked for...
http://secularnations.org/index.php?page=Laiccountries

9. Evolution's Critics Shift Tactics With Schools

Comment #174972 by will young on May 4, 2008 at 2:27 am

There are only nine constitutionally secular countries in the world, the United States is one of them and in Europe only France is.

'nuff said?

10. Evolution's Critics Shift Tactics With Schools

Comment #174968 by will young on May 4, 2008 at 2:00 am

K1mgy:

"I take it there are no Medical schools in the state of Oklahoma."

Why is that? I'm nearly 60, have 20/15 eyesight and all of my teeth, which are healthy and straight.
The bill hasn't yet passed and is unlikely to as this is the second or third attempt. You seem to be reading more into my comment than I said.

Try reading the link I provided to the original newspaper article which strongly criticized the bill.

11. Evolution's Critics Shift Tactics With Schools

Comment #174962 by will young on May 4, 2008 at 1:18 am

ThoughtsonCommonToad
What is defined as religion; Can I just make my own up? And of course this means teachers will have to know for every single question what particular 'religious' viewpoints there are on the matter. You said this expects to get passed, surely that can't be true?

I was a quoting from a local newspaper article dated May 3, 2008 that criticized the bill. You demonstrated precisely a major problem of this legislation and I agree wholeheartedly.

Check the article out... it shows not all Okies are looney, ignorant rednecks. The bill would still have to pass the state Senate and be signed by the governor, which is unlikely. That doesn't mean the governor's veto would not be overridden though so we're still not out of the woods yet.

Edited for html

12. Truly Bizarre : Indians Throw Babies 50ft From Roof To Thank God.

Comment #174868 by will young on May 3, 2008 at 5:20 pm

"The Vatican has joined forces with Shiite Muslims."

For a supernatural circle jerk.

13. Evolution's Critics Shift Tactics With Schools

Comment #174835 by will young on May 3, 2008 at 4:03 pm

"So what... I know it is a massive waste of time, but why not let them? This can't go far."

You don't live in the south do you? Some teachers would relish the chance to do a little preaching, along with teaching. Not to mention that this is blatantly unconstitutional.

I have grandchildren in public schools and I want them to get the best education possible and not be confused by ignorance and superstition, if even briefly.

14. Evolution's Critics Shift Tactics With Schools

Comment #174829 by will young on May 3, 2008 at 3:49 pm

My state of Oklahoma is going through this for the second time in two years. The bill, if passed, would "guarantee students the right to express their religious viewpoints in a public forum, in class, in homework and in other ways without being penalized. If a student's religious beliefs were in conflict with scientific theory, and the student chose to express those beliefs rather than explain the theory in response to an exam question, the student's incorrect response would be deemed satisfactory." -- Dave McNeely, The Edmond Sun, Sat, May 03 2008.

The bill is expected to pass the House and then go on to the Senate.

15. Truly Bizarre : Indians Throw Babies 50ft From Roof To Thank God.

Comment #174786 by will young on May 3, 2008 at 1:50 pm

"So for me it boils down to two questions: 1) are they really doing any harm, and even if not 2) is it ethical to do this to people without their consent? "

The answer to both is yes.

1.) Putting a child in harm's way.

2.) Of course not.

Sheesh!

EDIT: Typo

16. A New Jack Chick Tract: Moving On Up!

Comment #174783 by will young on May 3, 2008 at 1:38 pm

"If this isn't a joke, and there are really people in the US who think like that... leave the fucking country."

What, and miss all the fun?

17. A New Jack Chick Tract: Moving On Up!

Comment #174781 by will young on May 3, 2008 at 1:31 pm

Isn't satire supposed to contain at least a shred of evidence?

18. Truly Bizarre : Indians Throw Babies 50ft From Roof To Thank God.

Comment #174721 by will young on May 3, 2008 at 10:38 am

Who thinks up stupidity like this?

19. Was the new finger a 'natural' miracle?

Comment #174695 by will young on May 3, 2008 at 9:21 am

At first I thought without all the whimsy it might have been a good article, but then I read the Ben Goldacre article SkyBlueJim linked to in comment #66 and now know better.

From the before picture it is pretty obvious not all that much of the finger was missing or damaged.

"Science" reporting like this can do more harm than good, even if it was meant to be funny. Frankly I fail to get the humor, if that is what was intended.

20. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172777 by will young on April 30, 2008 at 5:02 am

MaxD...

I am beginning to think that Kyrie might sadly be a young victim of sexual abuse, or once was. But then I just woke up too so...

21. Anti-Evolution Film Misappropriates the Holocaust

Comment #172515 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 4:41 pm

I doubt seriously if the arrogant bastard would even care if his own rabbi did chastise him. It would be a nice touch though.

The movie fell from 10th place to 13th this last weekend and brought in less than half of what it earned its first weekend.

It's a huge flop.

22. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172496 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 4:08 pm

That certainly explains it...thanks all. Looks like I am going to have to learn to touch type or do as MPhil (nice hat btw, but would have to vote for the shades) and copy my posts.

It is nice to know there are people who know these things. I'm just an ex-lineman - telephone, not football - who took a liking to computers (and is probably the world's oldest college sophomore) so I need all the assistance I can get... way more than I can afford I am sure!

I saw a Sponge Bob Square Pants typing tutorial that looked sorta fun! :^D

23. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172477 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 3:41 pm

On the off topic of posting, does anyone else have a problem of being logged off while typing a comment? I know I type slow, but at times, after I hit submit I seem to get logged off, thus losing my comment.

Didn't there use to be a warning above the comment box advising one to copy their comment before submitting?

24. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172473 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 3:32 pm

JazzX...

The law of this country (UK) says that gay people, disabled people and females are equal to any other person.

In the U.S. women do not have constitutionally protected equal rights - The LDS made sure of that when it helped defeat the ERA back around 1978.

(Oh shit, I probably started some more contention!)

25. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172465 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 3:27 pm

emmet...

Sorry, he did ask you. I just had to get in the fun after all the serious stuff.

26. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172461 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 3:24 pm

Where do the dirty vodka martinis fit in?

Now that is more like it!

27. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172458 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 3:20 pm

No, in my case that is what causes things to move that shouldn't.

28. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172455 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 3:18 pm

...and after this thread I could use about 500mg.

29. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172453 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 3:17 pm

Podaar...

What I hate is when I think I see the static avatars move. How do you bock that?!

Lithium.

30. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172433 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 2:53 pm

Kyrie's quotes...

No one has even suggested the marriages were not legitimate.

Yes they have, you have simply ignored it.

I do think this case is an attack against "patriarchy", otherwise I see no difference in the two types of mothers.

Does the word underage have any meaning whatsoever to you? Do you actually know what the word "patriarchy" means? If so I would certainly like to hear your definitions of both words.

An FDLS mother has a married lifestyle, probably chosen, with the freedom to thrive inside that role.

Again you ignore the facts. Either that or you know absolutely nothing about what is going on with the FLDS. Male members have already admitted to marrying underaged girls, claiming they didn't know it was against the law. These young girls are not given a choice. The marriages are arranged, if you had been following this as you have claimed you would be fully aware of this. Obviously your brand of Christianity doesn't cover telling falsehoods.

Our understanding is likely nowhere close to what goes on at FLDS.

Speak for yourself. I have a very good understanding of the FLDS.

They did have phones and were able to call for help, until the government confiscated them.

Didn't happen. Again something you would know if you were following the situation.

So far, the "victims" are all saying "we aren't victims, please give us our children back"

The victims ARE the children.

They have had 3 weeks and no one has come forward.

No one needs to come forward now. Enough evidence has been discovered in due process to validate the state's actions.

I'll post this for the third time..."Of the 53 girls between the ages of 14 and 17 who are in state custody, 31 either have given birth or are expecting, officials have stated."... "Under Texas law, children under the age of 17 generally cannot consent to sex with an adult. A girl can get married with parental permission at 16, but none of these girls is believed to have a legal marriage under state law." - The AP

Polygamy is illegal even for adults in the United States.

What do you fail to understand about this? Never mind. Since it would contradict your whole argument I understand why you refuse to address the matter.

Why don't they investigate family by family and find the real victims if there are any to be found?

That is exactly what they are doing and while doing so they are protecting the suspected victims from any further possible abuse by extracting them from the alleged abusers. The inability of the young children to identify their biological parents or even know their last names is hampering the investigations.

I hope my light is obvious.

Not at all. I'll bite my tongue and leave it at that.

31. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172324 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 1:25 pm

Well I see no signs of inbreeding so I guess everyone is fine so far.

32. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172318 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 1:18 pm

Anybody think that this whole thread needs washed, rinsed, and repeated? I sure do. I haven't been up to speed since page one.

This FLDS thing really sticks in my gullet. Don't tell anyone, but I used to be a common everyday Mormon and I know how much sympathy there really is for what is going on in Texas. Exactly what appears to be exhibited by Kyrie, is on the minds of many Mormons with polygamist heritages.

What I am afraid of, if the allegations are in fact true which it certainly appears they are, is what happened in the 1950s when Arizona tried to intervene in a similar case in Colorado City (I believe was the location). Public opinion was swayed and the state turned out to be the bad guys and the FLDS the poor, oppressed victims. Since that time Arizona and Utah have turned a blind eye to years of arranged polygamist marriages, many, if not most, involving underaged girls.

Anyone who sympathizes with the FLDS is contributing to the oppression of women and sexual child abuse. It is already an established fact that the FLDS have been guilty of these things in the recent past, so it perfectly reasonable to suspect that it is occurring again in Texas. Especially when there is evidence to support it.

Something isn't right when a young child doesn't know who their biological mother is, know what I mean?

33. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172277 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 12:23 pm

Kyrie "So it's ok for a girl of age to be duped and broken hearted, as long as the guy doesn't get in any trouble he may be forced to be accountable for."

What ?? That isn't at all what what was being said, exactly the opposite in fact.

34. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172268 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 12:15 pm

Kyrie "Ok, Mabe the religious nut cases deserve what they get when lying to their protectors about their age just to be with their kids in custody."

They lied saying they were older than they really were, it wasn't to be with their kids, it was to obstruct justice.

Your sympathy towards the FLDS is deeply disturbing and I am afraid you are not being completely honest about your motivations.

I would suggest you read THIS if you still feel the state's action were unwarranted

35. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172260 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 12:00 pm

al-rawandi

will young,

I don't understand the argument "Why were the boys removed?"

Well do you want young boys learning to treat women as possessions and sex objects? Do you want them to view women 36 years younger than them as potential mates? These boys are being socialized into the same sick system.

That's a gimme, of course. It was also reported that once they reached a competitive age sexually, they were expelled from the community (there's that @#$% word again!).

BTW, I didn't say, "I don't understand the argument "Why were the boys removed?"", if that is what you meant by the above quote. Anytime any form of child abuse or neglect is suspected all minors are removed from the source regardless. You must have me confused with someone else.

36. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172196 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 10:32 am

Kyrie, "It wasn't the religeous weilding the fanatical power in this case."

So you find 14 year old girls manipulated into polygamous sexual relationships with 50 year old men normal do you?

Be honest now, what patriarchal religion to you follow? I am curious to understand how one who ascribes to such accepts casting women and children as subservient unfree agents and I would really like to get your perspective on the matter.

Put aside the issue of state intervention and simply address the known circumstances of underaged sexual abuse by the men of the FLDS and explain why it deserves legal protection from the state, because that has been your whole argument so far.

But at the very least drop the charade and come clean about your religious beliefs, you aren't fooling anyone.

37. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172151 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 9:17 am

Al

You are one of those nice idealists that think people read anything before opening their mouths. You will soon be disabused of any such notions.

Thanks, I think, and one could only hope, sadly I am possibly more hard-headed than you seem to be ;) and I never get bored. Once I learn to type all hell is gonna break loose, in a figurative sense, so thanks for the encouragement!

38. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172129 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 8:55 am

Kyrie

Since when does the government dictate mating criteria based on age?

You are kidding right?

How many of the 467 violated this law?

None, these are the suspected victims.

If you have been following this for a couple of weeks why do you not know this?

How many of the 467 do you think have been forcefully or incestually impregnated?

These are underaged children (is there any other kind?) so force or incest doesn't have to come into play for there to have been abuses committed.

It appears that so far 31 of 53 girls ages 14 to 17 have children, are pregnant or both. What number do you find acceptable?

Frankly Kyrie I think you are either arguing for the sake of arguing or you have ulterior motives for your position. In other words - I could be wrong of course - methinks I smell a rat.

39. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #172113 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 8:43 am

Comment #172034 by Kyrie Eleison...
"Do you really find kidnapping children based on geography and putting them on trial as a group reasonable?"

That is not what happened and saying so only empowers religious fanatics and draws sympathy to their cause.

It is certainly reasonable to err on the side of caution when it comes to children's well being.

40. Girl, 17, killed in Iraq for loving a British soldier

Comment #171862 by will young on April 29, 2008 at 12:38 am

To add to Goldy's reply to Kyrie's "What abuse?".

Authorities believe that of the 53 girls aged between 14 and 17, 29 are already mothers and two are pregnant. - BBC News

In addition, by the late 1990s, the genetic defect fumarase deficiency was occurring in the greatest concentration in the world among the fundamentalist Mormon polygamists of Colorado City, Arizona and Hildale, Utah. Fumarase deficiency causes, among other health problems, severe mental retardation, seizures, and physical deformities, and is caused by inbreeding. The FLDS community of Eldorado, Texas is populated with many members of the two original extended founding families who are presumed to be carriers of the mutation.

*
OT: The Kurdish girl who was stoned to death in a honor killing last year for dating a Muslim boy was Yazidi, not Muslim.

41. Soldier Sues Army, Saying His Atheism Led to Threats

Comment #169625 by will young on April 26, 2008 at 12:22 pm

As point blank as Article 11 is I have shown the Tripoli treaty to many christian nationalists, without much success frankly. Until some truth actually bites them on the ass most people only see what they want to see.

Never hurts to have it handy though.

42. Mount Vernon schools to hire investigator in Bible case

Comment #169352 by will young on April 25, 2008 at 8:05 pm

#9
"I don't see what the problem is with teaching the meaning of Good Friday and Easter."

#13
"The problem here, with this teacher, is not that he was explaining the meaning of Christian holidays to his class."

In a science class ?? You both are kidding right ??

From article
"R. Kelly Hamilton, one of Freshwater's attorneys, said last week that his client considers the Bible an item that brings him inspiration. He compared it to a personal photo that someone puts on a desk at work."

Except that a personal photograph is an accurate representation of reality and doesn't jump the wall between church and state.

43. Humans nearly wiped out 70,000 years ago, study says

Comment #168506 by will young on April 25, 2008 at 7:16 am

Beautiful mitochondrial DNA! Got to love her.

44. Student's 'Be Happy, Not Gay' t-shirt ok

Comment #168496 by will young on April 25, 2008 at 7:10 am

Now I get it!

'Be Happy, Not Gay!' is code for 'Sir, Please Fuck Me!'

45. Student's 'Be Happy, Not Gay' t-shirt ok

Comment #168464 by will young on April 25, 2008 at 6:53 am

If you're gay and try not to be how could you be happy? The phrase is asinine. I say let him wear the shirt to show what an ignorant fool he is.

46. Yoko Ono sues over use of John Lennon videos

Comment #168446 by will young on April 25, 2008 at 6:40 am

Good!

47. Lynchings in Congo as penis theft panic hits capital

Comment #166744 by will young on April 23, 2008 at 12:05 pm

The adult version of "I've got your nose!"

48. Sexpelled: No Intercourse Allowed

Comment #163038 by will young on April 17, 2008 at 9:44 pm

Unless we repent and accept Stork into our lives, we are doomed, doomed I tell you.

"Tempt not the wrath of Big Bird least ye be condemned to an eternity of feathers and gizzard stones." 1 Tweety 4:20

49. Sexpelled: No Intercourse Allowed

Comment #163029 by will young on April 17, 2008 at 9:10 pm

It has been over six hours since I watched the Sexpelled video and I am still smiling broadly and occasionally chuckling out loud.

Thank you Richard for your wonderful sense of humor.

50. Sexpelled: No Intercourse Allowed

Comment #162929 by will young on April 17, 2008 at 5:12 pm

I nearly died with laughter because of this shot.

Y'all are the best !!