801. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #189387 by al-rawandi on June 6, 2008 at 6:55 am

Fanusi,






Well done. With those citations. Thankfully, the numbers aren't quite as ominous here in the US.

The UK is a special place, it allows these parasites (radical types) to suck off the welfare tit before they crash an SUV full of explosives into an airport or something. The UK is in fact funding terrorism.


epeeist,



So can we get back to the facts now. The facts are that the UK has a very serious problem with Muslim radicals, and this problem is growing and not shrinking. I have indentified in previous posts exactly what groups these are, and which groups should be monitored by intelligence agencies.

My question is, being a liberal guy, what is your solution for dealing with people that find your lifestyle, your country, your 'beliefs', your wife, your daughters, as worthy of the nastiest contempt. How do you fix this problem? And let's add in that some are willing to carry out violent attacks (despite sucking off the welfare state) against you and your fellow citizens, and many wouldn't even tell the authorities in advance if their neighbor was planning such an attack.


This is where my mind got stuck in the liberal days of my life (not so long ago in fact).

802. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #189369 by al-rawandi on June 6, 2008 at 6:22 am

irate,






Oh come on we all know Keira Knightley has an eating disorder.


Anyhow, these were all independent claims made by DM, it seems Fanusi's citation is supported by plenty of other sources as well, not just DM. Perhaps it is a case of the Daily Mail getting it right by mistake.

803. Mark Steyn vs. the 'Sock Puppets'

Comment #189366 by al-rawandi on June 6, 2008 at 6:16 am

sjk,






Here is the problem with these international contracts, treaties, and other agreements... these things are diplomatic in nature. Negotiated agreements, they were negotiated on the basis of a strong assumption, that the countries involved shared similar values.

Diplomacy, when used between states that can respect the process and share common values is a great tool. If used with those who do not value what we value (individual liberty, human life, women's rights, the preference of peace to violence) it is a weakness.


Fanusi brings up Darfur, this is a perfect example of the UN's impotency. It is a body with no ability to enforce any of its high minded resolutions. If one wants to use diplomacy with thuggish nations, assuming you are foolish enough to do so, it must be backed up by a sizeable degree of force. There is no use in treating al-Qaeda, Hezbollah, or any other nasty, hateful ideology with respect or dignity. They don't return the favor and certainly do not share common values with the countries that opppose them.

Diplomacy won't work with our current enemies. The UN is impotent to enforce any resolution that matters. It falls to powerful and civilized nations to enforce at least a modicum of decency within the world. All the mental masturbation in the world over at UN HQ will do nothing to save a single life.

804. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #189357 by al-rawandi on June 6, 2008 at 5:51 am

Fanusi,





I have come to regard "Islamophobia" as so much useless liberal sloganeering. Imagine this term:


Naziphobia


Just like Islamophobia it makes no distinction on the basis of race, it makes a distinction based on a chosen ideology. Islamophobia applies to white converts as well as brown Muslims. It is the same as fearing someone for being a fascist, a homophobe, or a racist. These ideologies bother me the way Islam does.



epeeist,




Can you provide some instance of DM lying or distorting. Simply printing true reports about a despised minority does not make you a racist, it makes you an honest journalist.

So forgive me, as I usually trust your opinion, but here I cannot take your feelings on the matter as evidence.

805. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #189155 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 2:51 pm

Pathfinder,





First, I meant that people in Albania, or the Albanian Kosovars would be likely less religious and virginity might not be such an important point. In fact I get that impression having seen some Albanian women.... The clothing is not exactly Shariah compliant.

My name username is the name of a famous Muslim apostate:

Abu al-Husayn Ahmad bin Yahya bin Ishaq al-Rawandi, born in Northwest Afghanistan in 9th Century. He wrote a book called Kitab al-Zumurrud ("The Book of the Emerald"). In it he finally renounced Islamic doctrine and declared that he accepted the primacy of the human intellect, meaning that humans are given capacity to reason by god, in which case revelation must mesh with rational thought or else it isn't divine, and if it meshes with rational thought, then it is superfluous.

He also stated that miracles are simply legends and nothing more. He called a number of the prophet (ed. profit) Muhammad's miracles "fraudulent tricks".

For a Muslim in the 9th Century that thought was equivalent to discovering relativity, Uranium, and founding Playboy Industries, in one day.


I figure I will burn for a number of reasons if I strike out on this atheism thing. But so far I am ahead in the count.

806. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #189136 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 2:08 pm

Pathfinder,







Bosnia or Albania perhaps. Albania more so, Bosnia remains somewhat conservative after the conflict and the increase in religious identity.

807. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #189130 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 2:01 pm

Diacanu,







That was even a little gross for me.


I don't know if it is gay, but it is pretty gross. If a male friend did that I would stop hanging out with him because he is a whacked sicko, not because he is "gay".

808. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #189107 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 1:18 pm

Let's be honest, fighting the wars is a job for poor people.



It used to be that the wealthy, in America, would go to war. Roosevelt's kid did it, he led a special forces team in the South Pacific. JFK did it. But now I think, it is largely the under class that fights, because wars are less clear cut in terms of who we are fighting, and there are other economic opportunities. This doesn't make the war against radical Islam wrong, it just makes its dynamic a little different.

809. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #189098 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 12:48 pm

Fanusi,





In the American Interest this month, there is an interesting article, entitled "The Diplomacy Fallacy".

One of the things this guy says before he talks about diplomacy is that it is only really effective between countries that share common values. For instance diplomacy with a group like al-Qaeda is useless because there isn't a compromise to be made, there are no common values, the only option is violence.

I had that feeling when I read Robespierre and his commentary on Virtue and Terror, one without the other is often either evil or useless. The Diplomacy Fallacy also makes it clear that potential use of force is often the most coercive tool in getting people to agree to diplomacy.

Also one must distinguish between diplomacy as a process and diplomacy as an end.


*EDIT* 90% of statistics are wrong 50% of the time :-)

810. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #189069 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 10:54 am

elephant,







Wooter doesn't talk when Appleby is drinking water. Check that shit out!

811. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #189067 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 10:48 am

Fanusi,




The Young Turks, headed by Mustafa Kemal called their reform the Tanzimat. It is a Turkicization of the Arabic term meaning literally "reorganization" or more accurately "cleaning up".


Tanzimat round 2, Europe!

812. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #189066 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 10:39 am

Allan,





In between meetings and conference calls. Just dropped in to see.

You linked to the "Sufi Council". Sufis seem to have this image of being the antinomian wayfarer, smiling at all who pass. This simply isn't the case....

Hamas was based on the movement of 'Izz al-Din al-Qassam, himself a Sufi of the Qadari order and influencial in Sufi circles in Haifa. In fact the Qadari order of Sufis is widely identified with resistance movements all over the Muslim world. They are also some of the most fatalistic Muslims you will find.

Sayyid Ahmad Barelwi who led a long and violent campaign against the British in the Northwest Frontier Province was an initiate of the Chigishtiyya and Muhammadiyya orders (along with several others).

Ahmad Tijan, eponym of the widel popular Tijaniyya order, was described as a Wahhabi doctrinally.

Shah Waliullah Dihlavi, student of shaykh Daghestani and Muhammad Hayat al-Sindi (both teachers of Bin Abd al-Wahhab himself) in Mecca, returned to create a Sufi order much like those above. In fact the Taliban itself was the political expression of the Deobandi Sufi movement, developed in the Subcontinent.


I wouldn't trust Sufis just because you saw the whirling dervishes in Istanbul. Sufis are often the most strident in their desires for implementation of Shariah.



epeeist,



Your criticism of the Daily Mail is that irate_atheist does not like it? Shouldn't you show fanusi some place where they actually lied or distorted.

813. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #189031 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 8:37 am

Allan,




They only need to get enough of a bloc to get the larger parties to concede some points in order to maintain a coalition.


France is the country in biggest trouble. The natives don't breed much (stagnant) and the Muslim population is exploding.

814. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #188996 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 7:01 am

Quetz,





That is only until, after 20-40 years of out breeding, they have enough votes to make it happen.

815. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #188994 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 6:54 am

CommonToad,






Look Here

Why aren't these people being expelled? They are threatening murder.

816. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #188985 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 6:24 am

Skeptic Jim,






Perhaps. Or perhaps they were sick of the way Muslims behave in their country. For instance the grand mufti of Australia saying that women are to blame for rape. Or this Islamic council saying apostasy should be punished by death.


I wouldn't want such a Muslim school in my neighborhood either.

817. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #188982 by al-rawandi on June 5, 2008 at 5:57 am

Fanusi,




You said:

What you are leaving out is the hideous conditions of those that did not convert

However it is fair to say that the economic and social apartheid implemented by Islamic rulers made conversion the only option to most minorities. Otherwise the system was too oppressive.

818. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188770 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 2:02 pm

Podaar,




It is no coincidence that after I was born, in quick succession came "Kill 'em All" and "Ride the Lightning". It has become the anthem of my life.

When I played baseball, whenever I came in to pitch at the end of the game, the PA guy would cue a Metallica song of my choosing.



Frankus,


There is no need to plug your ears. The problem with these liberal herbivores is that they don't seem to understand (or care to understand) that humans are a part of the food chain, and a very important one at that.

Humans eat animals, the evolution of life on earth was intricately linked to our role in the food chain, I see no convincing evidence why we should remove ourselves. The "cuddly animal" argument underlies all this veggie-whining. There is a cloak used, called pseudo-rationalism, to disguise this. It isn't genuince compassion, because they are happy to allow animals to starve to death, rather than have them hunted, much like pro-lifers are often the biggest pro-war activists.

I eat meat because I am evolved to do so, and well equipped to procure this meat.

I don't apologize.

819. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188755 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 1:43 pm

mordacious1,





I prefer dogs to toads.

820. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188749 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 1:31 pm

Samir,

I would say any species would hold other animals of the same species with a higher regard because of the same reasons a brother should hold a higher regard for his sibling than say a 2nd cousin, genetic relatedness.

821. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188743 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 1:15 pm

Podaar,






You misunderstand how he debates. He takes something he doesn't like, that you said. He then distorts it beyond all recognition to construct an appropriately vulnerable straw man. He then flails away mercilessly at the strawman. Then he asks stupid (obviously so) questions of you, when you posit the obvious answer he then claims victory saying you "didn't answer".

It is the constant use of fabrications that is most annoying. I am not convinced he is wrong on every count, I am open to the possibility he is right, I am also not convinced that he knows what "truth" means.


It is one fabrication after another.

822. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188741 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 1:11 pm

Mitchell,

His retort was his disbelief of my comparison, and how "animals were lower" when I challenged this it went ignored. So I took it as silent concession.

823. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188728 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 12:28 pm

Mitchell,

(*sigh*) I'm not interested in arguing this with you.

824. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188725 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 12:25 pm

Mithcell,






To be honest, you make things up. Simple fabrications, I showed what those were, several times. You have had this habit for a while and it has happened on other threads.

Where you not saying to kill the deer to prevent accidents?

Non-human animals not having a personality is factually mistaken according to the evidence, and would be a statement of faith even if that weren't true.

825. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188720 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 12:17 pm

Mitchell,

It isn't up to us to regulate nature.

826. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188714 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 12:08 pm

Elli,




I suspect he spends his downtime gratifying himself to the women's underwear section of the Sear's catalogue. I was going to say as much, but I didn't know if everyone else had guessed he was a dorky college freshman.

827. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188710 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 12:06 pm

epeeist,

I also find the practice of shoots in this country where several hundred birds will be shot by a small number of "hunters" to be distasteful.

828. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188704 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 12:01 pm

Mitchell,

Would it be ok to regulate human populations like that? Where is the consistency there?

So kill all the deer to avoid the possibility of car accidents? Isn't that like pulling all your teeth to avoid cavities?

I don't support inhumane methods of culling meat. In fact hunting, which the flagrant hypocrites here so foolishy decry, is actually a way of population control. Most of these animals don't have predators (humans ARE their natural predator) in sufficient number to check the growth of population. Deer hunting, for instance prevents deer from starving to death, as they tax their natural food sources. You forgot to include humans in the food chain, which evolution did.

And perhaps you would care to look at how many people are killed every year as a result of cars colliding with deer. It is not insignificant. So not only is hunting acceptable, it provides benefit for both the animal population and people.

So kill all the deer to avoid the possibility of car accidents?

Since I have an affinity for logic

829. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188676 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 11:26 am

Appleby,

I'm not afraid of homosexuals. I kind of like them, actually.

830. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188673 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 11:20 am

mordacious1,





Exactly. So once the proletariat revolt and outlaw meat, your son can be a sacrifice for the greater good.

Or in a world of liberty, people are free to make their own moral choices. And the ones that have choices limited can continue to live their lives, eating all the fish and chicken they could want!

I hope I didn't say anything offensive with regard to your son. I am very glad to hear he is doing well. I cannot imagine a more difficult situation for a parent.

831. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188670 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 11:15 am

Mitchell,





Hypocirsy would mean you hold views that aren't cosistent with one another which is perfectly relevant to your argument. See the other thread on ad hominems.

I eat meat because it is the best form of protein money can buy. Do you think, that if I found a better and healthier source, one that I could consume daily with as high a level of absorbtion, I would continue to use an inferior product?

If you want to tell people to not eat meat because it is "immoral" you are doing several things. You are limiting people's liberty to pursue lifestyles that require them to eat meat. You are creating conflict for someone like Anna, who has little other choice when it comes to protein diet. And you are mandating your arbitrary moral position.

I don't support inhumane methods of culling meat. In fact hunting, which the flagrant hypocrites here so foolishy decry, is actually a way of population control. Most of these animals don't have predators (humans ARE their natural predator) in sufficient number to check the growth of population. Deer hunting, for instance prevents deer from starving to death, as they tax their natural food sources. You forgot to include humans in the food chain, which evolution did.

And perhaps you would care to look at how many people are killed every year as a result of cars colliding with deer. It is not insignificant. So not only is hunting acceptable, it provides benefit for both the animal population and people.

The only thing disgusting about the practice is imprisoning these animals first. But I see no other option as I have never heard of a ferral cow, so their hopes of returning to a wild state are slim.

So that being said, I am about to go enjoy about 30-40 grams of protein, in the form of meat.

832. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188642 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 9:58 am

Mitchell,







You have an overly active imagination. That is undeniable.

But to be more clear, epeeist was responding to my original post on meat eating which referred to amino acid content of meats. So perhaps if you had looked at that post to which he was responding you would have gained further context, which was that I was making a nutritional case for eating meat. So please don't lecture on context if you cannot bestir yourself to discover the original context.

My original comment was #188468, so noted in epeeist's post.

Can I also infer that you consider me an ethical pervert for eating meat? And not only that, for eating it in the quantities I do? If so I would love to go down that road, because for you, lies the trap of hypocrisy.


And finally; don't assume, it makes an ass of u and me.

833. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188635 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 9:39 am

Appleby,

You're gay too, aren't you? I can tell from your picture.

834. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188629 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 9:34 am

Mitchell,


*Sigh* You do have an active imagination, no doubt this is tied to your fascination with anime.

In what sense is saying that you would be better able to build musle if you eat animals an argument for it's ethicality exactly? That is easily an argument for a motivation for why you might want to do it, but are you going to suffer, or be in distress more than the animals that supply that protein if you can lift a few less lbs? In what way is the suffering greater if you can't achieve your dream physique?

835. Richard Dawkins Responds to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #188616 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 9:09 am

These are really my favorite.....




Some guy who has just learned what ad hominem means and has read a couple of books, looks around at his slack jawed friends, and thinks he is an intellectual promethian. Then he decides it is time to take theism on the road.

Big fish in the small intellectual pond (more of a puddle maybe) hits the road and comes to RD.net figuring a picayune amount erudition will carry the day. It will be a real awakening being intellectual dismembered by the posters here.

836. Is Science Killing the Soul?

Comment #188604 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 8:45 am

ArtfulDodger,





Answer the questions posed to you. Quetz has linked to them.


Disappearing for a week or two and then coming back and trying to go back to your old tricks won't work.

837. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188602 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 8:43 am

Podaar, Irate,






I know he is just trying to get something to stick to justify his homophobia. I was just getting in a dig.

Anyhow, this particular homophobe is especially irrational and eratic. It must be difficult to pretend to be rational while harboring such irrational beliefs. He just won't answer and direct questions either, it is truly annoying, on par with wooter.

838. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188589 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 8:19 am

Is he making the case for bestiality.



This is getting out of control.

839. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188577 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 8:05 am

irate,






I don't take those things personally, so you don't have to worry about being abrasive with me. I dish it and I can take it.

840. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188564 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 7:54 am

Stop feeding the troll!

841. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188529 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 7:25 am

elephant,






It would naturally go both ways. His girlfriend would be free to fellate Mr. Ed.



I wouldn't tell your wife any of this. But then again, I wouldn't even get married, I am just trying to keep variegation in the gene pool if you get my drift.

842. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188521 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 7:09 am

irate,






Evidence of the foregone conclusion of an idiot, constantly changing arguments. First it is adoption, then it is sheep shagging. "I hate gay people, let's see which argument sticks".

843. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188515 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 7:05 am

Appleby,





Did it ever occur to you that the equipment for sex is evolved to work only with other members of the species?


Or would you mind your girlfriend getting slammed by an elephant dong?

844. 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'

Comment #188513 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 7:04 am

Mom was gunned down simply for speaking up.




I am shocked that John McCain still thinks things are "going well" and we can establish civilized democracy.

845. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188509 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 7:01 am

epeeist,





You can get amino acids in supplement form. For instance, after every workout I take Branch Chain Amino Acids, but the fact remains, that even though the nutrition industry has made amazing supplements, the best way to get nutrition is through food.

For instance protein absorbtion rates are highest in eggs and fish. It is hard to get these levels of absorbtion elsewhere, if not impossible. Like I said, one can be a vegetarian and be just fine, but they won't be able to achieve tip top performance or physique. I have respect for vegetarians, they way I respect anyone who takes a principled stand, but I don't think it is sensical to say it is "all the same" in terms of dietary value.


Also protein concentration is higher in meat as well. For instance Mr. Olympia winner Jay Cutler eats 5 lbs. of fish per day (mostly Orage Roughy). He would never be able to take in an equivalent amount of protein with another substance, while maintaining protein absorbtion rates as high as with fish.

But I should say my goals are different from most people, I lift 5 days a week and eat 275-300 grams of protein per day. Others don't share these goals and this is fine.

846. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188492 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 6:47 am

Quetz,






I rather wish it was women that found me irresistable, but I will take what I can get. Although I couldn't date him, I would be worried he would be seeing a possum on the side.

847. Town moves against Islamic school

Comment #188491 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 6:44 am

Fanusi,






The ranks swelled through conversion.


And besides this, I already said the Islamic empire was spread by military adventure.

You also ignored the case of Indonesia, there was no Muslim army, no Caliphate, it was mass conversion.

848. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188479 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 6:26 am

epeeist,






I mean no disrespect, but that vegetarian thing is nonsense IMHO.


The reason is that amino acids are different in plants than they are in meat, for a truly healthy and balanced diet one needs both plant amino acids as well as animal. And as for tofu, it has an estrogen like substance in it which can have some unpleasant effects on the endocrine system.

So meat is necessary for a proper diet, but one can certainly live a life that is healthy without it. But if you look at any peak performers in the exertion sports... football (American or British), bodybuilding, etc... Meat is a necessary and ubiquitous part of the diet. Certainly no bodybuilder could survive as a vegetarian, and very few performance athletes have ever managed it, and those that did suffered major damage to their bodies.

849. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188470 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 6:09 am

All,








If anyone has noticed, Appleby flails about. Firing all potential arguments off that he can. This is a good clue.

When someone has arrived at a logical conclusion they usually have some process of logic which they can recount. If you look at people who have dogmatic a priori beliefs (conclusions) they generally will try any crazy argument that comes to mind, and as each are shot down they move on to the next.

When someone tries this many arguments, most of which are ad hoc, it suggests to me that they are trying to support a conclusion they have arrived at long ago, without evidence or argument. It is a common theme in both theism and bigotry, two of the most pernicious forms of dogma.


So our friend here has tried:

1) Unfit to raise children
2) Not the norm.
3) Same as bestiality.


Can anyone remember any of the other arguments clumsily deployed by this half wit?



Appleby,


Pick one argument and stick with it. You are just throwing things at a wall and hoping it sticks.

850. Storm erupts over 'virginity' divorce

Comment #188468 by al-rawandi on June 4, 2008 at 6:06 am

Steve,





This guy is so incredibly dumb as to put wooter in the running for a Nobel Prize in literature.


Animal flesh contains protein and invaluable amino acids that are necessary to human muscle development and health. Without eating animals humans would have been unlikely to survive in their environment. Thus eating meat is a necessary part of the human diet.

I doubt appelby can demonstrate sex with an animal is necessary to human survival.