801. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38430 by Logicel on May 8, 2007 at 4:44 am

Atheists accept that theists sincerely believe in their beliefs despite lack of evidence, and that their beliefs are real to them. Bizarro Bunting could not go even that far in trusting that atheists know their own mind.

802. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38427 by Logicel on May 8, 2007 at 4:39 am

I agree with BaronOchs regarding the nature of Bunting's demand regardless if it is a facetious or sincere request for proof--that it is insulting in its implication we do not know our own minds and that if we did, we would lie anyway.

803. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38411 by Logicel on May 8, 2007 at 3:32 am

knox wrote, To kill people for believing something!
_______

You making it sound whimsical with your using something. In addition, you are not focusing on the aspects of the discussion in this thread which are clearly indicating that it is a very thorny question. Further more, no one is advocating that the new atheists who are in essence a herd of independent 'cats', band together and use this vague 'killing people for believing in something' as the strictly enforceable cannon of their 'movement'.

You do more damage in encouraging a sane discussion on thorny topics with your approach. Discussing ideas are not the same thing as endorsing them. I have found these discussions invaluable, and I appreciate their frankness.

804. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38399 by Logicel on May 8, 2007 at 2:19 am

phil rimmer wrote: It should also address the mixed blessing of this in a modern society, and the need for society to, ipso facto, demand proof for any individual's assertions. Etc. Etc.
_______

As relevo pointed out (93. Comment #38361 by relevo) and so many other posters before him, governments in general/society do not tend to encourage critical thinking. Obviously, it is not just the particular form of sloppy or non-thinking of which supporters of religious superstitions do, but in general, us humans shy away from emphasing that critical thinking--the teaching, learning, practicing, and applying it--is crucial for humanity in order to progress. Criticizing religion and its silly notion that believing without evidence is good is just a part of the more encompassing struggle of identifying concrete ways of encouraging critical thinking.

Our frontal lobes, which handle critical thinking, long term planning, etc. need to be 'pampered'. In the fight/flight reaction, the blood flows from the frontal lobes into the motor cortex to facilitate the flight/fight response. We do not feel this blood ebbing from our thinking region in our brains though we do feel the heart pounding, rapid breathing, etc. In performance psychology, emphasis is placed on maintaining calm in the face of stress, knowing how to compensate for the thinking center becoming less aware because of reduced blood flow. Already, elite members of our society use this tool via mediation/biofeedback.

As far as having family members who are not interested in listening to the challenging of their religious superstitions, I would suggest to focus on using critical thinking with them in other non-religious spheres of their lives, because that is the skill once developed will aid supporters of religious superstitions to start to turn the potency of critical thinking themselves onto the once taboo topic of their own religious superstitions. You, yourself, in doing this, will increase your own critical thinking skills.

And as others have mentioned, how do you qualitatively measure the positive effect that these hot-selling atheism books are having? How do you measure the viral effects of web-based discussions, videos, audios, blogging, etc.? Don't reduce arbitrarily the number of chickens before they start hatching and laying eggs which results in more chickens, more eggs, etc. Also, yet again, as others have stated, the religious side often 'pump' up the sales of their books.

805. My response to the GOP evolution question

Comment #38394 by Logicel on May 8, 2007 at 1:13 am

I selected an avatar from the list this site provides, and only the word avatar appears in the upper left corner of my comments (I have now deleted that). How can I make the actual avatar appear?

806. Richard Dawkins on Canada AM

Comment #38292 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 12:40 pm

not working for me either.

807. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38290 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 12:38 pm

We are getting our butts kicked.
_____

Good, cigarette smoking is not good for us.

808. Those fanatical atheists

Comment #38282 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 12:10 pm

I dutifully clicked on the above url, and I found the mention of god and praying in every one of the posts that I browsed. I lost interest.

809. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38258 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 10:35 am

Carter Maxwell, Sorry, as I would love to help out a fellow atheist, but the full bottle that was untouched during the reading of TGD was quickly absorbed into my body by osmosis by my just looking at the front cover of the Koran.

810. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38256 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 10:29 am

Carter Maxwell, if that is the case, then her facetiousness along with that annoyingly barricaded demand of with proof is still out of place in an article entirely lacking in humor.

811. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38245 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 10:11 am

great stuff, MorituriMax, I am tempted to email the following:

I read the Bible while imbibing an entire bottle of 100% proof whiskey so as to be able to bear the horror of the many violent passages. I then read The God Delusion, and lo and behold, it was not necessary to imbibe in the same manner as it was during the reading of the Bible.

I am forwarding a scan of the 100% proof label from the empty whiskey bottle as evidence of my conversion.

812. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38238 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 9:46 am

Why not, "Anyone who has experienced such a conversion, please email me with proof?" Why was Ms Bunting compelled to relegate with proof to its own pathetic little parenthetical island? Was it an afterthought? A literary burp akin to indigestion following eating a bit of undercooked potato (a la Dickens)?

813. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38237 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 9:42 am

Anyone who has experienced such a conversion, please email me (with proof).
________

I suggest that Bizarro Dawkins donate his user ID so Ms Bunting can bask in the alliterative splendor of Bizarro Bunting. The above quote is such a lame little bit of foolishness, that it is supplying a steady supply of chuckles today for me.

814. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38235 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 9:37 am

Tukka wrote, ... perhaps even surpassing the efficacy of religion itself in these areas.
_______

Nice post. But the above bit is a bit cocky and prideful, don't you think? How can anything be better than religion which is supreme and proven effective in promoting peace and well being? Why look for an improvement, when what we got at present is so mind boggling replete in it success? (:-)))

815. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38226 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 9:15 am

Robert Maynard, I agree with all your points. Perhaps discoveries in neuroscience will eventually help us, along with other measures, in being able to accurately identify those whose brains are unable to function in a manner which promotes humanity. But, it seems that it will always be a delicate proposition, to not to tempt tyranny/eugenics.

However, the challenging nature of such a prospect must not in itself deter efforts in finding a solution. With advances in science, from increasing our longevity, to replacing worn body parts, genetic engineering, all of these developments are and will be challenging to regulate and promote well for the benefit of humanity. But then again, that it how it always has been. The rapid increase in science and technology, however, is happening on a much steeper incline than ever before in our human history.

816. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38223 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 9:01 am

Apart from an ongoing anxiety about Islam, the British are pretty phlegmatic about religion. Church attendance continues its steady decline and the Christian evangelical boom has never taken off.

and

Does religion still have an important role in human wellbeing?
______

I think what is even more a pressing question, Ms Bunting, is the following: Should the craft of making horse harnesses, which was reputed to increase the happiness of the harness maker, be allowed to continue to decline just because it was replaced by auto manufacturing?

817. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38217 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 8:44 am

Meanwhile, critics in America argue that the polarisation of the debate in the US is setting the cause of non-deism back rather than advancing it.
______

Well, that does it again, Ms Bunting, if critics are saying that the cause of non-deism is putting it back rather than advancing it, then that is the truth.

818. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38214 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 8:40 am

As one New York commentator put it, we're familiar with religious intolerance, now we have to recognise irreligious intolerance.
_____

For such an erudite word crafter like Ms Bunting, it is a bit off putting to witness her conflating irreligious intolerance with criticism of religion.

819. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38212 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 8:30 am

...but one suspects that they are going to do very little to challenge the appeal of a phenomenon they loathe too much to understand.
________

OK, Ms Bunting, you have convinced me the errors of my loud atheistic ways. I trust your crystal ball much more than the reality of books on atheism going like hot cakes. I agree with you that such heated sales are because the buyers crave to support these writers in their retirement, not because they crave the knowledge contained within these cantankerous writings.

820. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38208 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 8:15 am

I agree, Brian, it does make the blood run cold. Why not say, ".... be ethical to imprison people for believing them". And even that change is a bit redolent of tyranny.

821. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38202 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 8:05 am

22. Comment #38193 by BaronOchs on May 7, 2007 at 7:42 am / By proof, I wonder what she means? A scanned copy of a receipt for TGD? Three photos of yourself, first with a Bible, then The God Delusion, then nothing, and ..a smile?



Be careful she doesn't drop the envelope and get them in the wrong order.

___________

Hilarious!

822. The New Atheists loathe religion far too much to plausibly challenge it

Comment #38200 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 7:58 am

Corylus wrote, I don't understand. How can you "loathe something far too much to plausibly challenge it?"
_________

The recognition and focusing on disgust is used in therapy to change behavior. So in loathing theism, atheists can drum up enough disgust to fuel a sustained confrontation against religious superstitions, effecting change and keeping religion separate from the public sphere. Theists, themselves, are not loathed, but their ridiculous and potentially dangerous concept that belief without any evidence is good, is what is loathed.

So, I agree, Corylus, that this author is ignorant of how powerful a motivator disgust can be.

823. Unholy row at clergy soccer game

Comment #38189 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 7:34 am

Since I don't understand Norwegian all I could do was to focus on what seemed to be very happy and friendly people, judging from their facial expressions.

824. Those fanatical atheists

Comment #38171 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 7:04 am

Fantastic content from the title to the last word, penned in an exhilaratingly entertaining style. I cannot pay any better compliment to this author than my saying that I wish I had wrote this article instead of him.

825. The torture of the grave Islam and the afterlife

Comment #38161 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 6:28 am

BaronOchs, I agree with your all points.

You wrote, If people want to practice a delusional faith in a free society they should be able to do so without having treatment "applied" to them against their will.

My point is that as there is similarity in the indoctrination aspect of both mainstream religions and classic cults, that perhaps what has been learned from deprograming members of the classic cults, like Moonies, could be 'applied' in advancing a way of assisting recovering supporters of religious superstitions to deal with their anger and sense of loss of an all loving though a bit nutty sky daddy. I did not mean that this 'application' be forcibly done, as it has been for the members of the classic cults (and I do not agree with forced therapy even in the case with classic cults). I suppose my not clearly explaining what I meant by 'apply' motivated your describing my comment as being a bit 'sinister'?

826. The torture of the grave Islam and the afterlife

Comment #38143 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 5:41 am

BaronOchs, Please delineate the vast differences between mainstream religions and cults--when you have the time of course.

827. Atheists go on the political offensive in God-fearing US

Comment #38141 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 5:38 am

And those churches then house therapists that assist in helping former supporters of religious superstitions to not only embrace reality but to flourish within it, so the religious scourge can never return?

828. Atheists go on the political offensive in God-fearing US

Comment #38139 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 5:34 am

Biz wrote, I must admit that reading this article makes my stomach turn. But then I have to remember the fact that everywhere I have traveled in this country, there is a church within 10 minutes.
_______

Fantastic. Really. Anxiety resulting from the realization that 'loud' atheists are making progress, including the political kind. Just imagine the ton of Pepto-BIZmol little ole Biz will have to down if all those churches become empty and remain so?

829. The torture of the grave Islam and the afterlife

Comment #38136 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 5:10 am

Hylo wrote: But regardless of how they acquired the beliefs, it doesn't change the fact that what they believe is so far beyond the pale that they could rightly be considered in need of psychological care, especially if the beliefs they hold can lead them to kill themselves and others.
______

As all religions are cults, and there has been therapy designed to deprogram followers of cults, then perhaps, this kind of therapy can/will be applied to supporters of religious superstitions.

830. The torture of the grave Islam and the afterlife

Comment #38135 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 5:07 am

Cremation, which the Hindus do, must be considered anathema to the muslims--it would take all the potency out of the scare tactics of 'coffin torture.'

831. The torture of the grave Islam and the afterlife

Comment #38133 by Logicel on May 7, 2007 at 5:05 am

bitbutter wrote: I think the suggestion here is that the victims of the bomb would go to paradise anyway, and that idea is consoling for their relatives. Presumably you get to skip the trail in the grave if your body is badly damaged enough when you die.
______

What a way to ramp up the violence in a society, to make violence perfectly feasible, because its destructive effects, the destruction of human bodies, will ensure the escaping of 'coffin torture.'

832. Christians and Atheists to Debate Existence of God in First-Ever 'NIGHTLINE FACE OFF'

Comment #37907 by Logicel on May 6, 2007 at 8:00 am

BTW, OsakaGuy was at the debate between the Chiquita boys and the RRS. So be sure to check out his summary via:


http://www.richarddawkins.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=14055

833. Christians and Atheists to Debate Existence of God in First-Ever 'NIGHTLINE FACE OFF'

Comment #37878 by Logicel on May 6, 2007 at 4:52 am

Here is some sneak preview info and transcripts of the debate:


http://www.rationalresponders.com/forum/the_rational_response_squad_radio_show/the_rational_response_squad/6587

834. The moment a teenage girl was stoned to death for loving the wrong boy

Comment #37869 by Logicel on May 6, 2007 at 4:15 am

When I was a very young woman, with that strange brew of denial--idealism, immaturity, and self-centeredness--coursing through my veins, I had vehemently stated that I could never act in a 'non or in-human' way. NEVER. A wonderful atheist, a few years older than I, with whom I was living, said, "BOLLOCKS", and went on to assist, by discussing the reality of what being human means, in my maturing somewhat.

You can play semantics all you desire, but these depraved humans are humans, their depravity do not make them any less human. Not considering them human, will only retard our progress in learning how to understand, prevent, and control the awful depravities we are all capable of committing. We need to study our own kind to improve our own kind--as a personal God is a delusion, and it just us humans on this planet.

835. The moment a teenage girl was stoned to death for loving the wrong boy

Comment #37863 by Logicel on May 6, 2007 at 4:00 am

Way back last November, some of us had discussed how to deal with trolls who were causing problems in clogging up discussions by sapping the positive energy of sincere posters who wanted to learn and improve their debating skills. Site adm then came up with the creation of a separate troll thread. Allowing posters to assist monitoring the site and not banning trolls completely--they get their own thread after all--is a positive approach. However, I suggest that site adm. allow posters the chance to give our reasons why we are flagging another as a troll.

I have never flagged Robertson as a troll, though I do regard when he writes profusely, saying the same thing over and over again, he approaches troll-like behavior. I have flagged two atheists, one for being offensive and another for being a troll. And I have flagged some rabid theists as trolls also.

Robertson's popping up with new user IDs into the main discussion thread after being relegated as a troll is becoming absurd. However, his stubbornness, if it could only be channeled into positive results, is admirable.

836. Interview with Pierre Rehov

Comment #37855 by Logicel on May 6, 2007 at 3:13 am

Sounds like Rehov thinks that extreme practitioners of religious superstitions are the problem, and not the 'benign' moderate practitioners. Yet, it is the emphasis on accepting faith-based ideology without any evidence that is the problem, regardless if it is secularly or religiously based. This regarding of groundless faith as being good is the nasty little nugget of unrelenting ignorance that is preventing humanity from advancing to a more rational stage of being.

837. The moment a teenage girl was stoned to death for loving the wrong boy

Comment #37687 by Logicel on May 5, 2007 at 1:14 pm

Like others, I chose not to watch the video. As Amnesty International stated, these criminals need to be caught, tried, and punished.

To take a young woman's life and in such a brutal, sustained manner of stoning, must require a complete lack of awareness/consciousness in order to complete this atrocity on your own kin.

Think of the terror that must be felt by the close-by inhabitants to ensure their continuing compliance in the blind faith of tribal/religious beliefs. Think of the blood that will beget more blood which is the way of warlike, primitive, patriarchal, tribal cultures made even more divisive by the practice of religious superstitions. The viciousness of this circle of depraved, non-thinking acts will be very challenging to break, but it will be broken.

838. Martin Amis reviews The Islamist: Why I Joined Radical Islam in Britain, What I Saw Inside and Why I Left by Ed Hussain

Comment #37667 by Logicel on May 5, 2007 at 12:41 pm

Insightful and astute article.

Someday, weefree will break his teeth on that old bone of atheism being a fanatical belief system on which he obsessively gnaws.


Seriously, I am in awe at your ability to warp reality.


Robert Maynard, I too am flabbergasted at what weefree does--been reading his posts for months now and his consistency in being blinkered saddens me.

839. The kiss that brought immorality debate to a head

Comment #37645 by Logicel on May 5, 2007 at 12:18 pm

Well done, RD!

840. Lou Dobbs Interviews Christopher Hitchens

Comment #37628 by Logicel on May 5, 2007 at 11:49 am

I was impressed and cheered that Dobbs enabled Hitchens to emphasize how religion is brutally dismissive of human sexuality via the list of virgin births and the mention of genital mutilation of both sexes.

Religion's stranglehold prevents proper sexual education, birth control/family planning, AIDS prevention, acceptance of gay relationships/marriages, and last but not least, the enjoyment of sex for its natural pleasures, all which causes so many to suffer needlessly.

841. Author of the Year Ad

Comment #37566 by Logicel on May 5, 2007 at 1:39 am

phasmagigas wrote, ...in the USA I just cringe when i see promotion photos of people (esp. real estate sellers), they tend to be really really awful.
________

They look like friendly ghouls!

I did think the photo TIME chose was too stern, but this one is fine which shows RDs thoughtfulness and sincerity with that lovely upward gazing towards the enlightening power of rationality.

842. Bonobos and chimps 'speak' with gestures

Comment #37308 by Logicel on May 4, 2007 at 4:04 am

I prefer multimodal communication when in person--I feel at ease with the Italians, but a little uncomfortable with the English and the Scandinavians.

I remember seeing an educational film in a Psychology class decades ago which shown a person from a 'multimodal' culture getting increasingly frustrated at the 'cool' communication style of a person from a less expressive culture. The guy from the 'hot' culture finally climbed over the 'cool' person's desk to get closer, flailing his arms in a friendly fashion all the while! The 'cool' guy barricaded himself behind the desk and was looking longingly at a nearby window to make his desperate escape. Still makes me laugh.

843. Your favorite book in the last 25 years?

Comment #37304 by Logicel on May 4, 2007 at 3:31 am

Ah, that is why some poster here saw the discount on TGD--she/he was worried that it might not mean something positive!

My fave? The Da Vinci Code. ONLY KIDDING!

It's a nice promotion from Waterstones, and I will try to take advantage of it.

My faves from the ones which I have read:

The Unbearable Lightness of Being
Love in the Time of Cholera
Angela's Ashes
The English Patient
Trainspotting
The Bonfire of the Vanities
The Remains of the Day
The Silence of the Lambs
Cold Mountain
LA Confidential
TGD
Notes from a Small Island
The Handmaid's Tale

844. Christians and Atheists to Debate Existence of God in First-Ever 'NIGHTLINE FACE OFF'

Comment #37296 by Logicel on May 4, 2007 at 2:54 am

Riley, I forwarded your excellent comment #37212, including your user ID, to the discussion forum at RRS on the upcoming debate with the 'Chiquita Boys' (thanks, bhyde for the coinage). Sapient reads that thread. I wanted to email it to him, but the guy gets too much email. Go figure.


http://www.rationalresponders.com/forum/the_rational_response_squad_radio_show/the_rational_response_squad/6334?page=3

845. How multiculturalism is betraying women

Comment #37000 by Logicel on May 3, 2007 at 5:19 am

I still remember vividly how it was during the 1950's and early 1960's for women in America. When women were beaten/raped, they were not believed, or they were made to feel that they caused the beating/rape. Perpetrators of incest were seldom jailed or even reprimanded. Male cops, and they were the only kind back then, would come when battered kids or women called for help, and they, how can I say, handled the situation with not much empathy. Male doctors, and the majority of doctors were male back then, would often treat rape victims with disdain. Women were often not encouraged to take science/math courses and therefore were not eligible for well paying jobs, resulting in women being forced to remain with cruel male husbands/lovers. Birth control/planning, sexual education, and abortion rights were either barely there or not there at all.

Down-beaten people often just take the injustice meted out to them in silence. It was a great achievement of Western civilization that many aspects which were considered normal for women in the 50s/60s are now considered less than satisfactory, intolerable, or criminal. Publicizing the double standard in which women of different cultures are treated from native-born women is necessary and will result in change.

846. In Ducks, War of the Sexes Plays Out in the Evolution of Genitalia

Comment #36990 by Logicel on May 3, 2007 at 4:22 am

CJ, hilarious post!

Dr. McCracken, who discovered the longest known bird phallus on an Argentine duck in 2001, is struck by the fact that it was a woman who discovered the complexity of female birds. "Maybe it's the male bias we all have," he said. "It's just been out there, waiting to be discovered."
________

Nice musing. I often muse of the potential discoveries that could be made by 50% of our species if they were allowed to be educated, literate, and in control of their own bodies. But then again, there are lots of kids, male and female, who are not allowed to be educated and embrace science.

847. When Seeing Is Disbelieving

Comment #36661 by Logicel on May 2, 2007 at 1:09 am

PKid wrote, how could one compete without a delusion about one's ability and to have an ability to concentrate that turns off the rest of the world?
________

Psychological studies done on top athletes show that their winning edge comes not from delusion but from solution-focused (focusing on what they do right and not wrong), intentional training resulting in implicit learning (intuition) and heightened awareness of their honed skills and experience.

Awareness is a tough game to do consistently. Perhaps we are hard wired for lapses of our awareness for survival purposes, but such an evolutionary advantage can cut into the quality of our lives by allowing us to be dull and drowsy. Biofeedback and mediation can increase our ability to maintain awareness. When aware, we then possess the 'will' to act.

848. 4 Sermon for Matins: 'Dawkins and The God Delusion'

Comment #36653 by Logicel on May 2, 2007 at 12:26 am

Bonzai wrote, God is only valid (in a vacuous sense)as a hypothesis as long as it is just a place holder for unknown causes and has absolutely no explanatory power. Religion can only "win",-- actually just not losing,-- in an intellectual debate by surrendering pre-emtively. This is the paradox.
_______

Except this approach is neither winning or even not losing--it is such absurd dragging of the intellectual feet that it is laughable.

Moderates are simply being stubborn. Their penchant and their familiarity with vacuous wording gives them a false sense of their power to persuade. The moderates' style of communication is as emotionally bankrupt as their so-called content or core beliefs. How bankrupt? As bankrupt as lying to themselves and to the people of whom they are supposedly in charge.

Again, I will have to say, that I regard moderates as being even more cunningly addictive--and the most difficult of addicts to rehabilitate are the ones who are the most cunning--in their clinging to religious superstitions than the fundamentalists. They have tailor made their particular style of addiction so nicely, that they have no intention or need of kicking the habit. They rationalize expertly therefore entertaining the feeble notion that they are being rational, cherry pick to their heart's content, and flirt with doubt to give a frisson of authenticity to their beliefs.

849. 4 Sermon for Matins: 'Dawkins and The God Delusion'

Comment #36559 by Logicel on May 1, 2007 at 2:27 pm

...but whether the language associated with the supernatural - the language of spirit and of the miraculous - helps us describe the world we inhabit in a way that complements the language of evolution and natural selection which Dawkins uses.
__________

So it is the language which describes make-believe that is important? This screams of desperation for a rationale to stay cloven to religion which is getting challenged for the useless claptrap it is. So it is not the ridiculous, contradictory beliefs which are important, or even God, that whimsical tyrant, but the LANGUAGE of religion.

What is he talking about? What language? Latin? Biblical language? Language of sermons? What special province does religious language, whatever that may be, have that secular poetry, prose, and music do not?

Moderates drive me nuts.

850. The God Delusion

Comment #36431 by Logicel on May 1, 2007 at 5:19 am

nice post, Thor