901. Dinesh D'Souza says I don't exist: an atheist at Virginia Tech

Comment #33577 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 3:56 pm

74. Comment #33575 by Janus on April 20, 2007 at 3:52 pm

When does lying become immoral?

We all fudge the truth, tell white lies, omit to mention things and generally engage in activities that take the rough edge off social intercourse.

I really have come to the conclusion though, that religion perpetrates such a persistent fraud on people that it should at the very least carry a health warning.

902. Here Comes the Fourth Musketeer.

Comment #33572 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 3:47 pm

7. Comment #33570 by SuperStingray on April 20, 2007 at 3:45 pm

Who was the "third musketeer?"

Daniel Dennett, sometimes considered the third in the holy trinity of Atheism. However, he is a pretender!!! The true trinity (as all UAU members know) is Dawkins-Harris-Sagan. Not Dennett at all. It's a very serious error to fall into:-(

903. Here Comes the Fourth Musketeer.

Comment #33569 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 3:43 pm

Ah well, keep on keeping on. Allied Atheist Alliance or United Atheist League? LOL

Neither!!! We must spurn the schimists of the AAA, and reject the false path of the UAL. No these false paths will not do. We must all embrace the Unified Atheist Union, pronounced ohh - ahh - ohh.

This orgasmic sound bite will draw in the masses, bend them to our will and then ... THE WORLD will be OURS for the taking. All too easy ....

904. Dinesh D'Souza says I don't exist: an atheist at Virginia Tech

Comment #33563 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 3:23 pm

I even found the Christian minister's speech at Tuesday's convocation to be one of the most moving, not because of the religious content, but because of his genuine and heartfelt message. This horrible tragedy is not the time to challenge people's faith.

Amen to that. Wonderful to hear from you, and so glad you made it. I am deeply sorry and upset about your fellow students and professors. Wish there was more I could say:-(

905. Dinesh D'Souza says I don't exist: an atheist at Virginia Tech

Comment #33560 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 3:19 pm

What is our attempt at comforting them? "She lived a good life."? Religion can always trump that by one step further - "She lived a good life and is in a better place." And the relatives want comfort, not primarily the truth as the latter won't alleviate their pain.

Though as the Phelps tirelessly point out .... She may be in a far, far worse place. I mean , how can these people be certain that the dead have gone one way or the other, or anywhere? Even among the most "learned theologians" there is endless dispute about the detail of faith. With zero objective evidence, how could there NOT be?

Aaack pisses me off, because its leveraging on peoples vulnerability to get them to fund a given brand of bullshit.

906. Gay hate church to picket VT gun rampage funerals

Comment #33556 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 3:12 pm

re Gun control. In the UK only criminals go to jail for fire arms offences.Give everyone guns and the jails will be full of jilted lovers and West Ham supporters.

Exactly. Maybe what the US needs is to do a pilot. Some summer, arm everyone in the most gung ho red neck gun totin' state/city/county (Florida maybe) and see how that works out. The scientific method at it's best:-)

907. The Empty Wager

Comment #33554 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 3:08 pm

This is hardly the case.
At any rate, I tried this little forum, but it appears I will have to look elsewhere for meaningful dialogue.

Oh no ... I'm so injured!!!! Don't let the door hit your ass etc.:-)

Comments such as this last one lead me wonder just how much theology you (and other atheists) have actually studied.

Personally, I've dabbled, but you got the bit about it being a non subject right? I suspect you may be confusing it with philosophy. Not the same thing.

Do forgive my being reluctant to indulge a discussion on a collection of myths randomly selected by a clutch of 3rd and 4th century paedofiles. If I've caused offence, be assured, it's absolutely intentional.

everything that is facile and intellectually lame must have a religious root.

Nope, pure empiricism. There are a growing body of studies that show religious faith correlates negativley with intelligence, education and in the benightened US of A, political affiliation.

Are all religious people stupid Republicans? No. Are all Atheists brilliant? Of course not. However, the mean Atheist is more intelligent, educated and successful than your mean theist, and no where near as mean:-)

Join the winning team, if you've studied theology for any length of time, you know religion is made up bullshit that has morphed through the ages to pacify the masses:-)

908. Gay hate church to picket VT gun rampage funerals

Comment #33551 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 2:52 pm

Wouldn't the simpler solution be to make it hard to access deadly weapons, especially for those mentally ill like the VT shooter? The 2nd amendment fanatics would say that the criminals will always find a way to get a gun. As long as there are 2nd amendment fanatics, that will probably be true. A textbook self-fulfilling prophecy.

This is a source of utter bemusement to the rest of the world I think. Certainly most Europeans. You've summed it up nicely.

909. Gay hate church to picket VT gun rampage funerals

Comment #33550 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 2:49 pm

I do not wish to be compared to stalin anymore than the average xian (of who I am not one) wants nor should should be compared to this vulgar, foulmouthed,attention seeking fool.
I trust you understand my simple statment this time.

I understood it the first time, but I genuinely disagree. These people claim to represent a deity, and the Deity does not to dispute that. Case closed, they represent that Deity. This is just playing be their rules. Surely an all powerful God could intervene to remove a bunch of fraudulent tricksters?

Logic dictates that every Christian that claims the blessing of God represents him, unless God says otherwise. Atheists don't have to worry about that, luckily. Besides, the Phelps have a far sounder scriptural footing than most churches. God really does spend an awful lot of his time smiting people.

Logic tars these suckers all with the same brush, and we shouldn't be coy about saying that.

910. The Empty Wager

Comment #33546 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 2:36 pm

Lastly, being new to this community, I didn't realize that the forum had such hostility to theists merely trying to inject some additional clarity. Perhaps this is not the best forum for me.

Oh don't be such a pansy. I went easy on you. We really are rather allergic to theology. Forewarned is forearmed. eh? :-)

The vast unwashed masses of religiondom wouldn't know a profundity if it bit them in the ass. Total overkill.

Once the majority of mankind has been dragged up from subsistence level existence, a little common sense should see them right. Theology don't enter into it, in fact Theology's function is to obscure the obvious absence of a God.

911. The Empty Wager

Comment #33541 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 2:21 pm

(I have a PhD in theology),

You'll find that of little value here. We don't have much respect for those with PhD's in fairiology either.

As to your comments about PW, most atheists, and I suspect Harris as well, object to it's modern usage by theists. This is invariably as a kind of Gotcha! to show that it's a safer bet to "beleive" than not to "beleive".

This meaning I'll grant you is daft, and has been refuted ad nauseum in the thread. However. if there is a misunderstanding of Pascals intent it's on the theistic side not ours.

912. Gay hate church to picket VT gun rampage funerals

Comment #33528 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 1:47 pm

33. Comment #33513 by the great teapot on April 20, 2007 at 1:01 pm

Come on chaps , this is a cheap shot.
These people no more represent xians than stalin represents atheists.

Here's the thing. The Phelps and their ilk claim to speak for God. God fails to intervene, which is puzzling. Stalin you claim, speaks for Atheists, atheists have spoken out against Stalin, tried to kill him, resisted him in their limited human way.

My questions is, whats Gods excuse?

913. Sam's Flea!

Comment #33522 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 1:25 pm

You have to wonder if the Christian intelligentsia will become a danger to themselves and others absent a God. If NASA discovered life on Mars, or a race of intelligent aliens from a nearby solar system arrived on our doorstep, or sent us a message, would this destroy the faith of the true beleiver?

I rather think not.

If canny aliens arrived and claimed to be Jesus returning in triumph, a sizeable proportion of these people would turn on their fellow humans, and side with the invader. I mean how would they know what Jesus returning will really be like?

Worrying ...

914. Sam's Flea!

Comment #33503 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 12:39 pm

Guys, it's a fatal error to engage these people on this level. They need to be defending their specific and absurd beliefs not indulging themselves in metaphysical claptrap.

You beleive in the trinity? Why? How? Where is the evidence?
You think Jesus was a man, but God too? A zillion sects beleived that shit, what makes your one remotely credible?
The miracles in the gospels prove Jesus divinity? I can see the same stuff done live by Indian Guru's on youtube, why don't you bow down and worship these guys?

The metaphysical stuff is interesting, when everyone involved is being honest, but these people cannot possibly be honest, it is actually impossible for them. You need to insist they defend the indefensible stuff, not let them off the hook by talking about fluffy stuff.

915. A debate on people who profess no religion

Comment #33356 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 20, 2007 at 12:03 am

Carey is a LIAR. Bill Gates, and Warren Buffett are the most substantial philantropists that the world has ever seen.

When the catholic church can match the money these "atheists" have stumped up, then we can talk again.

916. Dinesh D'Souza says I don't exist: an atheist at Virginia Tech

Comment #33350 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 19, 2007 at 11:34 pm

I really want to hear what the atheist would tell the grieving mothers.

As opposed to that they are (possibly) burning in Hell, or (possibly) sipping milk and feasting on Honey in Heaven, but to be perfectly honest we haven't the first idea what has happened to them, if anything?

917. Dinesh D'Souza says I don't exist: an atheist at Virginia Tech

Comment #33342 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 19, 2007 at 10:57 pm

But it begs the question: who are the religious, to prey on people in their moment of weakness? Is it morally just that religion seeks to give consolation with the added hook of required belief, at the time when people are at their most addled and vulnerable.

Excellent point. This fraud is most readily perpetrated on the young, the injured, the weak or disoriented. Is it any wonder this criminal misrepresentation persists, when people are exposed to it, when least able to see the rotting support struts behind the painted facade?

918. Sam's Flea!

Comment #33332 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 19, 2007 at 10:08 pm

Even Christian conservatives, with a very narrow, specific, and rigid Biblicism, can't agree on how to understand basic textual issues surrounding law, biblical morality, and the like

This is the core of the issue. We even have evidence of it on the thread.

But I gotta tell ya, I identified with the core message early on….. I realized that the emotionally charged words of our pastor were just that……. emotions…..

This poster subtle mocks me for being foolish enough, as a young adolescent, to believe that what the pastor was telling me was true with a capital T. To beleive what the Bible was saying. He's right of course, such credulity does deserve mockery, but all biblical credulity does, not just the bits he's cherry picked as being "right".

The fluff about "objective" morality is just that. It is not a genuine discussion about morality, but pure interference to obscure the core bullshit at the heart of any given religion.

As long as more than one human exists, Bible or no Bible, morality will be in flux around a central core of agreed principles. The Bible can even be used as a source to support this view!! God destroys the world except for Noah and his family, yet not more than a few hours after landfall, disagreements and disputes arise:-) Geuss killing everyone wasn't such a productive move.

Designating an external supernatural source as the final arbiter of morality, makes no more sense than making that arbiter a king, or an alien super race, or even an alien super race that arrives on our doorstep and makes a claim to have created the universe.

If we would be sensibly skeptical of such claims by beings we could see and touch, why on earth would we take the meandering, contradictory muttering of some ancient text at face value?

919. Sam's Flea!

Comment #33190 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 19, 2007 at 2:30 pm

This guy is great : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Zqbz563pNQ

920. Sam's Flea!

Comment #33188 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 19, 2007 at 2:29 pm

What to do? Perhaps another evangelical would be willing to publicly challenge Wilson.

Best to ignore these people, and concentrate on the one to one conversations with "normal" people. The vast majority of christian "leadership" are aware of the dreadul fraud they are prosecuting on the poor saps that fill up the pews on Sunday, they are too invested (and I don't mean that metaphorically) to kill this holy cash cow.

Nope, a dialogue with these people is utterly impossible. Have it with the man on the virtual street.

921. NEXT MONDAY: Bill O'Reilly interviews Richard Dawkins

Comment #33170 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 19, 2007 at 2:07 pm

He looks like a nasty piece of work.

He is. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLPuGuaZTx8

922. Sam's Flea!

Comment #33168 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 19, 2007 at 2:03 pm

You know, there really needs to be an OMNIBUS BOOK OF ARGUMENTS FOR AND AGAINST THE EXISTENCE OF GOD. This would have two benefits:


Thats not a bad idea. There actually aren't all that many arguments .... I bet you could compile a list right on the site, simply cut and paste the link.

What galls me about these arguments, is the dishonesty of the theist. They come to the discussion hiding the really crazy stuff, because they know it's indefensible. I just can't muster up respect for that. When I was a theist, I never hid what I beleived, I was never ashamed of it ... until I realised it was mostly nonsense, but that was gradual.

Put your cards on the table, so we can see you're hopeless from the get go, thats saves an awful lot of trouble.

923. Sam's Flea!

Comment #33145 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 19, 2007 at 1:32 pm

I'm not that type of atheist, and I'm starting to see why we get labeled "fundamentalists" by religious apologists. I'm also sick of being called that. I think it's great that Mr. Robertson and Mr. Wilson have dropped by here, and I hope we can all invite them to talk. If we're right, then what are we afraid of?

No one is "afraid", we've just heard it all before. These people really think an invisible man in the sky killed his "son", who came back from the dead to save the world. The invisible man in the sky is simultaneously all knowing, loving and powerful.

All the rest, the theology, the philosophy is simply window dressing to obscure the indefensible and irrational bullshit at the heart of Christianity/Islam, pick your poison.
RANT ON
How do you discuss that? I don't know who created the universe, but these lying fuckwits (and they really are that) don't know either.

When they admit that as their opening gambit, and admit they have no idea if the shit in the paragraph above is real, then we can explore the options. Religious certainty has been given far to free a ride, and we SHOULD be ruthlessly intolerant of all absolute certainties, because these are the beliefs that get people to kill, and be killed.

Honestly. If you come to the table with certainity about Jesus, Thor, Allah or whatever YOU ARE A FUCKWIT. There is no way around this truth.
RANT OFF

924. Christians at Bible publishers have their throats cut

Comment #33072 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 19, 2007 at 5:04 am

Fundmentalist atheist intolerance is just as dangerous as religious.

I love it when you guys say this. Enjoy my Dogma video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYqWTgwVx9k

925. Christians at Bible publishers have their throats cut

Comment #32985 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 18, 2007 at 11:31 pm

Hey Isik let me be (one of?) the first to welcome you into the EU. Turkey joining will be on of the most critical steps on the path to both European and Global unity.

Can't agree with you on the Mohammed thing, but if we can agree to disagree, that works for me. Welcome to the EU:-)

Oh yes, and I am still pimping the 2nd "episode" in From faith to freedom.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtgNlP28yBo

Had real trouble getting the sound synced., all comments, critiques etc. welcome. I'm hoping that this will be instructive and helpful for "recovering fundamentalists", as well give those of you with no exposure to the mind set, a little insight into same.

926. Christians at Bible publishers have their throats cut

Comment #32983 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 18, 2007 at 11:25 pm

7. Comment #32939 by NakedCelt on April 18, 2007 at 7:15 pm

Convertedchristian: Possibly, initially. But mightn't Turkish inclusion be better in the long run? It would be a significant blow to the current nation-state system where most states have a de facto religious consensus congenial to the kind of thinking exemplified in these murders. If Turkey were in the EU, it would no longer be so generally true that "European = Christian". I suspect that that fact is behind a lot of the opposition.

SNAP!!! :-)

927. Christians at Bible publishers have their throats cut

Comment #32982 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 18, 2007 at 11:24 pm

5. Comment #32915 by Convertedchristian on April 18, 2007 at 5:20 pm

I think if turkey is admited into the EU more of ths type of stuff is going to happen.

Why do you think that? If Turkey joins the EU, the pressure for increased secularisation will be massive, and a "Christian" EU can have a stake finally hammered into it's heart. No man, we need these guys in the EU, and they need us. Don't let a few wackos trigger your "outgroup" alert.

928. Sam's Flea!

Comment #32981 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 18, 2007 at 11:18 pm

120. Comment #32978 by krogercomplete on April 18, 2007 at 10:54 pm

"Morality is simply common sense, the application of the golden rule and evolution derived empathy. Allow your ingroup to encompass everyone and it's case closed. We don't need to overthink it."

What were all you philosophers thinking? What a waste of time.

Now, now don't get nasty. I grant you it's more complex at root than that. However, for the vast majority of people, what I have described, is I think, sufficient and probably all that many people have time for. Why do you think billions of humans hand off this realm to "God"?

It's also the conclusion that many philosophers have come to, the big difference is that we now have a biological framework, a context, that explains why we like helping other humans.

929. The Empty Wager

Comment #32979 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 18, 2007 at 11:05 pm

To this subject one must add that a lifetime of study would not suffice to plumb the depths of every religion, and their myriad subdivisions. Hence people generally adopt whats local and convenient. Thus a trip to Hell, in most cases will be an accident of geography, nothing more. Bummer.

My 2nd "episode" in From faith to freedom is up.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtgNlP28yBo

Had real trouble getting the sound synced., all comments, critiques etc. welcome. I'm hoping that this will be instructive and helpful for "recovering fundamentalists", as well give those of you with no exposure to the mind set, a little insight into same.

930. Sam's Flea!

Comment #32974 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 18, 2007 at 10:42 pm

Damn ... missed the party!!

Morality is simply common sense, the application of the golden rule and evolution derived empathy. Allow your ingroup to encompass everyone and it's case closed. We don't need to overthink it.

The "there is no objective rule" card is a theists trick to obfuscate, because fog and confusion allows the introduction of God as a solution, where none is actually required.

My 2nd "episode" in From faith to freedom. Had real trouble getting the sound synced., all comments, critiques etc. welcome. I'm hoping that this will be instructive and helpful for "recovering fundamentalists", as well as giving those of you with little or no exposure to the mind set, a little insight into same.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtgNlP28yBo

931. Sam's Flea!

Comment #32815 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 18, 2007 at 10:13 am

. Comment #32814 by The_Pun_King on April 18, 2007 at 10:07 am
That definition of objective morality extremely subjective? You're begging the question. Whose basic guideline?? Yours, mine, Hitler's?

Mine. For I am the lord your God, thou shalt not kick the shit out of people who are different from you. That means humanity in general, not just, you know the jews. Genocide is totally out. Yea, thou shalt not even punch thy fellow man lightly on the shoulder, or give him (or her) an unexpected wedgie. See it is written. Right here. Obey my commands or perish and fester in a ... a ... pit of ticklish feathers.

Boy, that would have improved the Bible substantially.

932. Sam's Flea!

Comment #32813 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 18, 2007 at 10:06 am

All, I have begun a series on my journey from Faith to Freedom. First "episode" below. I'd appreciate all feedback.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvwnEygRLxc

933. Sam's Flea!

Comment #32812 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 18, 2007 at 10:05 am

I'm just curious how you can make statements like "Yeah, he's not responding to the "arguments presented" in LtaCN." without having read the book. This just makes you sound like a fundamentalist of another stripe. You may not be religious, but you're sounding equally irrational.


I don't need to read every book on UFO's to know they are all crap. Just a few, and I have. Nobody questions that except abduction nuts. I've read only a few articles on the "9/11 was an inside job" story, and it's obvious conspiracy nut bullshit. Case closed. Time alas does not allow for every lunatic to get a hearing.

If anything, I've read far more religious psycho babble than is probably healthy, I don't need to read anything more than the back cover to dismiss this drivel as more of the same.

The sheer cultural intertia, accrued through millenia of violence, oppression and enforced deference lends religion a respect and substance that the detail clearly does not deserve. Thats all you're feeling. It deserves no more respect than "I was abducted by aliens" does.

934. The God of the Bible is No Delusion!

Comment #32580 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 17, 2007 at 12:51 pm

986. Comment #32579 by Mark Taunton on April 17, 2007 at 12:44 pm

Lee & Quetz:


Hey Mark, I've begun to document my path from Faith to Unbelief you might find it instructive :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvwnEygRLxc

A variations of pascals wager: If I'm right and you're wrong, you will have wasted your life on a lie. If God truly is merciful and loving, he will understand your need to be sure that you are on the right path, if he doesn't understand he's hardly worth worshipping is he?

935. Kadra attacked in public

Comment #32259 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 16, 2007 at 1:12 pm

Remember it was Ayaan Hirsi Ali's father that protected her from this brutal practice, and her grandmother who ensured that it got done in his absence.

It's the same pathology with hazing. It was done to us, so I do it the next generation, and so the stupidity is perpetuated.

936. Kadra attacked in public

Comment #32248 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 16, 2007 at 12:16 pm

Perhaps, I am being naive, but what I get from the posts in this thread, is that female sexual mutilation including infibulation is wrong, whether it is done by immigrants in their adopted countries, or by natives in their own.

I think that is spot on. I firmly believe in global laws for a global people, but tolerating sexual mutilation does not feature longterm in that vision:-(

I suppose in the short to medium term, we may be forced to accept it occuring in Somalia and similar stone age societies, but it should be ruthlessly rooted out in the developed world, and eventually everywhere.

937. Kadra attacked in public

Comment #32179 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 16, 2007 at 5:28 am

The postmodernist idea that we've no right to be critical of other cultures has only generated a repugnant double standard.

As a sometime embracer of this idea, I have to agree. Some ground rules simply cannot be up for "negotiation".

The mutilation of children, and the terrifying them with mythical horror stories claimed to be real has got stop.

As far as I'm concerned you can immolate yourself for Allah, chop of your genetalia for Jesus and barbecue your balls for Jehovah. If you want to martyr yourself, go for it, but we can't simply stand by and allow some delusional halfwit to martyr their children. This has got to be where we draw the line.

938. Nisbet and Mooney in the WaPo: snake oil for the snake oil salesmen

Comment #32177 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 16, 2007 at 5:12 am

Rtambree and briancoughlanworldcitizen, thank you so much, I cant stop giggling this morning!

Our pleasure I'm sure:-)

Mind_Rebel, please don't ever stop posting,

Amen to that:-)

939. Nisbet and Mooney in the WaPo: snake oil for the snake oil salesmen

Comment #32070 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 12:53 pm

I have a little something I put together on the subject of Dogma : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYqWTgwVx9k

Enjoy:-)

940. Kadra attacked in public

Comment #32027 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 9:33 am

They need to find these guys and expel them from Norway and send them back to Somalia. If they want to live in the stone age, let them actually do it:-(

941. The God of the Bible is No Delusion!

Comment #32019 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 8:55 am

It also seems unwise to cite Catholic or other denominations' doctrinal positions to me, if you're not prepared to back them up yourself!

We can't let you get away with that:-)

I dismiss your obscure little group for much the same reason I dismiss AGW deniers, or 9/11 conspiracy theorists. Is it really likely that some tiny clique has stumbled on some vast and resounding truth in the Bible that everyone else has missed? No I'm afraid, that I'll have to take the catholic churches word over yours as regards the scriptural accuracy of any given dogma:-)

This is of course distinct and separate from the idea that the Bible is nonsense at root.

Finally, Atheists are not a vanishingly small section of society, and never have been. On the contrary, everyone is an atheist about every God but their own, and at least a billion of us don't beleive in even our local branch. Why this should be, is uncontroversial. Religions are obvious nonsense, this is glaringly self evident when we look at someone elses religion. From your smug comment about catholicism, you clearly recognise it for the pomp laden, empty trash that it is.

Where it not for childhood indoctrination, the Gods would have few followers indeed.

Not to put too fine a point on it, some 6.5 billion of us are Atheists about your particular God. That 112 of you beleive things that no one else beleives, is not particularly compelling.

942. The God of the Bible is No Delusion!

Comment #32015 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 8:25 am

Mark, as I've pointed out on many occasions (quite some time ago!!), your group constitute a vanishingly small droplet of wierd in a vast sea of unreason.

Your views on Hell are good marketing (for a modern audience) but poor Biblical scholarship. Both Catholic and mainstream protestant dogma, are in broad agreement that hell exists, and that the "unsaved" are tormented after death.

It's cool you don't beleive it's real though, your on your way:-)

943. As Religious Strife Grows, Europe's Atheists Seize Pulpit

Comment #32008 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 7:57 am

Speaking from my lovely vantage point here in Belfast, I would say you are bang on in your assesment of Ireland.

Ahhh a fellow Irishman. Are you a catholic Atheist, or a protestant Atheist??:-)

I live in Sweden now, but I get the impression that the economic boom in the South has begun to spill over into the North. Are unemployment rates etc., coming down?

Certainly the "home rule" is "rome rule" soundbite has been completely undercut, in fact the south is becoming a kind of neo pagan culture, not a single one of my family are remotely religious, I was the final hold out. Boy were they shocked when I told them:-) Felt good though.

944. The God of the Bible is No Delusion!

Comment #32002 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 7:27 am

Hey guys .... try and refute this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FatTbfGCJVI

945. Nisbet and Mooney in the WaPo: snake oil for the snake oil salesmen

Comment #31995 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 6:51 am

We will never recant!!!! NEVER! Lo, if the sun is extinguished and the earth melts away, our love for the Harris-Dawkins-Sagan entity, triune and triumphant, will never pass.

May the scathing mockery of Dawkins, the implacable logic of Harris and the gentle humour of Sagan verbally eviscerate you, and all your capering demon ilk.

But brother come, I too accept Russel and his teapot, if you will but leave aside this pretender Dennett and embrace Sagan ....


We won't be forced to KILL every man, woman and child that supports you and your band of schemeing heretical heathen humanists!! Repent, recant for Anthroprogenic Global Warming is at hand!!!

946. Nisbet and Mooney in the WaPo: snake oil for the snake oil salesmen

Comment #31987 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 5:59 am

OK fellow infidels, my latest effort at re-educating the masses. The Ethics of Hell. Post, promote and dsitribute according to taste : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FatTbfGCJVI

Except the scurrilous schismist Rtambree, you are henceforth banned!!! Thats right, Fatwa on your ass!!!

I laugh in the face of your Bearded one. Is he not merely a surrogate for their God? That beard, that fatherly demeanour .... you are the ones that have been misled, seduced by his enticing santa like Godliness. Repent miserable deceivers all!!! Sagan is the third one, not Dennett.

947. As Religious Strife Grows, Europe's Atheists Seize Pulpit

Comment #31986 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 5:54 am

OK fellow infidels, my latest effort at re-educating the masses. The Ethics of Hell. Post, promote and dsitribute according to taste : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FatTbfGCJVI

Except the scurrilous schismist Rtambree, you are henceforth banned!!! Thats right, Fatwa on your ass!!!

948. Thanks for the Facts. Now Sell Them.

Comment #31984 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 5:52 am

OK fellow infidels, my latest effort at re-educating the masses. The Ethics of Hell. Post, promote and dsitribute according to taste : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FatTbfGCJVI

949. Nisbet and Mooney in the WaPo: snake oil for the snake oil salesmen

Comment #31967 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 4:30 am

I've noticed that MIND_REBEL does not attack anyone here personally, even when attacked! I suggest therefore that we all cut him/her a little slack, allow this person to perhaps learn and gain experience.

Good point:-) Great rousing stuff from PZ. I am becoming a veritable evangelist for atheism myself:-)

Oh yes and rtmrambtree is a filthy, verminous unbeleiver (in the trinity of atheism). You must have no discourse with him, yay until the 10th generation, shalt thou oppress and enslave the fruit of his benightened loins.

950. As Religious Strife Grows, Europe's Atheists Seize Pulpit

Comment #31963 by briancoughlanworldcitizen on April 15, 2007 at 4:10 am

Heretic! Dennett is the third member of the Holy Trinity, not Sagan! Burn Brother Briancouglanworldcitizen! Our Church needs reform and the blasphemy-enablers punished! Schism!

Verminous unbeleiver!!! Dennet yet lives, and his name starts with a D!!! On asthetic and humorous grounds alone you must be expunged from the body of Atheism!!!!

Whos with me brothers, who'll join me in saving the Atheistic Alliance (AA for short) from the filty 5th columnists, and secret theists in our midst? WHOS WITH ME!!!!?