51. Consciousness Without Faith

Comment #16656 by Aussie on January 7, 2007 at 11:20 pm

The problem with many atheists is that we are still struggling with the ongoing effort of trying to throw off a whole lot of superstitious garbage that has been shoved down our throats for many years. As a result we can have a negative knee jerk reaction to anything that even suggests the supernatural. This can force us into becoming very one-dimensional in our world view.

However, we really have to be careful about not throwing out the baby with the bathwater. Imagine what the reactions would have been in 1900 to anyone trying to explain the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle. Even when I was studying it in 3rd year University physics in the 1960s it blew my mind and I initially found it very difficult to accept because is smacked of the metaphysical. My gut reaction was similar to that of Einstein who could never entertain the idea of probabilities in the Heisenberg sense. Now everybody accepts the Uncertainly Principle as a standard part of physics. Even more bizarre now are the bases and conclusions of String Theory, parallel universes and so on that are currently becoming so popular.

Many people here I should imagine have not yet experienced the phenomena that are being described by Sam and are somewhat bemused and afraid of what is unfamiliar to them. In the same way we can become afraid and suspicious of String Theory because we do not have the background to understand it. Apart from attempting to be rational we should also understand that it is important to be open-minded and unafraid of exploring all sorts of issues including those that challenge our current world view.

Although I am regarded as the arch skeptic in my circle, because I will not accept anything at face value, I have nevertheless actually experienced some of the phenomena discussed by Sam above and am enthusiastic about his attempts to understand these experiences in rational terms. In contrast to some of the comments here I find that Sam's approach actually complements Richard Dawkins' approach rather than opposes or diminishes it. To give you an example my brother, who is a actually a professional theologian, finds Sam's philosophy very close to his own and because my brother is also a contemplative like Sam he clicks in with Sam's approach to the degree that he agrees with almost everything that Sam says.

The reality is that there are a small percentage of religious people out there, who have had experiences that most of the rest of us have never had. These experiences are nevertheless real and unless you can address them in the way that Sam has then these people will continue to equate these experiences to something supernatural or religious which they are not.

Richard Dawkins' approach appeals very much to my own scientific background and mindset while Sam's approach strikes a chord with my brother who has himself written books on spirituality amongst other subjects. We need both approaches because different people are persuaded by different arguments.

I cannot praise Sam Harris' article above enough because he is addressing a most important issue that Richard's book does not and it is a market segment that is huge and exceedingly important.

52. Without God, Gall Is Permitted

Comment #16247 by Aussie on January 5, 2007 at 5:25 pm

Articles like this are a testimony to the efficacy of the efforts of Richard, Sam and Daniel.

Imagine how disappointed we would be if we did not see many reactionary articles like the above. It is important to encourage them in order to keep the pot boiling as long as possible.

Imagine the USA so transformed that its belief statistics matched those of Scandanavia.

53. Without God, Gall Is Permitted

Comment #16244 by Aussie on January 5, 2007 at 5:17 pm

What is new about the new atheists? It's not their arguments. Spend as much time as you like with a pile of the recent anti-religion books, but you won't encounter a single point you didn't hear in your freshman dormitory.

Sad.
You could not comprehend the arguments then and you still cannot comprehend them now. Why do you want even more arguments that are beyond your abilities.

54. Atheists challenge the religious right

Comment #16237 by Aussie on January 5, 2007 at 4:49 pm

The term "non-theist" also puts the emphasis on the "non" and hence makes it very clear that the onus is on the theist to justify their theism rather than the non-theist having to justify their non-acceptance of theism.

We should not have to start out with theism as an axiom.

55. Atheists challenge the religious right

Comment #16227 by Aussie on January 5, 2007 at 4:23 pm

"atheists and other nontheists"

I dont understand. Surely the definition of atheist is non-theist, and vice-versa.


Atheist is anyone who is not a theist and hence equivalent to non-theist.

"Non-theist" does not carry the historical baggage of unfortunate connotation that "atheist" does. I much prefer it to all other terms currently floating about seeking acceptance.

56. Atheists challenge the religious right

Comment #16145 by Aussie on January 5, 2007 at 1:00 am

MeIM,

We need more of the likes of Wafa Sultan.

The other poor sod didn't get a word in - but he did take a few notes on what he would have liked to have said if he had had the chance.

Nice to see the tables turned occasionally with an articulate woman putting these misogynists in their place.

57. Pat Robertson: God told me of 'mass killing' in 2007

Comment #15965 by Aussie on January 4, 2007 at 2:21 am

God spoke to me and told me that Pat Robertson was a nut case and to take no notice of anything that he said.

58. No religion and an end to war: how thinkers see the future

Comment #15964 by Aussie on January 4, 2007 at 2:18 am

Optimist, Pessimist and Realist.

59. Letter From America: Atheists throw down the gauntlet

Comment #15962 by Aussie on January 4, 2007 at 2:13 am

with Christian fundamentalism engaging in no violence or threats.

Iraq?

Undermining of the Middle East peace process to bring on the "Rapture"?

This guy is almost totally uninformed.

60. If they preach the cause of the poor, they're my people

Comment #15960 by Aussie on January 4, 2007 at 2:04 am

I don't care if they are Muslim, Catholic or Church of England - if they preach the cause of the poor and the needy in our bloated materialistic world, then they are my people.

This guy has obviously never come across the Christian right. He doesn't know what he is talking about

...the culture of greed at institutions such as Goldman Sachs.

Many of the right wing evangelicals would put Goldman Sachs to shame in the greed stakes.

61. Executing Saddam Hussein was an Act of Vandalism

Comment #15958 by Aussie on January 4, 2007 at 1:52 am

Who knows - he may even have responded well to rehabilitation.

Then we could have restored him to his former position to sort out the current mess that no one else seems capable of fixing.

We have lost a real treasure.

62. America's Holy Warriors

Comment #15794 by Aussie on January 3, 2007 at 3:22 am

Would it be worthwhile for some of us to infiltrate right wing Christian groups to find out what is really going on.

However I am not sure I would be happy about tithing to such organisations even in the interests of intelligence gathering for a worthy cause.

63. What are you optimistic about? Why?

Comment #15771 by Aussie on January 2, 2007 at 8:35 pm

Pat Robertson is not very optimistic.

He has the advantage of a direct line though so he knows what he is talking about.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/01/02/robertson.predictions.ap/index.html

64. How Old is the Grand Canyon? Park Service Won't Say

Comment #15467 by Aussie on December 31, 2006 at 3:51 pm

My brother tells me that his friends in the US buy books like Sam Harris' and other with cash so there is no money trail. That's police state stuff. In the 'free' western world.

Veronique:

This does not surprise me as the Patriot Act of 2001 has some very draconian provisions.

From Wikipedia:


Perhaps the most controversial section of the original Act was Section 215, dealing with a very narrow, implied right of federal investigators to access library and bookstore records. Section 215 allows FBI agents to obtain a warrant in camera (in secret) from the United States Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court for library or bookstore records of anyone connected to an investigation of international terrorism or spying. On its face, the section does not even refer to "libraries," but rather to business records and other tangible items in general.[4] Civil libertarians and librarians in particular, argue that this provision violates patrons' human rights and it has now come to be called the "library provision." The Justice Department defends Section 215 by saying that because it requires an order to be issued by a FISA Court judge, it provides better protection for libraries.


Your brother's friends have good reason to be cautious as we are talking about the country that gave us the McCarthy era and more recently unauthorised phone taps. Many Americans are justifiably quite nervous.

Just for the record, and in keeping with the travel disclosures of previous contributors, I am a discerning Americanophile of over 20 visits.

65. Not Yet The Majority But No Longer Silent

Comment #15463 by Aussie on December 31, 2006 at 2:56 pm

Up until a few years ago I had no idea of, or interest in, the religious beliefs of any of our Australian members of parliament. It is only since the religious right in the US has enjoyed such apparent electoral success that our own politicians, looking across the Pacific, have thought that there might be a vote or two in it for themselves and have started religious posturing of their own in pathetic imitation.

I despair over this as being just another example of the insidious and relentless Americanisation that we are allowing to impoverish almost all other cultures around the world.

66. 10 myths - and 10 truths - about atheism

Comment #15353 by Aussie on December 30, 2006 at 4:14 pm

Does anyone know of even one impartial and non-religious scientific authority who advocates the YEC hypothesis:

"I am an atheist/agnostic/non-believer and I am convinced that the scientific evidence overwhelmingly supports the hypothesis that life on earth was created in its full diversity over a period of seven days less than 10,000 years ago."

Or is religious faith a sine qua non for such advocacy.

And what does that then tell us about the hypothesis.

67. How Old is the Grand Canyon? Park Service Won't Say

Comment #15349 by Aussie on December 30, 2006 at 3:38 pm

Thank God for Australia!

You don't realise how good you have it until you see what people in other countries have to put up with.

68. God's Enemies Are More Honest Than His Friends

Comment #15347 by Aussie on December 30, 2006 at 3:10 pm

Make no mistake about it. Santa is dangerous. A simple mutation involving a single base pair transposition and he emerges as Satan.

69. Woman beaten on Jerusalem bus for refusing to move to rear seat

Comment #15242 by Aussie on December 29, 2006 at 9:49 pm

Seems like Christians are no better. This spells out the hierarchy in no uncertain terms:

1 Corinthians 11:

But I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a woman is her husband, and the head of Christ is God. Any man who prays or prophesies with his head covered dishonors his head, but any woman who prays or prophesies with her head unveiled dishonors her head--it is the same as if her head were shaven. For if a woman will not veil herself, then she should cut off her hair; but if it is disgraceful for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her wear a veil. For a man ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but woman is the glory of man. (For man was not made from woman, but woman from man. Neither was man created for woman, but woman for man.) That is why a woman ought to have a veil on her head, because of the angels.

Anybody who can seriously believe that this crap is the literal word of the Creator of the Universe is beyond help.

70. 10 myths - and 10 truths - about atheism

Comment #15237 by Aussie on December 29, 2006 at 7:52 pm

Of late I have detected a subtle but growing realisation by David Robertson of the untenability of his irrational position. He may in fact be slowly recognising the grievousness of his sins against intellectual honesty and his guilt in enticing young, gullible innocents down paths of darkness and superstition.

But David is not lost. He should not despair but rejoice in the knowledge that he is loved by all members of the fellowship of atheists on this site. Total and complete forgiveness will be his if only he will renounce his sinful ways and embrace the Truth by accepting the overwhelming evidence before his eyes. The choice is his.

71. God's Enemies Are More Honest Than His Friends

Comment #15228 by Aussie on December 29, 2006 at 7:03 pm

While we are on the question of Australia and Sam Harris the following is a link that I originally sent to Josh who must have had good reason for not posting it. Anyway here it is if you wish to follow it up youself.

Stephen Crittenden interviews Sam Harris on ABC's Radio National Religion Report (ABC = Australian Broadcasting Commission).

Science Fatwah Parts I and II

Particularly good interview of Sam Harris by a slightly hostile interviewer.

Also Charles Harper and Richard Sloan.

http://www.abc.net.au/rn/religionreport/default.htm

These are followups from that marvellous Beyond Belief Conference.

72. God's Enemies Are More Honest Than His Friends

Comment #15225 by Aussie on December 29, 2006 at 6:27 pm

Nikki wrote:

As an Aussie, I was about to comment on JohnC's post, as being spot on in relation to this country. Having just had a debate on another board today, in reguard to being labeled an atheist, as well as the connotations of that label insinuated by the religious. John's post had reminded me, that we are quite lucky here in that reguard. Now this Herald Sun article!
Are we being invaded, John?

As an avid reader of Stephen Jay Gould before his death I was both transfixed and amused by his revelations of the ongoing anachronistic debates on creation vs evolution that were still raging in the USA - including the periodic "monkey trials" that were taking place. In Australia at the time this whole phenomenon was a non-issue, having effectively been resolved in the 19th century. It was almost inconceivable to me that the supposed greatest nation on Earth was still seriously wrestling with it at the beginning of the 21st century. I was smugly thankful that we in Australia did not have to waste our time over such stupidity.

It has actually only been in the last year or so that I have realised the full extent of the problem that fundamentalist Christianity and creationism in the USA pose to world peace. I was particularly alarmed when I became aware that it is not confined to just a few pockets of crackpots in that great nation but it is in fact the majority of the population that are so afflicted and this affliction permeates the society right up to the highest levels of Government.

I would like to put it to the several other Australians on this thread that perhaps we in this country have been a little too complacent such that we have not noticed the insidious intellectual pestilence slowly crippling our secular society. In addition to the creeping religification of both political parties as noted by JohnC there are a number of other disturbing developments such as the rising popularity of American style fundamentalist megachurches like the notorious "Hillsong". Exclusive Bretheren have also been actively attempting to undermine the political process in both Australia and New Zealand in very high profile campaigns. Is it time that we in Australia became alarmed at these developments and in response became involved in serious rational activism?

73. God's Enemies Are More Honest Than His Friends

Comment #15115 by Aussie on December 29, 2006 at 2:35 am

It is a pity Sam has to waste his time using his extraordinary talent explaining the obvious to those who refuse to understand.

74. Woman beaten on Jerusalem bus for refusing to move to rear seat

Comment #15101 by Aussie on December 28, 2006 at 11:23 pm

Beagle:

Is anyone able to quote which chapter and verse from the bible (any of the popular titles will do) contains the specific instruction from "god" regarding this style of gender segregation on buses.

Maybe it was a recently "revealed" Truth.

75. 10 myths - and 10 truths - about atheism

Comment #15065 by Aussie on December 28, 2006 at 4:07 pm

I find that the most heart warming section of this whole website is Convert's Corner - easily accessed from the left margin of the front page. Do visit it if you have not yet done so. To see so many people throwing off the shackles of fear and superstition and regaining their lives as a result of reading Richard's books is a pleasure to behold.

I look forward to seeing David Robertson's testimony there in the near future.

76. Woman beaten on Jerusalem bus for refusing to move to rear seat

Comment #15056 by Aussie on December 28, 2006 at 3:22 pm

Unbelievable!

77. 10 myths - and 10 truths - about atheism

Comment #15000 by Aussie on December 28, 2006 at 2:51 am

Many thanks Logicel,

Your suggestion worked like a charm

I was using square brackets (like are used in other fora to which I contribute - including the forum on this website) rather than angle brackets.

BTW I am trying to get a little time between family Christmas commitments to write something sensible on "the Faiths of Finance" - a subject we were discussing on the BC thread.

FYI I also use both Technical and Fundamental Analysis extensively in my own trading. It is not the use of these techniques that I object to but rather the unquestioning belief in their validity, and the awe in which they are held, that puts them on a par with Astrology.

78. 10 myths - and 10 truths - about atheism

Comment #14999 by Aussie on December 28, 2006 at 2:24 am

DAR wrote:

As for no Christian being certain that Jesus rose from the dead I disagree. Here is one Christian who is as certain that Jesus rose from the dead as I am that my wife exists.

David, are you any more certain of this postulate than my Indian friend is certain of his belief in the existence and role of Lord Brahma, Vishnu and Krishna. Perhaps your certainty is somehow of a higher quality than his?

The irony of your position is that your religion requires you to be an atheist with regard to his gods and you therefore need to join with us in rejecting them.

Welcome aboard brother. As we share a lot of common ground we can work together, hand in hand, debunking 95% of the gods currently being worshipped in the world today. We will just have to agree to disagree about the other 5%.

79. The Trouble with Atheism

Comment #14937 by Aussie on December 27, 2006 at 1:00 am

I have only now just watched this video.

It is a prime example of the sort of mentality that one has to deal with all the time. We can only sight with dispair.

Lets use the same logic that leads to his conclusion that atheism gives rise to atrocities such as those of Hitler and Stalin.

Within the last few years it has been revealed that the most widespread and institutionalised examples of paedophilia have been perpetrated by the clergy of our establishment Christian churches - both Catholic and Protestant. Using the above logic we would have to conclude that Christianity results in paedophilia.

Most of us would conceed that this latter conclusion is as preposterous as the former.

This video is an illustration of simplistic analysis from a superficial mind.

80. 10 myths - and 10 truths - about atheism

Comment #14748 by Aussie on December 24, 2006 at 10:06 pm

Can someone please explain how to invoke italics in these posts.

81. 10 myths - and 10 truths - about atheism

Comment #14747 by Aussie on December 24, 2006 at 10:05 pm

Comment #14726 by doomhead

"only 37% of Americans would vote for an otherwise qualified atheist for president"
This is only 14% less than any american politician seems to need to get into office. We're almost there..."

Have a word to George who will be able to explain how even the full 14% is not really necessary.

82. A Christmas thunderbolt for the arch-enemy of religion

Comment #14745 by Aussie on December 24, 2006 at 9:55 pm

"Hitler cynically played fast and loose with religion, to manipulate the German people. Whenever and wherever he deemed religionists a threat to his own self-idolatry he persecuted them and purged them. Apart from the Jewish genocide, he persecuted and imprisoned hundreds of thousands of Christians, Protestant and Catholic, for their faith."

What I find even more interesting than this is that neither during nor after the war did the Vatican excommunicate even a single one of the many Nazi Catholics responsible for these attrocities.

83. A Mission to Convert

Comment #14743 by Aussie on December 24, 2006 at 9:39 pm

The sheer extent of this article alone is flattering.

84. The Courtier's Reply

Comment #14740 by Aussie on December 24, 2006 at 9:18 pm

Comment #14725 by Robert O'Brien

"Mr. Dawkins:

Will your next book be a manual on how to engage in pseudo-argumentation?"


It is good that you are getting your requests in early. We believe in meeting needs.

85. Orr on Dawkins

Comment #14739 by Aussie on December 24, 2006 at 9:01 pm

Dawkins wrote TGD to appeal to a very general audience with the intention that it be as widely read as possible. In this he has been spectacularly successful.

The more adverse controversy such as this that develops the more public interest the book will generate and the more copies will be sold and read. It is really a pity that nobody has yet tried to ban it.

Brilliant marketing strategy Richard!

86. How the Great Atheist got polite society standing

Comment #14723 by Aussie on December 24, 2006 at 7:08 pm

Richard Dawkins says what he believes and believes in saying what needs to be said.

This approach is a respected tradition in Australia. In fact, if anything, here Dawkins would be regarded as being too polite.

Thank God there is one person with the courage and honesty to tell it as it is. Thank God for Dawkins.

87. The Only One in Step

Comment #14544 by Aussie on December 23, 2006 at 4:40 am

This simply demonstrates the unlimited capacity of the human mind for self-delusion.

88. The Only One in Step

Comment #14527 by Aussie on December 23, 2006 at 2:30 am

Joadist,

Love it!

89. The Komodo Dragon's Tale

Comment #14525 by Aussie on December 23, 2006 at 2:21 am

Comment #14458 by Martin

"He definitely had an earthly father: Joseph, son of ... son of David ... son of Abraham."

That is certainly in Matthew's genealogy.

The other issue is that Jesus had an older brother James so Mary could hardly have been a virgin when Jesus was conceived as there is no suggestion that James was also a virgin birth.

There is quite a strong school of thought, even in (non fundamentalist) theological circles, that Jesus was the result of Mary having been raped by a Roman soldier.

90. The Only One in Step

Comment #14520 by Aussie on December 23, 2006 at 1:40 am

That was a simple, concise and lucid explanation of the Second Law.

Really you need no more than a kindergarten understanding of Thermodynamics to appreciate its obvious application to evolution.

In all seriousness, and without meaning to be offensive to these academicians, one possible explanation that should be considered is dementia.

91. The Only One in Step

Comment #14519 by Aussie on December 23, 2006 at 1:27 am

Show me just one informed atheist who believes the Earth is less than 6000 years old and I will be impressed.

On the other hand I can show you thousands of devout Christians who believe it is 4.5 billion years old.

The only people who feel a need to believe the former are those with a certain vested religious interpretation of their scripture.

92. The Blasphemy Challenge

Comment #14284 by Aussie on December 21, 2006 at 10:49 pm

"Rather than encouraging young Christians to denounce their faith, you should be very hopeful they hang onto it, since rising Muslim demographics in Europe mean that very soon, probably in your lifetimes, atheist sites will be under severe and possibly physical pressure from young European Muslims."

Peterg123 looks like he is an anti-islamic bigot into the bargain.

What you need to succeed in this next crusade Peterg123 is a Christian version of the 72 virgins to stiffen up the enthusiam for your campaign.

For 72 virgins I might seriously consider swapping sides.

93. Richard Dawkins on the Mike Dickin Show

Comment #14256 by Aussie on December 21, 2006 at 5:05 pm

47. Comment #13920 by Logicel

Logicel,

I agree with everything that you have said. In fact I am known as the arch skeptic as far as anything paranormal is concerned. Indeed, in my current role as developer of a long established commercial Technical Analysis software package to trade the financial markets I am scathing about the plethora of unsupported claims made by many practitioners of this particular "art".

It is so bad that in some branches of Technical Analysis the practice has reached the stage of becoming a virtual religion - complete with Messiahs, Prophets, magic numbers and magic dates. The standard of analysis is so woeful, being based almost entirely on anecdote and selective data inclusion, that, as a scientist, it causes me acute embarrassment and frustration. Although the intensity of the rhetoric in meetings could never compare with anything we have seen in any of the fundamentalist christian rallies, neverthetheless the gullible faithful sit there eagerly soaking up this evidence-free drivel. They even risk their life savings on the basis of these very dubious predictions.

Having said that I have promised myself that when I retire I will attempt to investigate scientifically my own premonitions. Some of these have been so bizarre, so unusual and so accurate that I am prepared, in the spirit of openmindedness, to concede that they are worthy of more systematic study. Any positive result that may eventuate would not, however, imply any supernatural process.

94. I love the commercialisation of Christmas

Comment #14241 by Aussie on December 21, 2006 at 3:50 pm

"as far as I'm aware christmas is the third most important feastday in the christian calendar with good friday and easter day being the more important. These are not celebrated as much so it must be the commercialism that makes christmas/winter solstice so popular"

Winter Solstice?

Norther Hemisphere Chauvinism again.

As the American astronaut so famously remarked. "It it Springtime back on Earth"


Did you know that everybody is:

White
Male
Affluent
Educated
Well fed
City based
Supplied with clean water
Medically attended to
Living in a democracy
Committed to a nation state rather than a tribe
located in the Northern Hemisphere
An employee not an employer
Christian if religious
etc etc

What about the other 90% of the world's population.

(Just my little pet antipodean whinge :)

95. Now we know how to make the IDists dance in their petticoats: blaspheme.

Comment #14081 by Aussie on December 21, 2006 at 4:17 am

"The thing I give credit to the militant atheists for is that it matters to them greatly whether God exists or not. I look at every person like Dawkins as a potential St. Paul, setting himself up for a Damascus moment."

Better get yourself some dark glasses soon Richard!

96. 7 monks injured in clash over monastery

Comment #14077 by Aussie on December 21, 2006 at 4:00 am

They have obviously started actually reading their holy book.

97. CBC Segment on Evangelist Christians

Comment #14074 by Aussie on December 21, 2006 at 3:51 am

Comment #14064 by Cholmonedeley

"RE: JohnC #29

1. I've also heard that the homicide rate is higher in Australia, 7%, than in the U.S.."

Australia? Don't you mean Iraq? :)

98. CBC Segment on Evangelist Christians

Comment #14067 by Aussie on December 21, 2006 at 3:16 am

Comment #14026 by JohnC on December 20, 2006 at 8:58 pm

"While this seems to be about Xtianity, it actually makes more sense to see it as an insight into Americans. Holyland is ludicrous, not because of the subject matter, but because American theme parks are ludicrous. Notice that the majority of the audience were adults. In the rest of the world, a theme park is somewhere you take children. The fact of the matter is that vast tracts of the US are cultural deserts inhabitated by naively charming people who have been infantalised by a Disney-fied view of the world. It is no surprise that evangelical Christianity, with its simple dichotomies and absolute certainties finds such fertile ground there. So this doco presents a semi-cynical Canadian "adolescent" interacting with American "children", and not an adult in sight."

Unfortunately I think that the above sentiment succinctly and accurately summarises the impression that much of the rest of the world forms of the USA because the image of its people that is projected outside its borders is typically like the ones depicted in this video.

I say unfortunately because I know that a significant proportion of the American population does not conform to this stereotype. For over 30 years in my role as a research scientist I travelled frequently to the United States visiting Universities, research laboratories and government organisations and have the greatest respect, and indeed at times awe, for almost all Americans I met. After all look at the rate of accumulation of Nobel Prizes by residents of the country.

It was only since leaving science that I began discovering this other disturbing aspect of American society of which I was previously so blissfully unaware. This concern is epitomised by the demonstration that an uninformed individual, as culturally and internationally naive as the present incumbent, could become President of the most powerful nation on earth and control, not just his own country, but also in effect run mine.

George Bush would not have looked out of place in the crowd in Holyland but thankfully someone like Al Gore, or any one of a large proportion of his fellow countrymen, would have stuck out like a sore thumb.

99. CBC Segment on Evangelist Christians

Comment #14050 by Aussie on December 21, 2006 at 2:00 am

Comment #14036 by Cholmonedeley

"How do individual liberties inevitably encroach on the rights of others?"

Don't you think for example that the right of any individual to carry a gun encroaches on the safety and peace of mind of other members of the community?

100. CBC Segment on Evangelist Christians

Comment #14006 by Aussie on December 20, 2006 at 4:21 pm

I feel so sorry for our rational American friends. How embarrassing must it be for them to know that the rest of the world is ridiculing the spectacle of so many of their countrymen participating in such unadulterated mindless, commercial kitsch as "Holyland".

Is there any other country on earth where such crass nonsense would be able to survive commercially.