Skip to Main Content (access key 1)
Skip to Search (access key 2)
Skip to Search GO (access key 3)
Skip to comments (access key 4)
Skip to navigation (access key 5)
Skip to top of page (access key 6)

Comments by Double Bass Atheist


201. A Letter From Hell

Comment #117130 by Double Bass Atheist on January 28, 2008 at 10:10 am

In response to Double Bass Atheist, I am not sure what you are trying to point out, because I know there isn't any actual real evidence of the existence of the man Jesus. My point is somebody has to start a sect right?


It is sometimes claimed that the "miraculous" spread of Christianity in the early Roman Empire is evidence of a historical Jesus - that such a movement could not have gone so far so fast had there not been a real person at its inception. A similar argument could be made, however, in the case of the earlier rapid spread of Mithraism. I am unaware of any Christian apologists who would argue that this supports the idea of an historical Mithra!

You said you don't see the the point I am making? Well, you quoted non-evidence for the existence of a real jesus. Now you claim to understand that there isn't any actual evidence… only the absurd notion that the sect of Christianity couldn't have begun without a jesus. Then where did ALL the mythological gods come from?

202. A Letter From Hell

Comment #117120 by Double Bass Atheist on January 28, 2008 at 9:47 am

Omega369 –

Celsus was a second century Greek philosopher and opponent of Christianity.
I quote from your own source, via the link you provided:

the story of whose life is nothing more than "a monstrous fiction"


I say again, absolutely no one who was alive during jesus' supposed lifetime ever mentioned him. Everything that has ever been written about him came AFTER, and is therefore simply hearsay.

203. A Letter From Hell

Comment #117113 by Double Bass Atheist on January 28, 2008 at 9:29 am

omega369 -
Sorry, my misinformed friend, but those sources were all written AFTER the supposed life of JC. The Josephus reference was shown to be a forgery long ago, but sadly it is still cited as evidence. However even if the writings of Josephus were authentic (they are not) he too was not even born until after JC's alleged lifetime!
Every source you mention came AFTER the Christian god-man. Sorry, but the fact is that there is simply no extra-biblical evidence for jesus. Every single thing ever written about him is hearsay! Absolutely none of his contemporaries ever mentioned him while he was supposedly alive.
As one who understands science and evidence as you have stated, omega369, you should easily be able to see this for yourself. There is no evidence that a jesus ever lived, leading Jews, etc. – whether divine or not!

I quote below from just one of many sources widely available on the net:

Pliny the Younger, a Roman official, got born in 62 C.E. His letter about the Christians only shows that he got his information from Christian believers themselves. Regardless, his birth date puts him out of the range of eyewitness accounts.

Tacitus, the Roman historian's birth year at 64 C.E., puts him well after the alleged life of Jesus. He gives a brief mention of a "Christus" in his Annals (Book XV, Sec. 44), which he wrote around 109 C.E. He gives no source for his material. Although many have disputed the authenticity of Tacitus' mention of Jesus, the very fact that his birth happened after the alleged Jesus and wrote the Annals during the formation of Christianity, shows that his writing can only provide us with hearsay accounts.

Suetonius, a Roman historian, born in 69 C.E. mentions a "Chrestus," a common name. This is also a title. Apologists assume that "Chrestus" means "Christ" (a disputable claim). But even if Seutonius had meant "Christ," it still says nothing about an earthly Jesus. Just like all the others, Suetonius' birth occurred well after the purported Jesus. Again, only hearsay.

204. A Letter From Hell

Comment #117015 by Double Bass Atheist on January 28, 2008 at 4:45 am

Boukeb –

I like this Ernestine Rose quote. Do you now of more discussion on this topic? Is there any contemporary research or study of this matter

In general, I just like to collect good atheist quotes, but here is an excerpt from her bio… via this link:
http://www.brandeis.edu/centers/wsrc/Ernestine_Rose_Website/Shortbio.html

"Seeking enlightenment, she studied the texts of all the great religions, and concluded that all were irrational and oppressive to women. Her goal for herself and for society was intellectual freedom, freedom from the constraints of religious creeds and dogma. While disavowing Judaism as irrational, Ernestine nonetheless refused conversion to Christianity. "Shall I leave the tree to join a branch?" she replied when offered baptism as a way of simplifying her entry to Berlin. Her decision not to convert is particularly notable given that it was the path chosen by so many desperate German Jews of the time."

To NMcM, Peacebeuponme and Troyreynolds86:
Thank you all (and to the many others who've written earlier) for taking the time to post your advice. It is sincerely appreciated. I just want to say that, while I would like to be pro-active with issues like this, I will never do anything that would create a social problem for my son. He's 12, and at the age where how others see you is VERY important. However, I've been unsure of exactly what course of action to take, if any. Trying to balance my disgust of this video (and a desire to do something about it!) without creating an issue with my son, has proven difficult.
That is why I've been seeking the help/opinion/advice of all of you.

Again, thank you all SO much!!!

Regards,
~Carmine

205. Math Religion Trouble

Comment #116911 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 7:12 pm

The New York Times reported recently that mathematicians believe in God at a rate 2 1/2 times that of biologists, quoting a survey of the National Academy of Sciences. Admittedly, that's not saying much: Only 14.6 per cent of mathematicians embraced the God hypothesis, versus 5.5 per cent of biologists (versus some 80 per cent of Canadians who believe in a supreme being).

Canadians? Canadians??? What the heck do Canadians have to do with a mathematicians vs biologists comparison?
Is the author just trying to be funny?!
Am I misreading something?

206. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116906 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 7:00 pm

Thank you for sharing you story, dlitt. I always enjoy hearing how people came to realize that they've been mislead about the existence of god, and at what age.

A good quote:
"It is an interesting and demonstrable fact that all children are atheists, and were religion not inculcated into their minds, they would remain so."
– Ernestine Rose

207. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116898 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 6:16 pm

your child sounds like a well rounded thinker. He will likely provide his own influence to the friends he makes and retains throughout his teenage years.


He is. Thank you, dlitt.
If you are interested, here's story I posted here last September about just how I found out he did not believe in god. He was 9 at the time of the story...
http://www.richarddawkins.net/articleComments,1684,Keeping-the-faith-at-school,Louise-Brown-TheStarcom,page1#73664

208. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116897 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 6:10 pm

al-rawandi -
Man Alex, you really have watched too many Sopranos episodes!

;-b

Thanks for the laugh!

~Carmine

209. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116891 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 5:52 pm

Radesq –

When I was a young man I rarely appreciated my parents getting involved in issues with other school children and I was not kind to children who got their parents involved

That is precisely why I do NOT want to get the school involved. My son will think I'm making too big of an issue over this, and I certainly don't want to be the cause of any social problems for him at school.

I've been thinking about what I wrote earlier… IF it turns out that the kid is using school resources to spread his 'message', I think what will do is send an email to the school Principal (and requesting anonymity). The Principal can then ask the network tech admins to investigate it. There are log files created on all of the schools systems to monitor their activity. Therefore, this makes it an internal school problem, and my son and I would be left out of it.

210. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116876 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 5:14 pm

Very funny, Alex… very funny. ;-)
Sorry to disappoint you somewhat, but I can't even speak Italian.

Ya know, I wish I did have some 'connections'… I'd like to order a 'hit' on the godtube servers!

211. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116874 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 5:08 pm

If you don't mind, I'd like to see if some UK papers are interested in this.

Go for it, Steve! The more negative press the Christians receive as a result of this video, the better. Oh, be sure to mention that our attempts at posting non-confrontational comments to that godtube site are quickly removed, as many here have seen.

By the description on page one of this thread, it appears as if this kid only mentioned the website to other kids?

Yes, markg, you are correct. This kid is only showing it to other kids. I'll have to double check with my son, but I'm pretty sure that the kid was preaching to the other kids (lunchroom, hallway conversations, etc.) and that he followed it up by sending out emails, including the link we are discussing now. I don't know if those emails were send by the kid from his home or via school system. That certainly makes a difference, and I will follow up on it. Thanks for pointing that out.

NMcC – I'm not sure I want to get the school involved. I think my son might have a problem with that one! However, if it turns out that the kid is using the public school resources to spread this junk, then I may have to take it to the school administration.

Regards,
~Carmine

212. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116856 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 4:09 pm

No problem, Steve. I live in the US, more specifically, New Jersey. I did say this in Comment #77 and #232, but obviously it is not likely that everyone will read every comment on a thread of this length. On hindsight, I probably should have simply said so in the lead-in paragraph of the article submission.

Thank you in advance for any assistance you (or others) can offer.

There may be other parents out there who feel just as strongly about this as you do, but who aren't speaking up for fear of being the only ones. Maybe you could sound a few of them out?

Paula, that much was already my intention. However, I'm not sure I'll be able to have a conversation with the video-spreading kid as you also suggested. He's not one of my son's close friends, just an acquaintance at school. So, it's not likely that I'll have an opportunity to discuss anything with him. But I sure would like to!

~Carmine

213. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116849 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 3:30 pm

To all,
When I submitted this story late last week, I knew it would generate some interest here… and now to see that several days later, this thread is still going strong. Thank you, all.
I asked for some help earlier. Please see this post:
http://www.richarddawkins.net/articleComments,2176,A-Letter-From-Hell,RichardDawkinsnet,page5#116209

Several posters here have offered advice to me as to what I should do next, even RD himself (thank you again, sir). I don't like just doing nothing… and spreading this story around to as many as possible should help to embarrass even moderate believers.
However, should I confront the parents of the kid who's spreading this video around to my son's classmates? Personally, I'm not sure that would even matter. If their kid is this deluded, one can only imagine what his parents are like!
My son does not really care all that much. He said he just blows the fool off. But I'm more concerned about other kids in his class that might not have the same understanding and could be influenced by this crap.
As a result, I want to do something, I just don't know what would do the most good, or even be effective for that matter.

214. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116838 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 3:05 pm

Thank you, Paula. Thank you!
That is one of the funniest things I've ever heard!!!

I had to wipe the tears from my eyes just to type this post.
;-D

215. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116830 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 2:53 pm

omega369 -

All we do know is that there is historical evidence (outside of the bible) that there was a person named Jesus who lived and lead a group of people.

Please present said evidence. For if you do indeed have any extra-biblical evidence for the existence of jesus, you will have done what no other historian or theologian has ever been able to do… find the historical jesus!
The reality is that there is no such evidence. The jesus myth is pretty much just a combination of various pagan god-men that preceded Christianity.

Paula Kirby -
I found myself almost cheering out loud reading your last post (#306). Paula, you are my god… for saying so succinctly, and with the proper force, precisely what needed to be said to that poster, LindseyMWright.
I could quote your entire post, but especially enjoyed this:
The day you fundies have even a thousandth of the evidence for the existence of hell that science has for the reality of evolution, is the day you may consider yourself justified in putting these thoughts into children's heads. Until then, how DARE you do it? Aren't you thoroughly ashamed of yourselves for inflicting this evil madness on your CHILDREN? You certainly should be.

You go girl!

216. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116711 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 8:05 am

Omega369 -

I would happily change the name God into "Life, Love and Power".

But how does one pray to "Life, Love and Power"? What is the benefit of this belief?

Its not faith I have, its knowledge and experience of science and how it shapes this beautiful world.

This reminds me of the 'god' Einstein spoke of… he did not believe in a 'personal god' either, just the wonders-of-the-universe kind of thing AS god.
I 'worship' (value) life too, but I just don't call that 'god', and it's certainly not 'god' in the sense of what most pious individuals think they're talking to every Sunday.


One additional question, if you do not believe any of the core tenets of Christianity, like the virgin birth or resurrection of JC, then how are you a Christian?

217. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116703 by Double Bass Atheist on January 27, 2008 at 7:27 am

I choose Christianity because its widely available here in the UK, and I fitted in really well with the congregation. Its also my choice of religion because I feel something, and I don't mind whether its a psychological thing. I am a big fan of meditation (in the Buddhist way), and the various parts of a typical Anglican Sunday service are very rhythmic and almost perfect for meditation.

Omega369 – but what does any of that have to do with the truth of your religion or the existence of your (or any) god?
Your views certainly are very liberal. Frankly, if most believers were like you, we wouldn't have the problems we have today, especially here in the US…. Like trying to teach creationism in school science classes! In addition, your approach to religion is also not likely to lead to hijacking a plane and flying it into a building.
However, I just don't really understand 'belief' from your point of view. I mean, you know the bible isn't literal, you accept science, clearly understand the dogmatic practices of the era, and do forth. Therefore, why believe at all???

As Peacebeuponme asks above, do you even believe in 'god'. If not, then what is a religion without a god?

218. Ore. Court: Boy Has Say in Circumcision

Comment #116342 by Double Bass Atheist on January 26, 2008 at 9:12 am

No matter what your opinion of circumcision is, as it's been said many times on past threads about this story, doing this to a boy at that age IS child abuse!

It's absolutely appalling that this had to go all the way to the Oregon State Supreme Court for the child's wishes to be considered!

219. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116334 by Double Bass Atheist on January 26, 2008 at 9:00 am

I don't think most theists realize the difference. With some of the ones I've talked to, a single comment on the bible being rediculous or the interpretation of the bible that they have been told being rediculous immeadiately puts them on the offensive.

Deepthought is right on this one, Steve. I, too, have found that when criticizing a believer's ideas about their god, they take it as a personal attack on themselves. This is particularly true when arguing about evolution or, in the case of this thread, pointing out the ridiculous idea of 'hell'. When one exposes the fallacy of these concepts, the theist automatically gets very upset. How can you tell someone that their idea is silly without them taking it personally? After all, it is their idea you're calling silly.

220. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116284 by Double Bass Atheist on January 26, 2008 at 6:41 am

Thanks to all who've offered opinions and advice. Please keep it coming. I'm just looking for a direction here. In addition, Professor Dawkins, I am in the US – more specifically, New Jersey. Also, I did mention that I live in the US in comment #77, but obviously it is not likely that everyone will read every comment on a thread of this length. On hindsight, I probably should have simply said so in the lead-in paragraph of the article submission.

Thank you very much Professor for taking the time to give me your advice. It is sincerely appreciated, sir.

JuxtaMonkey and Cartomancer, I've read each of your advice-posts thoroughly. Thank you. I feel that this situation deserves a response of some kind, and that if I did nothing (and let just let it go away) an opportunity would be missed. An opportunity, that is, to embarrass these people with their own BS. As the Professor said, This film speaks for itself. Spread it around by all means…"
I have shown this video to several believers who were also shocked by it!

Hmm....well, in the short term, how about sending the kid who sent it to your kid videos from GodIsImaginary.com?

Amazing and ironic, Diacanu … I showed my son that very website the same evening he showed me the video. I selected a couple of those little videos (we watched them together) and I told him to give this link to his loony Christian friend!

I found the "reddit.com" link to this thread. Thanks Steve!

Regards,
~Carmine

221. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116209 by Double Bass Atheist on January 25, 2008 at 8:55 pm

To all,
I am the individual who submitted this heinous example of child abuse. Thank you Professor Dawkins for your comments, as well. I, too, read a lot of the comments at the godtube site. It is truly frightening that most of these people see this as a 'positive' message.

In comment #123 I asked for some help from the posters here about what I should do next? No one answered me. So, I'm asking again… There's a kid in my son's 6th grade class spreading the crap around. Do I just let it go? Should I confront the parents? Do any of you have any other ideas?

I submitted this to RD's website for 2 reasons:
1) So the 'lions of atheism' that frequent these pages can give this video what it deserves!
And…
2) I could use a little help with this matter. I am not really sure what my next course of action should, or even if I should take one.

Opinions???

~Carmine

222. A Letter From Hell

Comment #116007 by Double Bass Atheist on January 25, 2008 at 9:06 am

Healyhatman

To the person who posted this - I hope your child's mind hasn't been corrupted by this disease, this text-adventure snuff-film. And I hope you find the child who gave him the link, and make SURE that child's parents get an extremely stern talking to - recruiting their own child to distribute filth like this is the height of Christian child-abuse and needs to be stamped out.

That would be me. As I said in comment 77, my son has developed his own way thinking about religion… "It's like believing in magic." He's in no danger of contamination from his Christian-freak classmate. As to the parent side of the problem, I completely agree with you. However, I do not know these people and even if I did, if their kid is this screwed up, you know it came from the parents! Children obviously do not indoctrinate themselves. Therefore, how likely is it that any "extremely stern talking to" will have any effect?

I welcome further comments/advice from anyone here. Is there a better way to handle this?

~Carmine

223. A Letter From Hell

Comment #115939 by Double Bass Atheist on January 25, 2008 at 4:50 am

Well done to your son Carmine for seeing it for what it was. Good to see analytical thinking in one so young, i think if you start out with that outlook it is, in a manner of speaking, an ESS.

Thank you phatbat!
We live in a pretty secular household. My kids haven't been raised in any religion. Obviously, children aren't born religious. As we all well know, when the indoctrination is removed, freethinking and just plain old common sense fill the void. Of course, living here in the US, one cannot escape the daily torrent of pious BS. However, I am very proud of my young son for recognizing a few years ago that "Believing in religion is like believing in magic" (his words!).

He showed me this video because there is a kid in his 6th grade class who is very determined to convert everyone to Christianity. If you watched this frightening drivel, you see that there are really two messages being conveyed at the same time:
1) Not believing/accepting JC leads to eternal hellfire. (no news there, the video just depicts in an obviously disturbing manner.)
2) The Christian is also to blame for not "saving" is friend by telling him about worshipping the magic-man.

Clearly, the kid in my son's class has taken this to heart and is delivering 'the message' to his classmates! It bothers me that 12 year olds are wasting their young lives on this crap. Jeez, enjoy your youth kids!

Oh, and thank you to the 'lions of atheism' that frequent this site for giving this video what it deserves!!!

~Carmine

224. Banned From Church

Comment #115081 by Double Bass Atheist on January 23, 2008 at 2:09 pm

From the article…

Others point to a passage in the gospel of Matthew that says unrepentant sinners must be shunned.

What about the passage in Exodus that anyone who works on the Sabbath should be put to death?
What about the passage in Deuteronomy that rebellious sons should be put to death?
What about the passage in Leviticus that both the adulterer and the adulteress shall be put to death?
…and on and on…

The level of cherry-picking that these people do never ceases to amaze me.

225. Life-Forming Chemicals Found in Distant Galaxy

Comment #114481 by Double Bass Atheist on January 22, 2008 at 9:36 am

Astronomers have long said that we are made of "the stuff of stars." He's further evidence. At least that's what I thought when I submitted this link. Apparently Josh used my real name in the credit. Oh well, that's ok Josh… now's as good a time as any to 'come out', and if my devout Christian employers have a problem with that, they can go to their hell! ;-b

~Carmine

226. Gay Jesus play blasted by bishop

Comment #114196 by Double Bass Atheist on January 21, 2008 at 2:08 pm

think it is pretty clear. For reasons that elude me, the leaders of Christian churches don't like men having sex with each other.


That's true Steve… they sure don't like men having sex with each other, they'd much prefer boys.

227. Gay Jesus play blasted by bishop

Comment #114055 by Double Bass Atheist on January 21, 2008 at 9:27 am

"unhistorical and untrue" depiction of the son of God
"It's historical nonsense and I wouldn't want to go and see it. Life's too short."

Jesus' entire supposed life is historical nonsense!
Before this Bishop or any believer makes a statement like this, shouldn't they first have to show the "true" account of Jesus (without using the bible) and how they "know" it?
Oh wait, sorry… there's that damn 'logic and reason' again. I keep forgetting this is Theology.

rod-the-farmer,
I'd like to be your first customer. I'll take a case of those bumper stickers, please. ;-)

228. Stop revisionist Christian nation House Resolution 888

Comment #113870 by Double Bass Atheist on January 20, 2008 at 8:35 pm

I followed the link and filled out the form to send a canned letter to congress. IMO their letter required quite a bit of editing. In its original form, it reads like nontheists are an interest group and we are upset by being left out of the resolution. I feel that really misses the point. Their website talks extensively about 'revisionist history', for which I completely agree… after all, that's the point here! This resolution contains dozens of historical inaccuracies or outright BS. However, the letter that the Secular Coalition prepared does not make that case at all. Strange.
Far too many people in the US today actually think that America was founded "on our Judeo-Christian heritage" and that the nation's founders were "deeply spiritual men." It does not seem to matter to these people that the mention of 'god' is left out of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, or that the writings of the Founding Fathers clearly show that these men were deists at best, more likely atheists. Add in Article 11 of the 1797 Treaty of Tripoli, which begins: "As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion…" Can this case be made any clearer?
However, none of this easily ascertained information matters to the revisionists. I a similar fashion to the evolution debate, the facts just seem to get in the way with these people. They'll just keep repeating what they "believe."

229. New Findings Confirm Darwin's Theory: Evolution Not Random

Comment #113401 by Double Bass Atheist on January 19, 2008 at 1:57 pm

Shouldn't this article have a dateline of 1859?

Paula, I had the exact same thought while reading this!
Great minds, my friend. Great minds.
(you do have the alluded to saying in UK, don't you? There's always that 'separated by a common language' thing hanging over our heads)
:-b

Diacanu
Evolution isn't a path or a ladder toward any particular ideal.
Evolution doesn't give a shit about ideals.

True. Very true. Far too many creationists (and even quite a few evolution supporters) have this gross misunderstanding that our human evolution was this steady, linear march from one humanoid creature to a better more humanoid creature, and so forth, right up to homo sapiens.
Fact is that the evolution of humans (and indeed all life) has had many 'dead ends' where a sub-species died out.

230. King Me!

Comment #113390 by Double Bass Atheist on January 19, 2008 at 1:35 pm

I recently posted on another thread about a debate last week with one of the many young earth creationists I work with. She said that she "does not believe in Neanderthal man." In my life I have had hundreds, perhaps thousands of debates with various creationists, but I've never heard that particular statement before! I tried to explain to her that this is obviously not a "belief". You can go to museums all over the world and view their bones, tools, etc. Her response was, "That's just your opinion."
My opinion??? Aaaaaagh!

Clearly some of these people are so deluded by their religion that logic and reason are just empty vessels.

I left my debate with the aforementioned YEC with the following comment:
"After all, why suffer from insanity? Become religious and enjoy every minute of it!"

231. The New Theology

Comment #113360 by Double Bass Atheist on January 19, 2008 at 11:23 am

brother john,
Below I quote the late Carl Sagan. These famous quotes sum it nicely…

"I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But as much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking."

And…

"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."

232. The New Theology

Comment #113294 by Double Bass Atheist on January 19, 2008 at 8:27 am

"In a curious way, Dawkins and his fellow scientific atheists espouse the same notion of God that drives their sworn enemies, the creationists who oppose teaching evolution in public schools. For both camps, the only God who makes sense is one who designed all life with exquisite attention to detail."

Reg commented:
It is very early in the morning; I know I'm tired, so I have read this over a few times to no avail, it still troubles me. So, can someone here either put meat on this skeleton? Or grind its bones to dust. I just cannot recall our Richard ever espousing such a view.


Reg,
I think your confusion perhaps stems from a misreading of the writer's point at this juncture of the article. He was saying that both Dawkins' and Creationist's views are based upon the supposed existence of a personal, prayer-answering, meddling god. In other words, that's the god that most religionists believe in and the one that Dawkins (and we) do not. The point here is that both the Creationists and Dawkins do NOT like the idea of a marginalized 'god' that the "theistic evolutionists" seem to want to accept. Both camps would say either the omnipotent biblical god exists or it does not. That's what the debate is over.
Does that help clear the morning fog? ;-)

233. Huckabee Wants A 'Faith-based' Constitution

Comment #112184 by Double Bass Atheist on January 16, 2008 at 2:09 pm

How would this not be a violation of the Establishment Clause in the Constitution???
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof."
http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/conlaw/estabinto.htm

234. Dinesh D'Souza: Winner of the 2007 Bad Faith Award

Comment #112178 by Double Bass Atheist on January 16, 2008 at 1:56 pm

Ann Coulter would have been a good recipient as well. She contributes about as much to our society as a tapeworm to an intestine. What a waste of a human.

Well said Anna. Well said.
Unfortunately, there are just sooooo many fools to choose from, it's hard to pick just one.

"A man without a god is like a fish without a bicycle." – Gloria Steinem

235. Huckabee Wants A 'Faith-based' Constitution

Comment #112088 by Double Bass Atheist on January 16, 2008 at 9:46 am

"It is a truism that almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so." -Sir Arthur C. Clarke

Also, for the record, Obama is not Muslim and never was. Dad was an atheist and his mother seemed to give him a background in all religions, from a secular perspective.
Please read this snopes article:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/muslim.asp

236. Canadian fossil makes waves in Huckabee's presidential run

Comment #112076 by Double Bass Atheist on January 16, 2008 at 9:25 am

Annabanana

How does the populace ignore such staggering evidence? And how/why do they think they know better than many many years of what research has told us?

As others have already commented, it is rooted in childhood indoctrination and wishful thinking, but what is worse is what this leads to… a immediate rejection of any data that contradicts their fantasy. Just yesterday, I was having a debate with a biblical literalist who told me that she "Does not believe in Neanderthal or Cro-Magnon Man." I tried to tell her the obvious point, that this is not a "belief", these hominids existed! Their bones can be seen in museums all over the world! But she simply told me "That's your opinion." What can you call this kind of thinking? It's absolutely crazy. I left our debate with the following comment:

"After all, why suffer from insanity? Become religious and enjoy every minute of it!"

237. The Moral Instinct

Comment #110774 by Double Bass Atheist on January 12, 2008 at 11:50 am

Mother Teresa, for her part, extolled the virtue of suffering and ran her well-financed missions accordingly: their sick patrons were offered plenty of prayer but harsh conditions, few analgesics and dangerously primitive medical care.

…and the vast majority of people (especially here in the US) would say the world could use many more people just like her.
As the article alludes to, many scientists toil in obscurity, writing papers about their research that few outside of academia will ever read… while the results of their work save countless lives and/or improves our overall quality of life.
Christians use inventions, medicines, technology, and various other aspects of science everyday while being seemingly oblivious to this reality, and continue to "thank god" for it instead.
I know that's been said many times on these forums, but articles like this are a constant reminder to me.

238. Stop House Resolution 888

Comment #107794 by Double Bass Atheist on January 5, 2008 at 11:21 am

Worth repeating once again…
"When fascism comes to America it will be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross."
-Sinclair Lewis

There are so many people in the US now who are absolutely convinced that the Founding Fathers where very pious individuals.

The easiest way to make the US into a Christian theocracy is to just re-write American history so that Americans grow up believing that the founders intended the US to be a Christian theocracy.

Yep… that's the plan! And it's working. I have several friends who are atheists or agnostics that thought the nation's founders where devout men. They've just grown up hearing the lie repeated over and over again, and simply accepted it. Fortunately, I was able to show them quotes of Jefferson, Adams, Madison, et al, plus the Treaty of Tripoli and they now understand the truth. But these friends I'm talking about are rational evidenced-based people.
How does one re-educate Congress and the general public?
Stopping this resolution is a start, but we have to find a way to counter the whole "Let's hijack history" movement. But How?

239. A War On Science

Comment #105389 by Double Bass Atheist on December 31, 2007 at 12:13 pm

We need many more videos like this one to raise public awareness. In addition, it would great if leading scientists could somehow join forces and come up with something like a prime-time TV special to re-introduce evolution to the general public in the US… and straighten out the many myths and misconceptions regarding this subject... AND most importantly, the difference between what a "theory" means to science vs. the laypersons understanding. This is one of the most annoying aspects of this debate and it comes up over and over again.
Does anyone think something like this could help, or am I just dreaming?

240. It is possible to be moral without God

Comment #104992 by Double Bass Atheist on December 30, 2007 at 9:40 am

With all due respect, rafael184, I do not see the relevance of your extremely lengthy post. You linked to the article at the beginning, no need to then include it in its entirety. However the entire diatribe was not really on-topic for this particular thread. Posting this to one of the forums and opening it up to discussion on its own thread is more appropriate. Of course, I do not mean to sound like I'm policing these things. I am just offering an opinion shared by many bloggers.
This is simply not the place for this rant.

241. 'Gospel of wealth' facing scrutiny

Comment #104288 by Double Bass Atheist on December 28, 2007 at 9:24 am

First of all, welcome to the forum liddlefeesh!

As evidenced by the day-to-day actions of Christians; I don't think anyone actually believes it.

Obviously, you don't live in the US. There are many christians who are young-earth creationists here (I personally know several). We even have that Creationist Museum in Kentucky now …and debating these people is pointless. They are soooo deluded by their "understanding" of the bible that they simply cannot (or will not) think clearly on this subject. I understand your other points… and many of theses same people are rational in virtually every other aspect of their lives. But when it comes to their religion, all logic and reason are gone!
Clearly, (and contrary to what you've stated) these people absolutely believe what they believe.

242. Man and God

Comment #103418 by Double Bass Atheist on December 25, 2007 at 2:01 pm

Paula Kirby -
I recently wrote part of this story in another thread, but here it is again with a bit more commentary:
The owner of the company I work for is a VERY passionate Christian and surrounds himself with like-minded sheep. 'God' is actually mentioned in just about every corporate newsletter. That's right, this guy and his people actually think their imaginary friend is guiding the company's direction. I feel like I work for a corporate theocracy. A few years ago they brought in a 'Christian geologist' (I'm not kidding!) for a company-sponsored luncheon in order to tell us that the dinosaurs and man existed at the same time.
Well, guess what?! The owner's wife now has terminal brain cancer and been given 14 months to live. He actually wrote about this sad reality in a recent newsletter but in typical mind-numbingly moronic Christian fashion, attributed it to "God's plan."
If I ever I leave this company I'm going to ask him, "If your wife's cancer was part of 'Gods plan', why did you go to the doctors? Why bother with the chemotherapy?"
I know this sounds insensitive, but as an atheist working at this company, I really do feel like "a lion in the den of Christians" as the saying goes.
No, it is not legal in the US to fire someone for being an atheist, but what would happen is that my position would be marginalized, and/or I'd actually get fired for something else… something very, very trivial.
Paula, I can understand how you, living in the UK (sometimes I'm jealous!) would have difficulty understanding my situation, and others like it. It is not really "discrimination against non-believers" as much as the fact that the pious here simply look down upon atheists… we're considered just one notch above pedophiles on the scumbag scale. Once the Christian ownership discovered my atheism, I would never be a position of trust within this company again. The job pays well, so I would like to keep it.

243. Man and God

Comment #103401 by Double Bass Atheist on December 25, 2007 at 12:59 pm

From the article:

How should believers respond to this on-slaught?

How about producing some evidence?!?!

Oh, and whether religion has ever inspired anyone to do anything positive (art, music, etc.) has absolutely no baring on any god's supposed existence.

Comment by walk
I think it's kind of cool that us posters here today are celebrating Christmas by blogging the truth!

I completely agree with you! This website is a "Zeus-send" I can't think of a better way to spend this day!

Paula Kirby – I, too, asked you a few days ago on "The Christian God is not to blame" thread about your alias name change from Northern Bright. Thank you for your answer. For what it's worth, I agree… "standing up and be counted" and the like. However, in my case, I work for a devoutly Christian company here in the US. My atheism would cost me my job. That simple reality pisses me off to no end, but what am I to do if want to keep the job I've held for the past 14 years?

244. 'Christian God is not to blame'

Comment #102698 by Double Bass Atheist on December 23, 2007 at 12:23 pm

It just seems to me, that every time there is an article on religion nowadays....it is the 2,000,000,000 christians who are being victimized…


Yeah, the poor, poor majority. Apparently, their god is not only easily offended but obviously can't take care of himself either. Those poor Christians have to get upset for him! As RD (and many posters) have pointed out many times, religion has gotten use to getting a free ride and has seen itself immune from criticism. As soon as anyone even asks a simple question about the existence of 'god' or the man-made history of their religion, they cry "foul"!

Paul Kirby – Totally off topic…. why did you change your alias from 'Northern Bright'? I always liked that one.

245. Survey finds most Americans believe Jesus born of virgin

Comment #102418 by Double Bass Atheist on December 22, 2007 at 4:58 pm

It still amazes me just how many people are so completely unaware of the simple fact that there are dozens of 'virgin birth' deity stories that pre-date Christianity. As Hitchens points out, in the ancient world the female birth canal was considered a one-way street. A corporeal 'god' wasn't legit unless he/she came into this world via a 'virgin birth.' This is such easily ascertained information… why are most people unaware the history of their own religion?

246. Creation college seeks state's OK to train teachers

Comment #99420 by Double Bass Atheist on December 16, 2007 at 3:48 pm

phasmagigas-

It must be like being a closet homosexual masturbating frantically to male images and thinking 'im not gay' 'im not gay' 'im not gay' rather than 'i dont want to be gay....'


Now that's seriously funny! Thanks for the comment. I had a car accident earlier today,
(I'm ok but the car isn't), so I really needed a laugh. Thank you!

I, too, have a hard time trying to understand the mentality of these people. I work for a company that is owed by christians who are VERY public about their religion. 'God' is mentioned in just about every corporate newsletter. A few years ago they actually brought in a 'Christian geologist' (I'm not kidding!) for a company-sponsored luncheon in order to tell us that the dinosaurs and man existed at the same time.

247. Creation college seeks state's OK to train teachers

Comment #99263 by Double Bass Atheist on December 16, 2007 at 6:28 am

phasmagigas- Your comment #41 above regarding the whole creationist movement is excellent (no need to quote the whole thing!) However, I would add and/or clarify one thing… it's been my experience that these creationist types do not "knowingly" disseminate lies are falsehoods. That implies that they actually know the truth/reality and are deliberately BS-ing people. However, all the IDiots I've ever met (I know, not a scientific sample) are very honest people who very passionately believe their creationist views. They just have sooooo many misunderstandings of science, it's impossible to straighten them all out…. "Evolution is only a theory," "It takes more faith to believe in evolution then it does to believe in god," "Science can't explain it all; we're too complex," and on and on…

Here's something I've posted here before, but I think it's worth repeating. Look at what this deluded fool did to his car! How much more passionately misguided can one get?!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/amywatts/103235388/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/amywatts/103235342/

248. Creation college seeks state's OK to train teachers

Comment #99180 by Double Bass Atheist on December 15, 2007 at 8:23 pm

Why would a god who supposedly punishes incest as a sin with eternal hellfire intentionally create not one but TWO blatantly incestuous situations… Adam and Eve, and then Noah and his family.

This creationist, ID, (or whatever else they choose to call their beliefs this week) is NOT science. Every one of their "Tenets" can easily be shown to be laughably incorrect. Unfortunately, that would take time, intelligence, and an attention span of more then 5 minutes. Most IDiots I've ever met have none of the above. They just have their bible.

It's stories like this that continue to make me embarrassed to be an American. We truly are becoming a laughing stock.

249. U.S. Congress Recognizing the importance of Christmas and the Christian faith

Comment #98227 by Double Bass Atheist on December 13, 2007 at 9:58 am

Wow, bluebird… that's as bad this resolution BS! In the past, when people would talk about the US becoming a theocracy, I used to think they were over-reacting. The Constitution would simply never allow that to happen….. and then there's this story AND Bush's Christmas card!
I guess the Establishment Clause means nothing if Congress just ignores it.

250. Girl, 16, dies after hijab dispute with father

Comment #97242 by Double Bass Atheist on December 11, 2007 at 7:50 pm

Sad… so sad. Will the world ever come to its senses?

For some strange reason, I was reminded of that "Open Letter to Richard Dawkins" in which the deluded Father Morris quoted enormous numbers of people killed in the "name of atheism" as compared to a relatively small number who died due to religion. (I'm still amazed that anyone can say that and still be taken seriously).
Somehow, I don't think Morris et al even take incidents like this into consideration.

Usually this site makes me laugh (a lot!) but stories like this one are hard to take. It is a constant reminder of the seriousness of our role in society. We MUST spread rationality!

More Pages: Previous | 1 2 3 4 5 6 | Next