301. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #182284 by phil rimmer on May 19, 2008 at 3:21 pm

steveroot

I had a great uncle once who was still driving a motorbike at the age of 74. Deeply concerned at the risks he was running, the rest of his family persuaded him to give it up and take up a safer hobby. So he got really into fishing, became something of a bore about it actually. Inevitably it was fishing that did for him in the end. He caught the "big one" and got dragged in.

But what a way to go though! I liked to imagine him thoroughly excited up to the last second or so, leaving just enough time for him to think,"...Erm?"

302. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #182266 by phil rimmer on May 19, 2008 at 2:42 pm

I said "Fuck no you ain't!" And I found and sent him a batch of videos

Good man!

After the enthusiastic descriptions, I just wanted to be sure you hadn't gone and got yourself a video camera and a gallon of oil or a tripwire or something.

(Fuck! I said the "O" word. I predict a massive flapping of wings and an enormous post hurtling down out of the sky.)

303. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #182255 by phil rimmer on May 19, 2008 at 2:17 pm

Jesus, Al!

Are these videos like a hobby or something?

304. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #182239 by phil rimmer on May 19, 2008 at 1:17 pm

Doc.

What a bummer. I broke my scaphoid in a car accident 23 years ago. I was being taught to drive quickly by a prominent Christian Scientist at the time. Bastard! (I was somewhat dazzled by the "scientist" part.) Fortunately I didn't follow his practice and skip the hospital visit. He got an eye infection, prayed hard, and lost an eye. In hospital I got the same warnings as you and, as the odds predicted, it came out OK. I had a few years of twinges afterwards and then nothing.

My very best wishes for a good outcome.

Very good call on the motorbike. Last weekend in our area of Essex 7 bikers were killed in entirely separate accidents. If you have any problems with himself, point to your new (temporary) dependency to defer any discussions until a later date. The urge WILL pass.

My mate (a playwright) swears by the dictation capability of VISTA (pants as it is on other fronts). I hated dictation software because of the tedium of the correction process. My mate did a demo, dictating a couple of paragraphs. Dictation speed was almost natural speed and the few corrections needed were done in an extra 10% of the time. Damn slick.

305. Richard Dawkins Responds to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #181963 by phil rimmer on May 19, 2008 at 12:10 am

clearmind

I would not discuss something metaphysical with someone who is blinded by only physical things. It would be asking a blind man to watch a movie together.

Would you not describe to your blind colleague what is happening on the screen or do you suspect he just wont like what you will see?

Answering NO to my question about whether a child may be possessed is completely unambiguous, even to the metaphysically blind, so I must assume from your unwillingness that your answer is YES.

This explains your callous view of where harm was or rather wasn't done.

And this is my point about the metaphysically sighted like you. If you don't take very great care you may lose sight of people and the harm you may do them as you stumble towards that light that you see so clearly in your mind.

306. Richard Dawkins Interview on TVOntario

Comment #181902 by phil rimmer on May 18, 2008 at 4:56 pm

so it would have more British and thus European aspects to it.

(coughs)Quebec!

307. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #181897 by phil rimmer on May 18, 2008 at 4:48 pm

Diacanu

it's anti_American

It's anti British!

I think it may even be anti French, but I'm not sure.

Gimme the Raid!

308. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #181878 by phil rimmer on May 18, 2008 at 2:50 pm

MaxD

of txpiper: you assert- sans proof- that insurmountable problems exist

I am starting to suspect that this is the whole raison d'etre of the ID movement. More importantly, if no insurmountable problem can be found (and why should there be one?) I think their policy, in effect, is to MAKE one. Make governments question research budgets, make teachers and parents question curricula, make kids stupid, and make scientists scarce.

These people don't value knowledge, as they try to claim. Their eagerness to shovel bucket loads of the stuff out of the window in case its contaminated by the Conspiracy of the Brotherhood of Darkins rather demonstrates the fact. And they MUST say that this source of knowledge (from scientists) is poisoned otherwise a reasonable person might say to them that, "Well, you may be right, but why don't we just wait and see what the evidence turns up." The risk there being that no proof of Gods work is actually possible (save for the little stamp pronouncing Yaweh Fecit on the flagellum in question) so none ever will turn up. Still a pointless search should drag things out and keep the brain-dead faithful calm until they can stuff us properly. No, they value something else far more highly than real knowledge.

They value social cohesion. Science is the enemy as it generates uncomfortable and unsettling new facts that get people all agitated. Stopping new facts altogether is their ideal. Failing that, making all facts God's facts should reduce the scare factor somewhat.

Truth? Txpiper and his lot can't handle the Truth. They're truly scared of it. That's why they NEVER read the books or the links, or look too closely, or think too hard.

Please, tx, prove me wrong. My Troll button finger is getting itchy again.


Sorry. I seem to have got a little paranoid there. That skunk was stronger than I imagined. Filthy smell too.

309. Richard Dawkins Interview on TVOntario

Comment #181864 by phil rimmer on May 18, 2008 at 1:48 pm

BW022

Canada would appear as progressive on non-belief as most European countries. Certainly ahead of Ireland, Spain, Italy, etc. Likely something close to Britian, France, etc.

However, both Ireland and Spain are coming up fast on the rails. Ireland seems to have had its fill of sectarianism and now has a very rosy economic future. Priests in general have not served them well. Spain, too, rushing into the 21st century, has been kicking Cardinals out of their cosy positions of influence in the state, and getting a proper quantity of women into political power, which should ensure they don't make the same mistake again. Oh Joy.

Sebastien and BW are right about Canada. It is a glorious piece of Europe set in fabulous American countryside. My first visit there last December was a delight. Cultured, intelligent, quietly self-confident, they took to my unarguable talents straight away. Such good taste!

310. These dim-wits believe in anything but God

Comment #181798 by phil rimmer on May 18, 2008 at 9:28 am

Bergson

A teacher friend of mine is most up to speed on this. I'll get the latest and best off him and post links here. Its been 6 months or more since I did any work. In the mean time I'll dig up what I've got.

311. Richard Dawkins Responds to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #181792 by phil rimmer on May 18, 2008 at 9:18 am

"clearmind"

Punishment of possessed children or other wrong applications of some people who claim they act on behalf of God or holy books, will not bring any harm to the truth of God.

Got your priorities straight then. No harm done to the truth of God. Phew! Oh and where did the quotes around "possessed" go? Don't tell me child possession is a possibility!....Is it?

312. These dim-wits believe in anything but God

Comment #181770 by phil rimmer on May 18, 2008 at 7:47 am

Rtambree

Sure, learn about it, but not three hours a week for every school year throughout highschool. That's too much time to devote to Bronze Age hocus pocus.

I agree if that is how it remains. BUT, I have been pushing for ages for the adoption of philosophy as a proper subject for adoption by schools from primary upwards. There is a strong "philosophy in schools" movement both in Europe and the US but not as yet mainstream. I have seen their excellent materials in use and tried the stuff on my own kids, with great success. The key concept is to develop critical thinking skills for quite general application. Essential for all, surely?

This would be a great opportunity to put critical thinking skills into an under-utilised slot in the school timetable

313. Face to faith

Comment #181730 by phil rimmer on May 18, 2008 at 4:57 am

This is very welcoming. However, humanism, as a secular western moral outlook, derives from 2000 years of Christianity.

Real atheism should be taught to school children, an atheism which is amoral as it is atheist; as well as humanism.

This is substantially correct, if a little compressed. Humanism, is a mongrel and in its roots can trace a line back through the renaissance, through Islam to axial age Greek thought but also out sideways a long way. Latterly, through the Enlightenment, though ideas of atheism were starting to be philosophically justifiable, it was mainly through dissenting religious groups that an enhanced moral "philosophy" was being developed and applied to peoples daily lives. (I think people often have a false idea of how cultural ideas spread. That positions of atheism could then be justified is meaningless to 99.9% of the population. Hume, or more pertinently, the writings of Solon etc. are substantially irrelevant at this time.) This enhanced moral "philosophy" derives as much from the junking of irrational Christian Dogma as by the realization that we have a natural and innate moral capacity and that by and large it is a capacity that all share. The "Inner Light" of the Quakers, though still God Given, was personal and guiding and more to be trusted than any scripture. By the mid nineteenth century there were as many non-conformist Christians as a Anglicans. The myriad dissenting groups offered choice in reflecting your moral position, quite as much as your views on the niceties of the Trinity.

It also shouldn't be forgotten that through the industrial revolution a great proportion of the industrialists, scientists and thinkers (often one and the same) possessed, or adopted, Dissenting or Non-conformist views. Many of these entrepreneurs implemented enlightened work practises involving the provision of homes and education, realizing the quid pro quo needed to enhance productivity. The result was a spectacular win-win that made Britain a Global Superpower for nearly a century.

Humanism became possible in any substantial way not because of the rightness of Hume's arguments but because a general zeitgeist of dissention from dogma and authority was clearly and visibly successful and that no moral vacuum occurred. Further the path to dissention would not have been possible were the core ideas not available in the Christian Dogma itself. It should be no surprise that Christian thinking should have picked up some of the Axial Age ideas and embedded them. The fact that those ideas were potentially self-destructive to the Dogma itself might explain why Popes were paranoid about any form of dissention whatsoever. Pull the wrong thread out and the whole lot falls to pieces.

Atheism is amoral. However, my choice to identify as an atheist (having counted myself an agnostic before) was entirely for reasons to do with pursuing a MORE moral life. It is a statement of where I DO NOT get my morals from. Obedience in moral matters is merely obedience and fits no one in making the daily, nuanced moral judgments that modern life calls for.

EDITED to remove a "not"

314. Richard Dawkins Responds to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #181628 by phil rimmer on May 17, 2008 at 5:45 pm

clearlymindless

Atheist people with sick mind are able to do anything since they have no fear of God and Judgement day.

All the police and judges will be pissed off that sick minded atheists have no fear of them.

Sick minded religites however feel that they can act as judge and jury, knowing as they do, the true mind of god. The punishments they inflict upon "possessed" children, for instance, are perhaps the purest form of evil I know.

Only fundamentalist religites get to feel that they are above the petty laws of this world.

315. The amazing intelligence of crows

Comment #181622 by phil rimmer on May 17, 2008 at 5:22 pm

Quine,

The wiki entry
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_(parrot)

is a good quick intro to Alex.

316. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #181603 by phil rimmer on May 17, 2008 at 4:05 pm

Do you by any chance think that the vast majority of scientists who consider evolution by natural selection to be fact have been deluded by the devil and have the number 666 stamped on their foreheads?

Ahem. 616 actually (Some monk or other screwed up it seems. Christians don't have a good record with maths.)

317. These dim-wits believe in anything but God

Comment #181597 by phil rimmer on May 17, 2008 at 3:50 pm

My sceptical son seems to be doing extremely well in RE at the moment. His main passion is writing fiction, at which he excels. To get him started on this path I taught him the Tom Lehrer Theory of research,

"Plagiarize, plagiarize,
No, don't shade your eyes..." etc.

Now every lesson is grist to his mill with RE being top. His stories do have more than their fair share of megalomaniacs, however.

318. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #181590 by phil rimmer on May 17, 2008 at 3:29 pm

txpiper.

Read some of the books/links suggested! To not even know the standard explanations for these questions and still challenge with third party nonsense is decidedly trollish.

Perhaps you'd like to explain how anything that supports fidelity in replication actually improves outlook for supposed evolutionary development by way of mutations

Mutation rates can be too low or too high to ensure species survival. Too low and a new environmental challenge may not be adequately dealt with by a problem solving mutation in time. Too high and infant mortality rates become unsustainable, even though the environmental challenge is met with ease. There is every likelihood that the mutation rate is itself subject selection and may therefore become optimized.

319. Richard Dawkins Interview on TVOntario

Comment #181579 by phil rimmer on May 17, 2008 at 2:46 pm

PJG

Being caught on CCTV doesn't result in eternal torment... most of the time it doesn't even result in a slapped wrist. Let's face it, Hell fire and damnation, if you believe in it, is likely to deter bad behaviour more effectively than an ASBO -

You're right. So lets shift the branding round a bit. Its Your mum you're going to disappoint. You have to imagine the adverts. There she is, holding the lace to one side, peering at the screen, her kindly face framed with bunched white hair, her eyes, huge behind the glasses, filled with tears. Her lips tremble as she whispers "No, darling, please don't....Don't throw your life away!" Cut to the scene she's watching. You drunkenly finish the bottle of lager and throw it, narrowly missing the passing Nun carrying a stray kitten. It smashes, and your sobbing mum suddenly clutches her heart, where your mortal blow has just landed.

Depending on the time of night and the particular yobs targeted, you have several endings, all over the same image of the little old lady slumping to the floor clutching her chest-

1.(kindly voice): "Remember, every Guardian may be someone's mother."

2.(Harsh cockney voice): "Watch it! Or the Old Lady gets it!"

3. (Pious voice): "Must she die for your sins?"

There, much more personal and flexible than a religion!

320. Richard Dawkins Interview on TVOntario

Comment #181561 by phil rimmer on May 17, 2008 at 1:19 pm

If anyone needs to be watched to make sure they behave well, then "not being watched" doesn't suddenly turn them into mature, empathic, rational and altruistic people. If religious people say they need God to watch them and make them behave in an acceptable manner, then maybe we do need religion - sadly.

Problem solved in the UK where we have more cameras watching us than anywhere else on the planet. That should halt any moral slippage. The reasonable argument that there are not enough moral guardians to watch all the screens connected to these cameras is being dealt with by a new government initiative called "Lace Curtain".

Lace Curtain seeks to co-opt the great moral force languishing in Britain's Old People's homes, to whit, Little Old Ladies. The provision of free monitor screens in each "Guardian's" room plus the use of clever software and interface devices (twitch sensitive curtains over the screens, combined with tap sensing and voice recognition of key phrases like, "'Ere, just stop that young man!") should provide a naturally graded alarm system to suitably alert the authorities to the actions of miscreants.

The associate ad campaign "Mother is still Watching" should put a stop to future moral lassitude and should prove far more effective than Our Father or Big Brother ever could be.

:-)

321. Richard Dawkins Responds to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #181542 by phil rimmer on May 17, 2008 at 11:44 am

RD

I therefore reproduce the whole article by Roger Friedman here, without comment.

Ouch! 'Nuff said...

322. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #181531 by phil rimmer on May 17, 2008 at 11:09 am

Tx

The actual error rate is more in the region of one in a million to one in a billion.

Yeah. Often! Or rather often enough.

323. These dim-wits believe in anything but God

Comment #181508 by phil rimmer on May 17, 2008 at 10:25 am

Henri

Solution: Rename & alter, 'Religious Studies' to 'Elementary Philosophy & Religion'.

Spot on!

I have proposed elsewhere that churches should see it as bad form to for children (of primary school age, through to 13 or so, for instance) to be made to join in with their services. Such children should be offered a simultaneous Sunday-school-type session of philosophy and comparative religion (inevitably with an added sprinkling of love and niceness). I think more enlightened churches may see the moral superiority of this approach, (the informed faith of its new young adult congregation being preferable to the mindless indoctrination of the kids at the rabble rousing church down the road.)

Slowly does it.

324. Americans pray at the pump for cheaper petrol

Comment #179385 by phil rimmer on May 13, 2008 at 7:32 am

Phasmagigas.

I too find reactions weird when wanting to walk in the US. This reminded me irresistibly of Ray Bradbury's The Pedestrian. Of which a little clip....

'Your name?' said the police car in a metallic whisper. He couldn't see the men in it for the bright light in his eyes.
'Leonard Mead,' he said.
'Speak up!'
'Leonard Mead!'
Business or profession?'
'I guess you'd call me a writer.'
No profession,' said the police car, as if talking to itself. The light held him fixed, like a museum specimen, needle thrust through chest.
'You might say that,' said Mr Mead.
He hadn't written in years. Magazines and books didn't sell anymore. Everything went on in the tomb-like houses at night now, he thought, continuing his fancy. The tombs, ill-lit by television light, where the people sat like the dead, the gray or multi-colored lights touching their faces, but never really touching them.
'No profession,' said the phonograph voice, hissing. 'What are you doing out?'
'Walking,' said Leonard Mead.
'Walking!'
'Just walking,' he said simply, but his face felt cold.
'Walking, just walking, walking?'
'Yes, sir.'
'Walking where? For what?'
'Walking for air. Walking to see.'
'Your address!'
'Eleven South Saint James Street.'
'And there is air in your house, you have an air conditioner, Mr Mead?'
Yes.'
'And you have a viewing screen in your house to see with?'
'No.
'No?' There was a crackling quiet that in itself was an accusation.

325. Americans pray at the pump for cheaper petrol

Comment #179318 by phil rimmer on May 13, 2008 at 5:37 am

Tyler,

My point was that you contradicted yourself. People ARE demanding more efficient cars, hence Toyota's success. But GM et al have failed to respond adequately.

326. Americans pray at the pump for cheaper petrol

Comment #179312 by phil rimmer on May 13, 2008 at 5:30 am

Tyler

if American consumers demanded better mileage from the cars they buy, the US Auto industry would comply...

So, how will this "demand" express itself?

Tyler

I think Toyota overtook GM recently as the largest share in US car sales due to Toyota's far superior gas mileage/reliability.

Erm?

327. On Fitna, the Movie

Comment #179227 by phil rimmer on May 12, 2008 at 11:38 pm

Barry Pearson confided: Our plans are no longer secret:

Sweet Hitchens! They know about our army of Mechanoids too? And the secret base?!

We'd best just turn in our brain cells and give up.

328. On Fitna, the Movie

Comment #179010 by phil rimmer on May 12, 2008 at 11:40 am

"New Dawkins Church of Unbelief"

Wash your mouth out, Barry Pearson! And go straight to bed. As penance you can say ten Heil Darwins.

The religites must not know our secret plans or they will tease us mercilessly about our True Faith.

329. 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'

Comment #178880 by phil rimmer on May 12, 2008 at 7:30 am

I want to hear the voice of reason, loud and clear from the Muslim communities, from children through parents to rabbi's and beyond,

Rabbis?

330. 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'

Comment #178538 by phil rimmer on May 11, 2008 at 2:56 pm

RamziD

Who would that be, though? god?

Er...no.

331. Atheists are nice people who will roast in hell, says Cardinal

Comment #178533 by phil rimmer on May 11, 2008 at 2:48 pm

If faulty reasoning can still reasonably be described as the PROCESS of reasoning, albeit with unreasonable data, methodologies etc., is it reasonable to call it REASON?

Clue: No.

Fido, I'm glad to see you've stayed clear of that mischievous little tit at number 105. The naughty stuff she comes out with. Corroboration indeed! You're well out of THAT, Old Faithful, old boy.

EDITED to remove an able from reasonable.

332. 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'

Comment #178506 by phil rimmer on May 11, 2008 at 2:04 pm

RamziD

I'm not a violent person, but given the opportunity I would gladly take the life of this miserable piece of human existence if I had the chance to.

But the guy is sick. He's been poisoned. Find the poisoner. Fuck HIM over.

333. 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'

Comment #178487 by phil rimmer on May 11, 2008 at 1:43 pm

Nairb

I think muslims in europe behave and actually are more civilised then many muslims in dysfunctional countries.I am sure it is not just fear of jail.

I'm sure you are right. I'm sure you will find that those countries that seek to prevent or reduce Muslim ghettoization will have fewer honour killings. A policy of deliberate dilution of the narrow cultural message that multiculturalism enabled now seems a good way forward in the UK.

334. 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'

Comment #178450 by phil rimmer on May 11, 2008 at 12:53 pm

Leila said: She was killed by animals

No, she was killed by the various Imams, Marjas and Mullahs who refuse to take the specific Hex of Intolerance off their people, because it serves them too well.

335. 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'

Comment #178434 by phil rimmer on May 11, 2008 at 12:13 pm

I had the support of all my friends who are fathers, like me, and know what she did was unacceptable to any Muslim that honours his religion.

Barry: By his standards, this was a MORAL act.

And this is why Diacanu can search his own brain and fail to find a scintilla of common feeling with the guy. Were it not for the cultural poison poured in his ear, this man would struggle to find such ideas in his own head. As would any of us.

This is the result of a wicked (possibly consciously derived, certainly consciously maintained) meme aimed at promoting an iron-clad faith.

On acting morally: I chose to define myself as an Atheist, having been a wishy-washy Agnostic, precisely to make a statement about my acceptance of MY moral responsibility for all my actions. It royally pisses me off that religites have the gall to confuse which of the two of us is the more civilised.

336. My Response to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #178162 by phil rimmer on May 10, 2008 at 4:23 pm

The real problem here is that Boteach, who is a an ignorant demagogue, manages to score points again by appealing to the anti-Israel sentiment, and getting the pro-Israel (or even less anti-Israel) people to gather against "Rude atheist Richard Dawkins and his antisemitic cronies" (regardless of whether they are in fact anti-Semites or just misinformed).

Yes, but, not using the ideal example of ignorant demagoguery to show just how dangerous and irresponsible it can be, is exactly the kind of spurious respectful handling that we have seen already in religion. The never-go-there dogma of Hitler-is-Praeternatural-Evil-personified is itself a great potential evil for the reasons I gave earlier.

For someone dedicated to questioning the unquestionable, to flunk out over this would be curious indeed.

I believe RD neither "mis-spoke" nor "smeared". The collateral damage of being misreported or misunderstood are par for the course.

EDITED to remove the impression that Hitler dogma is in anyway religious dogma.

337. My Response to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #178150 by phil rimmer on May 10, 2008 at 3:47 pm

Phil: "Mel Brooks was the first to kick this disgusting little man in the nuts."

Really? I think that Charlie Chaplin got in there almost three decades earlier with 'The Great Dictator'.

The first post-Holocaust kick in the nuts is the point, i.e., after Hitler was elevated to his current mystical status, akin to Beelzebub. Chaplin's brilliant film was 1940. Hitler, though clearly mad, bad and dangerous, was still human then.

EDITED added mad, bad description.

338. My Response to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #177785 by phil rimmer on May 9, 2008 at 5:31 pm

DalaiDrivel

Tossers useful image made me realize that Boteach was indeed behaving like a whore and possibly didn't realize it. :-)

339. My Response to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #177779 by phil rimmer on May 9, 2008 at 5:15 pm

tosser

"Hey, your wife's lipstick is the same color whores wear...What? You're offended? How? I was just comparing colors."

But what if your intention is to say, "Your wife looks like a whore....Don't you think you should tell her? Someone might get the wrong impression." This would be particularly appropriate if addressed to a vicar.

Lying or ignorant demagogues are (intentionally or unintentionally, respectively) a major source of great evil in the world. If Boteach is the former, he deserves all he got here and more. If he is merely the latter he needs to see himself clearly and the very great risk he runs, not least the hugely inappropriate impression he creates in some of his audience.

Finally, Hitler. Whilst Hitler is the archetypal evil man, invoking him or some aspect of him is not to invoke Beelzebub. He was "merely" a very very bad man. I am decidedly nervous about keeping the deeply grievous wound inflicted on the Jewish people by Hitler quite so quiveringly fresh that he cannot even be used as an example of evil or dangerous behaviour.

A couple of my Jewish friends have, indeed, worried that his psychopathology cannot be discussed because of this inverted form of reverence. It has to stop.

Mel Brooks was the first to kick this disgusting little man in the nuts. We have to understand his ordinariness if we are to learn to avoid the trap of thinking or behaving like him.

EDIT Quotes round merely added

340. My Response to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #177463 by phil rimmer on May 9, 2008 at 6:20 am

Banshee doesn't cut it. A lying demagogue is needed for the point.

So who?

341. My Response to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #177446 by phil rimmer on May 9, 2008 at 5:31 am

But comparing Shmuly Schmuck with Hitler, in whatever way, was uncalled for because it does diminish the enormity of the crimes of the Nazis.

Care to put some logic with that?

342. My Response to Rabbi Shmuley Boteach

Comment #177416 by phil rimmer on May 9, 2008 at 4:18 am

I'm not always 100% behind RD. But today he has been pitch perfect.

Styrer is entirely wrong (IMHO) in wanting a fuller rebuttal of Boteach's arguments.

The elegance of the "shrieking equals ignorance" and "Hitler was ignorant" is a wonderful double whammy of a point. Elaboration is not needed.

The shrieking like Hitler comment originally was spot on in trying to bring Boteach up short and get him to consider what he is doing.

Go and read some books about evolution, learn something about biology, and you'll then find that you can talk about it in a calm and civilised voice.

Slamdunk.

Styrer, EDITED to add the very necessary IMHO.

343. Faith in Britain today

Comment #177386 by phil rimmer on May 9, 2008 at 2:07 am

He said that the regimes of Hitler and Stalin were ruled by REASON....But I think this is the first time I have heard any reputable spokesman (a) say that Hitler and Stalin's dictatorships were ruled by reason and (b) say that reason leads to terror and oppression.
Richard

I must have been brushing my teeth through this bit. This is deeply shocking.

344. Faith in Britain today

Comment #177381 by phil rimmer on May 9, 2008 at 2:01 am

Did he really say 'no, I was praying'? Or am I not in on some joke?

No joke! He really did say it. But little else besides.

I think Humphry's atheist/religious apologist sinews had been stiffened a little by RD's stern "talking to". But alas not enough. The necessary debate on the need for a secular society (whatever personal faiths may be) wasn't enjoined, shafted as it was by wooliness and imprecision on both sides.

345. Faith in Britain today

Comment #177337 by phil rimmer on May 8, 2008 at 11:48 pm

Whatever we're paying Dawkins, it's probably not enough. Srsly.

The man is pure gold!

346. Faith in Britain today

Comment #177333 by phil rimmer on May 8, 2008 at 11:37 pm

Richards performance was masterful. Kept it devastatingly simple and effective. Targeting Humphrys was particularly pertinent given his personal role in failing to call the religious to account for their intrusion into the public space. Humphrys was speechless.

347. Faith in Britain today

Comment #177149 by phil rimmer on May 8, 2008 at 4:53 pm

Is it a defective gene?

Perhaps, but it can cut both ways.

I've always thought of the Irish as the quintessential Storytellers. So many do it professionally. Poets, playwrights, novelists, Cardinals...

348. Faith in Britain today

Comment #177137 by phil rimmer on May 8, 2008 at 4:25 pm

Richard,

I hope you're safely tucked up in bed now but if not....

Have you ever met anyone who believes what Richard Dawkins doesn't believe in? I usually find that the God that is being rejected by such people is a God I don't believe in either. I simply don't recognise my faith in what is presented by these critics as Christian faith.

This is key for me. In the US there are many such people as you rightly rail against. The astonishing attacks against science and reason are formulated by just such people. Its getting worse.

We must take a stand lest it happens here. Invite the Good Cardinal to join you in roundly condemning this faith driven nonsense like, Collins and Miller.

EDIT Just seen the stuff for religion not being a private matter. And Coylus's post. Removed some of my post.

This guy is the enemy. This increasingly feels like war.

349. Losing Our Spines to Save Our Necks

Comment #175458 by phil rimmer on May 5, 2008 at 1:07 pm

Al

e.g.
"Alcoholism and absentee fathers are a huge problem in the African American community"

I often engage such tough issues using the outspoken comments of someone within the respective community first. In effect, I am not breaking a taboo here. It has already been broken by X.


This is Chris Rock on a more general but related issue to deadbeat dads. The key for me is the wonderful audience reaction. Some taboo is broken and a glorious positive statement is made.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpUSElgJcyI

EDIT. Sorry have just lost half of this post it seems. Didn't copy all of it to the clipboard. Will reconstruct after domestic duties....

350. Evolution's Critics Shift Tactics With Schools

Comment #175228 by phil rimmer on May 5, 2008 at 12:41 am

moderndaythomas

Talisker.

But you're welcome if you've a taste for it.